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Thread: Can someone explain something to me?

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    Default Can someone explain something to me?

    Can someone explain to me exactly why did BC not take the Bargnani and Lucas for Boozer and Robinson trade, run and never look back? Just curious after watching the Brooklyn/Bulls game where Boozer had 29 points and 18 rebounds and Robinson hit the game winning shot along with 12 points and 5 assists.

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    Quote Blacklash2k4 wrote: View Post
    Can someone explain to me exactly why did BC not take the Bargnani and Lucas for Boozer and Robinson trade, run and never look back? Just curious after watching the Brooklyn/Bulls game where Boozer had 29 points and 18 rebounds and Robinson hit the game winning shot along with 12 points and 5 assists.
    Because Bargnani is a rich mans Dirk Nowitzki with elite defense and John Lucas IIIS the second coming of mighty mouse. In all seriousness he probably was afraid of taking even more money in (Booze is making something like 18mil. per)

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    Raptors Republic Superstar iblastoff's Avatar
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    Because people have super short foresight and want to base a trade on one game?

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Because Colangelo is a goddamn retard
    @jerboat

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    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    The easy answer is that Bryan is an idiot, and I think that's partially true, but what scares me is that the board was not willing to go into luxury tax (which they had to do if they got Boozer).

    Why that's scary is because Bell/Rogers are one of the richest owners in all of sport yet only seem to be interested in their bottom line. If they would not be willing to go into luxury tax now, will they ever be willing to do it?

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    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    The easy answer is that Bryan is an idiot, and I think that's partially true, but what scares me is that the board was not willing to go into luxury tax (which they had to do if they got Boozer).

    Why that's scary is because Bell/Rogers are one of the richest owners in all of sport yet only seem to be interested in their bottom line. If they would not be willing to go into luxury tax now, will they ever be willing to do it?
    My bet is they own the Raptors solely to say they own the Raptors.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar heinz57's Avatar
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    Easy.

    Because if they got rid of Bargs and Lucas they would have never been able to secure that lucrative advertising contract for Diamond & Diamond Personal Injury Lawyers

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    My bet is because he believes/or believed he can make something else happen. Boozer is old, has a large salary that would further increase the likelihood of no other signings/trades (how many years left for that guy?) ,is a poor help defender, has had injury issues in the past.

    I am not a fan of boozer.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    I'm just curious but was that trade ever a real offer or just a rumored offer?
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    ebrian

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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    The easy answer is that Bryan is an idiot, and I think that's partially true, but what scares me is that the board was not willing to go into luxury tax (which they had to do if they got Boozer).

    Why that's scary is because Bell/Rogers are one of the richest owners in all of sport yet only seem to be interested in their bottom line. If they would not be willing to go into luxury tax now, will they ever be willing to do it?
    what's REALLY scary about this is they were willing to go ahead with the Rudy trade though, which put us on the precipice.
    @jerboat

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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Colangelo's moves (and non-moves) can be understood through two lenses: maneuver warfare; and the Red Queen Theory.

    In terms of maneuver warfare, Colangelo loves to stay active and continually make moves. He cleary values flexibility and the ability to adapt and change course. One of my complaints with Colangelo is his resistance to go "all-in". He wants the best of all worlds (winning, developing young players, maintaining some cap freedom). Sadly, instead of getting the best of all worlds, he's mostly got the worst. In fact, most of the activity has been busy work and amounts to the Raps running very fast (lots of roster turnover) to basically stay in exactly the same place (the Red Queen Theory part).

    There's something to be said for Colangelo's overall approach in terms of wanting to retain fliexibility and the ability to adapt on the fly and I'm not arguing it can't work. Unfortunately, the actual decision-making has largely been poor. Colangelo to me is like the mediocre chess player who has great strategy and understands the theory but, when it comes to actually playing, can't find the right move.

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    Quote slaw wrote: View Post
    Colangelo's moves (and non-moves) can be understood through two lenses: maneuver warfare; and the Red Queen Theory.

    In terms of maneuver warfare, Colangelo loves to stay active and continually make moves. He cleary values flexibility and the ability to adapt and change course. One of my complaints with Colangelo is his resistance to go "all-in". He wants the best of all worlds (winning, developing young players, maintaining some cap freedom). Sadly, instead of getting the best of all worlds, he's mostly got the worst. In fact, most of the activity has been busy work and amounts to the Raps running very fast (lots of roster turnover) to basically stay in exactly the same place (the Red Queen Theory part).

