Chisholm: What to do about the C position? Forget Tyson Chandler (212)

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Matt52 wrote:

He could be setting up the opening bid.

Look at what starting C's in the league make. Hell look what C's on the bench make.

He'll be getting much more than $9M per season.

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It's possible that Gasol really loves Memphis. He does live there, and went to school there. He's looking at his team and the potential it has.. he could be taking a potential salary hit just so he can play where he wants and to give more cap space to the team going forward so that they can keep a player like Gay or sign another FA in the future.

Gasol could make more than 12 million a year if he wanted to. If he signs with Memphis for 9 then he's doing it for the team, not for himself.

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planetmars wrote:

It's possible that Gasol really loves Memphis. He does live there, and went to school there. He's looking at his team and the potential it has.. he could be taking a potential salary hit just so he can play where he wants and to give more cap space to the team going forward so that they can keep a player like Gay or sign another FA in the future.

Gasol could make more than 12 million a year if he wanted to. If he signs with Memphis for 9 then he's doing it for the team, not for himself.

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I'm not arguing with you but he could want out for all those reasons as well.

I've read rumours both he wants to stay and he wants to leave.... who knows.

I definitely agree he could make more than $9M a year and if he takes $9M to stay in MEM then you are most definitely right.

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planetmars wrote:

It's possible that Gasol really loves Memphis. He does live there, and went to school there. He's looking at his team and the potential it has.. he could be taking a potential salary hit just so he can play where he wants and to give more cap space to the team going forward so that they can keep a player like Gay or sign another FA in the future.

Gasol could make more than 12 million a year if he wanted to. If he signs with Memphis for 9 then he's doing it for the team, not for himself.

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Is he better than Noah?

I think what we need to do is:

1) sign a cheap defensive C (Kwame Brown, Joel Pryzbilla, Jason Collins) and start him; play him 25-30 min. a game.

2) trade Amir Johnson (though I love the guy but we have a log jam)

3) Play Ed Davis as starting PF and back up C giving him 25-30 min. a game

4) Play Bargnani as the back up PF (when the starting C sits move Ed davis to C position)

I think we gotta play Bargnani as a 6th man, make sure he gets his minutes but match him up against opposing teams' backup PF's to try and hide him defensively.

Throw Alabi into the mix too if he deserves it with limited minutes at C.

Raptors are stacked ... SAY NO TO TANKING!!!!!

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Hugmenot wrote:

This is very sad for me to read because I have serious doubts JV will ever be significantly better than MG and thus, our hopes of getting off the mediocrity treadmill rely entirely upon the Chosen One issuing forth from the 2012 draft.

Oh no!

It's a good thing I am used to your generally pessimist posts and can keep on smiling.

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I think you're the pessimist, here. I actually think Valanciunas can be a better player than Gasol. He's quicker, more athletic, a better rebounder and shotblocker. Considering where Gasol was at the same age, I'd rather bet on Valanciunas.

Besides, I've never been a pessimist. Not sure where you get that from. In fact, I've been accused, at times, of being too much of an optimist or homer. Personally, I consider myself a realist.

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malefax wrote:

There is no reason why paying 10 million a year for Marc Gasol would be a bad thing. A championship team could absolutely have that contract on its roster.

But the rumor that he is going to sign a 45 million contract with the Grizzlies strikes me as not credible at all. He is going to be paid more money than that.

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I agree that a Championship team paying Gasol $10 million is plausible. Unfortunately, the Raptors are nowhere near a Championship team and are far more than just him away from being one. And with Valanciunas coming next season, and a great draft coming up, I don't see the point of going after him.

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SuperRaptor wrote:

I think what we need to do is:

1) sign a cheap defensive C (Kwame Brown, Joel Pryzbilla, Jason Collins) and start him; play him 25-30 min. a game.

2) trade Amir Johnson (though I love the guy but we have a log jam)

3) Play Ed Davis as starting PF and back up C giving him 25-30 min. a game

4) Play Bargnani as the back up PF (when the starting C sits move Ed davis to C position)

I think we gotta play Bargnani as a 6th man, make sure he gets his minutes but match him up against opposing teams' backup PF's to try and hide him defensively.

Throw Alabi into the mix too if he deserves it with limited minutes at C.

Raptors are stacked ... SAY NO TO TANKING!!!!!

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You think the Raptors are stacked? Really? And are you not at all concerned that Bargnani has historically struggled whenever he's asked to come off the bench?

