Everything Bargnani: Grumble, Grumble, Grumble

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StaytheCourse wrote:

Fickle group these Raptor fans! When others were calling for his head I felt he could still contribute if the role was changed.

Two games doesn't prove me right but I am sure of this he can contribute some time somewhere. Toronto better get something good in return if they do let him go!

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This what Ive been trying to say as well. It seems a lot of these Raps fans get so emotional that they lose focus on the bigger picture.
Like people have been saying, this is a new team and Bargs has a new role. We shouldnt just get rid of the guy just for the sake of getting rid of him. He might still contribute to this team and who knows, he might just prove all the haters wrong.

Honestly I didn't think he played that great. I absolutely HATE when he leaves his man to go chase someone and attempt a double team. It always fails and they easily get it to his man for the easy bucket. The best part of his game last night was that he didn't shoot 20 times. #tradebargnani

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Dunk wrote:

Honestly I didn't think he played that great. I absolutely HATE when he leaves his man to go chase someone and attempt a double team. It always fails and they easily get it to his man for the easy bucket. The best part of his game last night was that he didn't shoot 20 times. #tradebargnani

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Bargnani is not the enemy, actually he is one of our most talented players. With the addition of gay, the maturity of the team, and his maturity as far as his expectations go I think we have a situation where he can flourish. I predict a break out game for him against the hornets on Sunday.

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Matt52 wrote:

Same post as above:

Bargnani continues to prove the theory of the fine line between love and hate.

I want to cheer for him. Deep down I actually want him to stay in Toronto because I know he can be a very good player to add to the mix - especially off the bench. But I can't do it because we've been down this road waaaaay too many times. The bar keeps getting lowered and he impresses for a while until we have to lower the bar again. There will come a time when he gets bored or whatever it is that causes the switch to flip to OFF and I am not sure the bar can get much lower than it currently is for a guy making $11M/$12M the next 2 years. Plus, I think we are at the point where we can wonder if he is injury prone.

It is with a heavy heart I type #tradeBargnani despite the satisfaction from the last 2 games.

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Agreed

1,000,000+ views have hit ladies and gentlemen!

CEL......EBRATE GOOD TIMES. C'MON!

Hes a nice NEUTRAL guy, who is hard to hate, but easy to dislike as a player. That's why he has to go.

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pcrombeen wrote:

Bargnani's gotta go. Two decent shooting games do not negate the previous 7 years.

Here's a trade I would love:

Utah: Bargnani, Derozan
Toronto: Milsap, Mo Williams

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine

Utah might do this trade if they don't want to pay Milsap what he'll get in free agency. Still, Favors is their guy at PF, so I'm not sure how they would feel about a three man rotation with Bargnani coming off the bench. As for Derozan, Utah is desperate for scoring on the wing, though it would depend how they view Derozan's value post contract extension.

From Toronto's perspective, this trade would obviously by contingent on Milsap signing an extension (Mo could walk at the end of the season and I still love this deal). Even if we slightly overpay for Milsap, better to pay him 12-14M a season, than Bargnani and Derozan 20-22 combined.

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Some people need to educate themselves a little before suggesting pie in the shy trade proposals. It's NOT possible to sign Millsap to an extension. Any trade for him carries the very real risk that he walks on July 1st. Williams could do the same, so you think trading Bargs and DD for 2 month rentals is a good plan?

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Dunk wrote:

Honestly I didn't think he played that great. I absolutely HATE when he leaves his man to go chase someone and attempt a double team. It always fails and they easily get it to his man for the easy bucket. The best part of his game last night was that he didn't shoot 20 times. #tradebargnani

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"I absolutely HATE when he leaves his man to go chase someone and attempt a double team."

That's part of the defensive system that he's doing under instruction, not him taking random risks roaming freely like Lowry does.

"It always fails and they easily get it to his man for the easy bucket."

Always? Simply not true, but if you knew anything about the game, you'd know that many teams do that as part of their scheme, and accept that they'll get burned once in a while. That we have a 7 footer that's mobile enough to do that and not get burned too often (good rotations by other teammates helps).

Every team hoping to contend for a title needs a big three. Toronto was always missing a true SF in the 7 years Bargnani was in tdot which forced him to play out of his role and try to create his own offence knowing there was nobody else there to take that pressure off him. Now that we finally have a true SF who can creat shots and take pressure off Derozan and Bargnani we should finally be able to see Bargnani flurish and dominate as a second or third option where he won't be the primary focus of other teams defence. We finally have an assemblance of a big three in Gay, Derozan and Bargnani let the good times rollllllll.

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northgrantballer wrote:

I can't help but to notice opinions forming by people who promised themselves they would not form them. When Bargnani was out, raptors nation basically had torches and pitchforks walking towards the seven footer, promising ourselves that when he came back to not be deceived by quality play, and to only let him increase his trade value. Now, after a couple games, people are returning to the more conservative-minded thoughts of "Oh well he is a valuable piece and we can't trade him now".

Where do you guys stand on trading him now?

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forreal..

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DunkinDerozan wrote:

Every team hoping to contend for a title needs a big three. Toronto was always missing a true SF in the 7 years Bargnani was in tdot which forced him to play out of his role and try to create his own offence knowing there was nobody else there to take that pressure off him. Now that we finally have a true SF who can creat shots and take pressure off Derozan and Bargnani we should finally be able to see Bargnani flurish and dominate as a second or third option where he won't be the primary focus of other teams defence. We finally have an assemblance of a big three in Gay, Derozan and Bargnani let the good times rollllllll.