    There's something to be said for Colangelo's overall approach in terms of wanting to retain fliexibility and the ability to adapt on the fly and I'm not arguing it can't work. Unfortunately, the actual decision-making has largely been poor. Colangelo to me is like the mediocre chess player who has great strategy and understands the theory but, when it comes to actually playing, can't find the right move.
    so is it the right move or the wrong move? you didn't say.

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    I don't think the rumoured transaction(Boozer, Robinson for Bargnani, Lucas) was true. Considering they wanted to get under the cap, it's possible the proposed trade was heavily in Chicago's favour financially.

    My fear is that Boozer's solid performance might make Chicago change their mind about trading him.
    Attitude Is A Choice.

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    Raptors Republic Starter c_bcm's Avatar
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    Quote Blacklash2k4 wrote: View Post
    Can someone explain to me exactly why did BC not take the Bargnani and Lucas for Boozer and Robinson trade, run and never look back? Just curious after watching the Brooklyn/Bulls game where Boozer had 29 points and 18 rebounds and Robinson hit the game winning shot along with 12 points and 5 assists.
    What evidence do you have that this was even on the table?

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    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote c_bcm wrote: View Post
    What evidence do you have that this was even on the table?
    I'm shocked you ask...it was the closest to verified rumour out there, at least that I remember.

    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/ey...ever-they-want

    It was definitely coming from Chicago's end, but for people who wanted it to happen, that's all the more frustrating I think, since the ball was in BC's court.

    *And I believe the leak is real, because the timing of it smacked of Chicago's management trying to put public pressure on BC to take it.
    Last edited by white men can't jump; Sat Apr 6th, 2013 at 09:17 AM.

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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    I'm shocked you ask...it was the only verified rumour out there, at least that I remember.

    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/ey...ever-they-want
    I don't recall either organization ever confirming the rumor, just the Chicago Tribune reporter.

    I really think that the Raps didn't like the fact that the deal would put them in an even deeper financial hole. Plus, they'd become a luxury tax team in a season when playoffs were still a long-shot. I don't think they have an issue paying tax, but doing so with the repeater tax about to kick-in, to not be a playoff team... I think that was too big a risk, especially when the deal would likely still be available in the offseason (assuming it was there in the first place).

    The deal could still be done in the offseason, but Toronto would need to add $1,410,000 to the deal in addition to Bargnani's salary, in order for it to work under the CBA trade rules (ie: Lucas or Gray, if options are picked-up). For Toronto, the additional salary for Boozer next season compared to Bargnani ($15.3M - $10.75M = $4.55M), could essentially be offset by using amnesty on Kleiza ($4.6M). Considering another player would have to be added (ie: Lucas or Gray), the Raps could actually wind up with a net reduction of their total team salary through those 2 moves (but have 2 less players on their roster).

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    Quote heinz57 wrote: View Post
    Easy.

    Because if they got rid of Bargs and Lucas they would have never been able to secure that lucrative advertising contract for Diamond & Diamond Personal Injury Lawyers
    Good one....lol

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    Quote psrs1 wrote: View Post
    Good one....lol
    at the Wizard's game... one of the two Diamonds of Diamond and Diamond addressed the crowd. i'm not sure why, or what he said, i had beer, and was playing leg room wrestling with the douche beside me..

    but ya... that's where we are at as a franchise... an ambulance chaser can afford mic time at raps games

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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    so is it the right move or the wrong move? you didn't say.
    I have no idea..... You'd need to rethink the offense. Not enough ball to go around if you've got Gay/Derozan/Boozer out there. No one else would get to play offense. Look at how efficient Amir and Val are and, most games, they struggle to get touches, let alone shots. Maybe adding a 3-pt shooter who can play defense at the SG and moving Amir and Demar to second unit to beef up the bench?

    Then there's the cap issue. Don't know enough about that...

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    Quote slaw wrote: View Post
    I have no idea..... You'd need to rethink the offense. Not enough ball to go around if you've got Gay/Derozan/Boozer out there. No one else would get to play offense. Look at how efficient Amir and Val are and, most games, they struggle to get touches, let alone shots.
    Exactly, and I have been arguing this for some time to all those that want to stick Amir back on the bench in favour of a more offensively gifted PF. How many scorers do we need in our starting 5? Add Boozer and we would have 5. Unless, of course, it would be preferred to relegate JV to a non-offensive role, and NOBODY wants that I'm sure. Amir is a great compliment to JV, and both are young and continually improving. This is a fantastic frontline going forward. I, personally, do not want anything to do with Boozer's over-inflated contract, and even less with Nate Robinson. Every starting line needs a grinder or two!
    Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Fri Apr 5th, 2013 at 02:52 PM.

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