Do absolutely nothing. Keep Bargs in the middle, develop Ed Davis and let the top 3 picks come to us. For the first time in a long time, I actually want Bargs in this team. We need to be last real fast.

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slaw wrote:

It's because everything is about Bargnani. The development of both Ed Davis and, to a lesser extent, Amir Johnson, is subject to Bargnani. The decision of what kind of player they go after at the SF spot (more defense-rebounder or more scorer) is subject to Bargnani. It even appears that Valancunias' future (starter or backup to veteran centre) is to be dependant on Bargnani. Who you draft in 2012 is subject to Bargnani. These decisions, in turn, affect what you do at the guard spots and off the bench. It's madness. Madness! Argh!

Apologies for the rant but the moving goalposts on Bargnani drives me nuts. I sincerely hope this is all just speculation and management isn't really basing anything around Bargs but I fear the worst.

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I couldn't agree more.

Its why some people don't seem to understand why Bargnani gets so much attention. He IS being built around. Not with. Not like Amir or Bayless or Ed or even Derozan... but around. So many important roster and long term decisions are being made with him in mind. Even if its not as a 'legitimate franchise' player. He's still being built around, and if he doesn't suceed the team is, yet again, wasting resources. Wasting time.

If the team would just use him as 90% of the other players in the league are (a starter, a 6th man, a bench warmer, a SF, a C, trade bait whatever) instead of making everything fit around him. Make HIM fit somewhere instead. Oh man... I can't wait for that day.

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Tim W. wrote:

You think the Raptors are stacked? Really? And are you not at all concerned that Bargnani has historically struggled whenever he's asked to come off the bench?

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I think peoples predictions of the Raptors this season are overly pessimistic (raptors are stacked). In regards to Bargnani coming off the bench in the past his minutes were limited, I want him to play the role of Jamal Crawford and still get his 30-36 min. but have him do it on the 2nd squad.

apperantly the raps are pushing hard at luring Tyson Chandler as he seems to be on the way out of Dallas
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...eave_Mavericks

im hoping Chandler liked casey as much as Casey likes Chandler cause if so we might just have the C we should have had last season..

there are other teams interested & pushing hard too for him but from the teams listed on this article i see toronto as the best option for him... sure New jesey has D.Will but it has been mentioned that they were looking to sign guys to use as trad bait for D.Howard so would Tyson really what to take that chance... the other teams mentioned are no better off then us really so Casey might just be the difference maker

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DoNDaDDa wrote:

apperantly the raps are pushing hard at luring Tyson Chandler as he seems to be on the way out of Dallas
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...eave_Mavericks

im hoping Chandler liked casey as much as Casey likes Chandler cause if so we might just have the C we should have had last season..

there are other teams interested & pushing hard too for him but from the teams listed on this article i see toronto as the best option for him... sure New jesey has D.Will but it has been mentioned that they were looking to sign guys to use as trad bait for D.Howard so would Tyson really what to take that chance... the other teams mentioned are no better off then us really so Casey might just be the difference maker

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And what exactly would having Chandler have done last year for the Raptors, other than prevent them from getting Valanciunas?

every team needs a vet or two.. not sure he would have made that big a differance last year.. Trianos system was flawed.. but i was mearly saying we should have had him(if MJ didnt nix it). under casey we could be alot better then most think. chandler would be a huge boost to our defence for the next few years & to throw jonas in the fire his first year may be a mistake. i think itd be better to ease him in... he could back up for year or two. bigs usually take more time to develop too. im still not sold on him.. europe isnt the same as over here... NBA scrubs go over there & win MVPs. its really hard to take euro ball stats serious so ill reserve my judgment on jonas....

as for the draft next year... if we are crap & get a high pick then great but i would rather the guys play hard & win.. if we see progress with our young guys which i think we will, there wont be a top pick for us anyway.. maybe 10th

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DoNDaDDa wrote:

every team needs a vet or two.. not sure he would have made that big a differance last year.. Trianos system was flawed.. but i was mearly saying we should have had him(if MJ didnt nix it). under casey we could be alot better then most think. chandler would be a huge boost to our defence for the next few years & to throw jonas in the fire his first year may be a mistake. i think itd be better to ease him in... he could back up for year or two. bigs usually take more time to develop too. im still not sold on him.. europe isnt the same as over here... NBA scrubs go over there & win MVPs. its really hard to take euro ball stats serious so ill reserve my judgment on jonas....

as for the draft next year... if we are crap & get a high pick then great but i would rather the guys play hard & win.. if we see progress with our young guys which i think we will, there wont be a top pick for us anyway.. maybe 10th

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Tyson Chandler would instantly make our defense respectable, I would love to have him on the Raptors, but I dont think its gonna happen.