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Let's not get carried away. The last thing he needs right now is to envision himself as some kind of elite player. He is the backup 4 whose role is to score 10-15 efficient points and be in sync defensively. The guy he's playing behind rebounds, plays defense, scores at an efficient clip and since the trade of ED has brought his play to a new level. Let Andrea settle into his 6th man role and see if he can make a positive contribution on a consistent basis.

When everyone called for trading him over the past 2 months, the best case scenario would've been that he comes back and plays well to up his value. He's doing that now...so why not capitalize on it? Why wait another season to see if it works out and risk losing that value?

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nubreed000 wrote:

When everyone called for trading him over the past 2 months, the best case scenario would've been that he comes back and plays well to up his value. He's doing that now...so why not capitalize on it? Why wait another season to see if it works out and risk losing that value?

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+1

Although I not sure HOW much he's raised his value as of now. IF there's a good deal on the table, aka shedding salary, getting young players/picks or a legit starting PF you trade bargs. NO QUESTION. However, I don't think you have to trade him because I do believe that as long as he's coming off the bench he can be an effective player, and a good trade might come in the off season or even next year. We aren't doing anything this year even if we trade bargs so I don't see the harm in letting him play the season out.

Not sure I'm big on the boozer trade unless we are getting some good picks back.

Bargnani still needs to be traded. If you thought Amir Johnson or Landry Fields was overpaid (at time of signing), then this guy breaks the barrier well and beyond.

By the end of this season he will have stolen $48M from the Toronto Raptors, where his peak value comes from the 13 game mirage and now, a decent offensive big man off the bench. He'll be paid $11M next year to be such a bench player.

The moment there is an opportunity to trade for a starter, he has to go.

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ebrian wrote:

Bargnani still needs to be traded. If you thought Amir Johnson or Landry Fields was overpaid (at time of signing), then this guy breaks the barrier well and beyond.

By the end of this season he will have stolen $48M from the Toronto Raptors, where his peak value comes from the 13 game mirage and now, a decent offensive big man off the bench. He'll be paid $11M next year to be such a bench player.

The moment there is an opportunity to trade for a starter, he has to go.

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+1

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ezz_bee wrote:

+1

Although I not sure HOW much he's raised his value as of now. IF there's a good deal on the table, aka shedding salary, getting young players/picks or a legit starting PF you trade bargs. NO QUESTION. However, I don't think you have to trade him because I do believe that as long as he's coming off the bench he can be an effective player, and a good trade might come in the off season or even next year. We aren't doing anything this year even if we trade bargs so I don't see the harm in letting him play the season out.

Not sure I'm big on the boozer trade unless we are getting some good picks back.

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Agreed no need to trade him unless a good deal presents itself. As a second or third option he can be a lethal weapon.

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pcrombeen wrote:

Bargnani's gotta go. Two decent shooting games do not negate the previous 7 years.

Here's a trade I would love:

Utah: Bargnani, Derozan
Toronto: Milsap, Mo Williams

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine

Utah might do this trade if they don't want to pay Milsap what he'll get in free agency. Still, Favors is their guy at PF, so I'm not sure how they would feel about a three man rotation with Bargnani coming off the bench. As for Derozan, Utah is desperate for scoring on the wing, though it would depend how they view Derozan's value post contract extension.

From Toronto's perspective, this trade would obviously by contingent on Milsap signing an extension (Mo could walk at the end of the season and I still love this deal). Even if we slightly overpay for Milsap, better to pay him 12-14M a season, than Bargnani and Derozan 20-22 combined.

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Under no circumstances (unless it was resulting in a superstar calibre player) should the Raptors consider trading Derozan in a deal with Bargnani. Demar is NOT the problem. I honestly get the feeling that you must have a personal issue with Demar because that could really be the only justification for including him in a trade to Utah that only really gets us Milsap and a back up pg. I am in utter shock.

Incase you haven't realized, Demar is a legit starting calibre 2 guard (Gay said he's the best he's every played with) with the real potential to develop even more facets of his game to make him even better. For all of Demar's flaws, he still has shown significant improvement from his rookie campaign and has become very effective in what he does. Trading Bargnani is needed, either now, or at the end of the season, but trading Derozan should not even be discussed in joke right now. Maybe at the end of next season, if TRoss explodes into a player with James Harden level impact off the bench then we can consider moving Demar, but not now, and not ever for Milsap. I am actually disgusted at the idea...utterly disgusted.

Ya...i really have no idea why you guys would want to do such a ridiculous deal. Until T Ross truly proves that he is good enough to take over, it is not wise to just trade DeRozan. That deal is so lop sided its not even funny, We're basically giving up our second best wing player for a fringe all star and a backup pg. DeRozan is also considered a fringe all star IMO, i would be surprised if he doesn't make it in the next 2 seasons.

Decided to have my historic 1,111th post on a historic 1,000,000 view thread!!

Viva La Vida!

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ebrian wrote:

Bargnani still needs to be traded. If you thought Amir Johnson or Landry Fields was overpaid (at time of signing), then this guy breaks the barrier well and beyond.

By the end of this season he will have stolen $48M from the Toronto Raptors, where his peak value comes from the 13 game mirage and now, a decent offensive big man off the bench. He'll be paid $11M next year to be such a bench player.

The moment there is an opportunity to trade for a starter, he has to go.

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100% agree, only wouldn't we get a much better return on him when he's an expiring contract and packaged with a draft pick? Another year of him makes me want to gnaw on my coffee table, but if you take emotion out of it, BC would be wise to use his expiring contract snag another good player in Rudy Gay's situation (i.e. on a team looking to shed long-term salary).

Just a thought. My first post, by the way. Been lurking for over a year. Cheers!