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Thread: Shooters, shooters, shooters!!

  1. #21
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    Quote TRex wrote: View Post
    Obviously you don't know what you're talking about.
    obviously you're watching the wrong dinosaurs

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    Raptors Republic All-Star KazanTheMan's Avatar
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    Ive been saying this forever... Hope it happens!

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Superstar TRex's Avatar
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    Quote d749 wrote: View Post
    obviously you're watching the wrong dinosaurs
    Lol. Ok.
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    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    Every team in the NBA needs shooters.. Korver is going to be in demand, just like Reddick will be in demand. These guys are not going to be cheap, and even the full MLE is too little.

    Best bet is via trade, and even though a shooter is a need, it would have to come from a team that has plenty of shooters in their rotation already and are looking for something else. But the Raptors don't really have too many assets unless you are willing to give up DeMar or Ross for one (I doubt Fields, Kleiza or Bargnani would be able to fetch one).

    I say go in the off season and tell Ross to jack up 1000 3's a night while someone is in his face every time. Perhaps do some suicides then go back and shoot more 3's to simulate as close to a real world example as possible.

    But the best 3 point shooters need space to operate. Unless they start utilizing JV more in the paint or if they get a low post presence the 3 point shooter will be a waste of an asset, in my opinion.
    If only it were this easy. The old saying of practice makes perfect does not apply to shooting. Mechanics are everything therefore, perfect practice makes perfect. Shooting 1000 3s a day with his current mechanics only further ingrain poor habits. He must correct footwork, catching, square elevation, release point etc. Simply being tired and shooting 3s will not help him, it will hurt him. He needs to work on conditioning separate from mechanics so he's not tired when he needs to shoot during games. Quantity does not outweigh quality. 10 perfect shots are far better than 1000 poor ones.
    There's math, and everything else is debatable.

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  5. #25
    Raptors Republic Starter torch19's Avatar
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    Quote RobertArchibald wrote: View Post
    If only it were this easy. The old saying of practice makes perfect does not apply to shooting. Mechanics are everything therefore, perfect practice makes perfect. Shooting 1000 3s a day with his current mechanics only further ingrain poor habits. He must correct footwork, catching, square elevation, release point etc. Simply being tired and shooting 3s will not help him, it will hurt him. He needs to work on conditioning separate from mechanics so he's not tired when he needs to shoot during games. Quantity does not outweigh quality. 10 perfect shots are far better than 1000 poor ones.
    We do have a good shooting coach who saved Ed Davis' career ... I wonder why DeRozan doesn't call him up in the summer
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    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote torch19 wrote: View Post
    We do have a good shooting coach who saved Ed Davis' career ... I wonder why DeRozan doesn't call him up in the summer
    I was wondering about this. ED's jumper really improved in the time before he was moved.

    DeMar already has a solid jumper...what he could achieve with some extra work could be enormous.
    Twitter - @thekid_it

  7. #27
    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    Quote torch19 wrote: View Post
    We do have a good shooting coach who saved Ed Davis' career ... I wonder why DeRozan doesn't call him up in the summer
    John Townsend has made great strides with DeMar. Early in his career he missed shots in every direction (a lot like T. Ross does now). He's done great work in squaring up his body, jumping straight up and elevating higher making his release point higher. He still shoots off the right side of his body which means his body is parallel with the backboard and slightly left of target. I believe the next step for him is to change the ball position on his shot bringing it closer to the centre of his body while angling his entire body slightly left of the backboard (which T. Ross already does). This will help improve his launch angle from distance.

    T. Ross has better setup mechanics but poor execution mechanics. Body takes off in different directions causing hand and wrist to never be consistent (he's simply reacting with his hands to where his body is going, this is subconscious as the body is doing everything it can to get the ball to go where the brain wants). Therefore, his misses are left, right, short and long. When his body mechanics tighten up, his dispersion on misses will more than likely tighten up to reveal a consistent miss which is easier to focus on fixing.

    Believe DeMar also worked with Dave Hopla who is one of the best. Either way, the shooting coach is one of the most underused and underrated development tools in the NBA, hence I believe there's only 6 teams that employ full-time shooting coaches.
    Last edited by RobertArchibald; Fri Apr 12th, 2013 at 03:23 PM.
    There's math, and everything else is debatable.

    @clericalbeats

  8. #28
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    I agree the need for a shooter the realistic candidate i like would be Anthony Morrow. I do like reddick or korver of course but i dont see us being able to acquire them.