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SuperRaptor wrote:

I think peoples predictions of the Raptors this season are overly pessimistic (raptors are stacked). In regards to Bargnani coming off the bench in the past his minutes were limited, I want him to play the role of Jamal Crawford and still get his 30-36 min. but have him do it on the 2nd squad.

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You think the majority of Raptor fans as well as pretty much every media outlet is overly pessimistic about the Raptors chances? What was you prediction last season? And the season before that?

And you do realize that if Bargnani played 30-35 mpg, he'd still be playing mostly against starters.

As for Crawford, I don't know if he's really the one you want to start copying. I've never been fond of his game. And the Hawks will have trouble getting past the second round when they got a guy playing 30 mpg who can't defend a mannequin.

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DoNDaDDa wrote:

every team needs a vet or two.. not sure he would have made that big a differance last year.. Trianos system was flawed.. but i was mearly saying we should have had him(if MJ didnt nix it). under casey we could be alot better then most think.

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You think Triano's system was the problem last year, and not the fact that the Raptors simply were a team that was incredibly young and lacking in talent?

Too many guys give WAY too much credit and blame to coaches. There are MAYBE half a dozen NBA coaches that can actually make that much of a difference.

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DoNDaDDa wrote:

chandler would be a huge boost to our defence for the next few years & to throw jonas in the fire his first year may be a mistake. i think itd be better to ease him in... he could back up for year or two. bigs usually take more time to develop too. im still not sold on him.. europe isnt the same as over here... NBA scrubs go over there & win MVPs. its really hard to take euro ball stats serious so ill reserve my judgment on jonas....

as for the draft next year... if we are crap & get a high pick then great but i would rather the guys play hard & win.. if we see progress with our young guys which i think we will, there wont be a top pick for us anyway.. maybe 10th

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So you'd rather the team goes out and wins maybe 10 more games next year than they are predicted to? That's going to make you happy? Then what? Maybe become a mediocre team fighting for a playoff spot every year because they're simply not talented enough to be real contender? Haven't you had enough of that?

Seriously, I just don't understand this attitude, especially from a Raptor fan. Are you really that desperate to win a few games that you'd mortgage the future to do it?

As for Valanciunas, most people here aren't going on stats but actually watching him play. Stats in Europe mean about as much as NCAA stats when it comes to comparing them to the NBA, which is why you have to watch them actually play. And while NBA scrubs go over there and win MVP, good NBA players go over there and struggle. It's a different game. Some adapt, some don't.

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planetmars wrote:

It's possible that Gasol really loves Memphis. He does live there, and went to school there. He's looking at his team and the potential it has.. he could be taking a potential salary hit just so he can play where he wants and to give more cap space to the team going forward so that they can keep a player like Gay or sign another FA in the future.

Gasol could make more than 12 million a year if he wanted to. If he signs with Memphis for 9 then he's doing it for the team, not for himself.

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Just more potential proof that the league has not restricted the ability of players to play where they want.

Puffer

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SuperRaptor wrote:

I think peoples predictions of the Raptors this season are overly pessimistic (raptors are stacked). In regards to Bargnani coming off the bench in the past his minutes were limited, I want him to play the role of Jamal Crawford and still get his 30-36 min. but have him do it on the 2nd squad.

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The second squad doesn't get 30-36 minutes a game, the first squad does. I would love to see AB play 36 minutes a game against the other teams second string center, but he is usually only out there for 10 - 20 minutes.

Puffer

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Tim W. wrote:

I think you're the pessimist, here.

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Sure, I am pessimist about predicting stradom on teenagers who have yet to play one game against NBA type competition.

However, never I had said something like "we need to tank to give us a chance at drafting a franchise player because it is the only way we'll ever get out of this mediocrity", about the only consistent team message I read from you from the past 18 months.

You're a one-trick pony.

I think it's a great a idea. We don't have to throw Jonas into the fire right when he gets here. He can develope and learn from one best defensive centers in the league. It's the best time to get Chandler close to the end of his prime. Right when he starts declining which I think will be in two years. That's when you start Jonas and have a great 2 center rotation.