    Call me optimistic but i see the current roster minus bargs a playoff team. not a good one but a 8 seed. I believe this team is lacking 3 things and one we have. We need a shooter that is being discussed this could be ross i believe its more the speed of the game thats messing with his shot i wont even give an assessment until i see him after a summer of work with professional coaches. two we need a big man 4/5. I dont care if amir starts or comes off the bench, doesnt change the level of skill the player we bring in would need to have. Boozer, gasol, mill sap at work i dont mind the hickson idea. ( i like the older two because of big expiring contracts + veteran leadership.)

    The last thing we need is time. Time to develop chemistry and more importantly let ALL of our young assests grow. Mainly JV, Ross and hey maybe even Acy can turn into a rotation player I've liked what ive seen. But Demar needs some more time even hes growing every year, Amir is still 24 i believe hes still improving we need some time for them to make the next step like we've recently seen JV take and Amir take this year.

    Honestly i dont know how realistic this all is with accuiring players but i dont believe its unrealistic. Im not gunna bother with what if trade speculation but i believe it is all possible. Thats my two cents.

  9. #29
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    I'm getting tired and a little annoyed at this "development", "raw skillset", and "give him some more time" bullshit.

    For fucks sake if you're going to be in the the NBA and have zero defining skillsets as a P-R-O-F-E-S-S-I-O-N-A-L basketball player playing for the highest level basketball league in the world, then why are you even here?!

    What good is a player to a team that needs half a goddamn decade to finally get good at more than one thing and contribute effectively?

  10. #30
    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    Quote Sig wrote: View Post
    I'm getting tired and a little annoyed at this "development", "raw skillset", and "give him some more time" bullshit.

    For fucks sake if you're going to be in the the NBA and have zero defining skillsets as a P-R-O-F-E-S-S-I-O-N-A-L basketball player playing for the highest level basketball league in the world, then why are you even here?!

    What good is a player to a team that needs half a goddamn decade to finally get good at more than one thing and contribute effectively?
    This is a little ignorant. I don't know what you do for a living but I'm willing to wager you didn't excel at it in your first year, let alone your first five years. 10,000 hours of practice is needed in order to master something. That means 10,000 hours of repeating an action perfectly (which at 8 hours a day equates to...you guessed it, "half a goddamn decade") This also does not include all the practice time that was spent ingraining poor habits. Just because you are a professional does not mean you are the BEST professional. This is why someone like DeMar is highly regarded for his work ethic and his desire to improve. Not everyone is LeBron James.
    There's math, and everything else is debatable.

    @clericalbeats

  11. #31
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    Quote RobertArchibald wrote: View Post
    This is a little ignorant. I don't know what you do for a living but I'm willing to wager you didn't excel at it in your first year, let alone your first five years. 10,000 hours of practice is needed in order to master something. That means 10,000 hours of repeating an action perfectly (which at 8 hours a day equates to...you guessed it, "half a goddamn decade") This also does not include all the practice time that was spent ingraining poor habits. Just because you are a professional does not mean you are the BEST professional. This is why someone like DeMar is highly regarded for his work ethic and his desire to improve. Not everyone is LeBron James.
    Hm yeah i overreacted a little bit, I have those moments sometimes. Regardless I still disagree. I think that if you're going to be in a business where you're making overwhelmingly large sums of money while being watched by thousands of people every night for the next 15 years of your life while playing at the highest level possible... you should at least have honed your skills to a level where someone could call it a standout strength, or even an advantage.

    Poor habits are inherited from poor training and/or coaching, that is the player's fault, and it is their responsibility to fix it, otherwise they plummet into mediocrity or lose their job. Or even worse, get traded to the Bobcats.

    As far as that last bit goes, I don't buy it. Not everyone can be as good Lebron James, but anyone can want to be as good as him, and be the best player they can be before a franchise invests years in your development, along with the fans watching.

    Prospects nowadays are mostly being drafted purely on potential, now while there are exceptions, it was definitely not like this before.

  12. #32
    Raptors Republic Superstar iblastoff's Avatar
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    Quote Sig wrote: View Post
    I'm getting tired and a little annoyed at this "development", "raw skillset", and "give him some more time" bullshit.

    For fucks sake if you're going to be in the the NBA and have zero defining skillsets as a P-R-O-F-E-S-S-I-O-N-A-L basketball player playing for the highest level basketball league in the world, then why are you even here?!

    What good is a player to a team that needs half a goddamn decade to finally get good at more than one thing and contribute effectively?
    Possibly the second worst post I've read here today. You realize that pretty much every nba player comes into their full stride generally 4-5 years (aka half a decade) into their professional career right? Not everyone is Michael Jordan or lebron, buddy.

    Players before weren't drafted for their potential? I'm confused. Did you just start watching basketball last week or something?
    Last edited by iblastoff; Fri Apr 12th, 2013 at 11:49 PM.

  13. #33
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    Quote iblastoff wrote: View Post
    Possibly the second worst post I've read here today. You realize that pretty much every nba player comes into their full stride generally 4-5 years (aka half a decade) into their professional career right? Not everyone is Michael Jordan or lebron, buddy.

    Players before weren't drafted for their potential? I'm confused. Did you just start watching basketball last week or something?
    Like I wrote earlier, I overreacted a little bit. But you seem to have misread something because at no point did I say that you had to be a Lebron or a Jordan. I quote, "defining skillset" is what I said. You know, something that one can use to their advantage. Now is this some sort of otherworldy Lebron-like thing that is being asked for? Absolutely not, but some of you are making it seem like it is.

    I'm going to pick on Demar again -since I watch him very often- and ask you a question. Does Demar have a single or multiple standout aspects to his game 4 years into his career? Especially considering he's going to make around $10 million dollars next season, is he worth it? Is a player that isn't even remotely close to having an all-around game worth that much cap space?

    Oh yeah, it's been 4 years. So does that mean next year he's going to improve drastically? According to most of you, his ceiling should be reached any time now. Or maybe he's like a Bargnani and needs 10 years to learn something other than shoot long two pointers (most inefficient shot in the sport of basketball) for 36 minutes. I guess this is just a Raptor fan thing, denying the obvious and inevitable.

    Also relax a little bit.

  14. #34
    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    Quote Sig wrote: View Post
    Hm yeah i overreacted a little bit, I have those moments sometimes. Regardless I still disagree. I think that if you're going to be in a business where you're making overwhelmingly large sums of money while being watched by thousands of people every night for the next 15 years of your life while playing at the highest level possible... you should at least have honed your skills to a level where someone could call it a standout strength, or even an advantage.

    Poor habits are inherited from poor training and/or coaching, that is the player's fault, and it is their responsibility to fix it, otherwise they plummet into mediocrity or lose their job. Or even worse, get traded to the Bobcats.

    As far as that last bit goes, I don't buy it. Not everyone can be as good Lebron James, but anyone can want to be as good as him, and be the best player they can be before a franchise invests years in your development, along with the fans watching.

    Prospects nowadays are mostly being drafted purely on potential, now while there are exceptions, it was definitely not like this before.
    Yes poor habits come from poor training and coaching. Which is exactly what players receive before they have the luxury of NBA coaches, trainers and medical staff. It can't fall on the player to fix something they don't know HOW to fix. I think you're overlooking a large part of young player development. It doesn't happen in high school or even in their first year of college. They are getting by with physical gifts and weak opposition due to players being in the same predicament as them. When they enter the NBA they're playing against men who have years of elite experience and have learned how to improve their games.

    As for DeMar, it's easy to say he's making 10 million so he should be paying dividends in return for that money spent. BUT, he was offered that money. The onus is then on BC and his judgement of his talent. Is he worth that money? I'm not sure, but to say he has no specific skillset is unfair. He has dramatically improved his shot in many aspects (pull-up, free-throw, off-balance) and has also improved his ability to absorb contact and get to the free-throw line. For a guy who was dubbed a slasher and a jumper I'd say he's recognizing his weaknesses and working to improve a part of his game that didn't come naturally to him or he didn't need to use as much in high school and college.
    There's math, and everything else is debatable.

    @clericalbeats

  15. #35
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote Sig wrote: View Post
    Hm yeah i overreacted a little bit, I have those moments sometimes. Regardless I still disagree. I think that if you're going to be in a business where you're making overwhelmingly large sums of money while being watched by thousands of people every night for the next 15 years of your life while playing at the highest level possible... you should at least have honed your skills to a level where someone could call it a standout strength, or even an advantage.

    Poor habits are inherited from poor training and/or coaching, that is the player's fault, and it is their responsibility to fix it, otherwise they plummet into mediocrity or lose their job. Or even worse, get traded to the Bobcats.

    As far as that last bit goes, I don't buy it. Not everyone can be as good Lebron James, but anyone can want to be as good as him, and be the best player they can be before a franchise invests years in your development, along with the fans watching.

    Prospects nowadays are mostly being drafted purely on potential, now while there are exceptions, it was definitely not like this before.
    I don't necessarily agree with this, in a way, it implies when you're in the NBA, you should have no room to grow or improve. You should be the best of your best by the time you reach the NBA.

    In my opinion, almost every player in the NBA has a skill or some type of facet of the game to show for i.e athleticism, shooting, defense, etc. I don't agree with the fact that it should take a short time for someone to get better. It doesn't take only 4 years for a child to read, write, talk, count, etc. Those are skills needed to be an educated/regular human being, you progress and develop over time.
    Last edited by ReubenJRD; Sat Apr 13th, 2013 at 02:37 AM.

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    THE TORONTO (long)TWO POINTERS

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    So... is Ross the best option to find a shooter?

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