View Poll Results: Grade Bargnani's game.

Voters
127. You may not vote on this poll
  • A

    9 7.09%
  • B

    47 37.01%
  • C

    30 23.62%
  • D

    18 14.17%
  • F

    23 18.11%
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Thread: Everything Bargnani: The Legend Continues

  1. #9381
    Raptors Republic Starter connected's Avatar
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    BC has always worn 'beer goggles' when it comes to Bargs. I wonder if he gets the axe and a new GM replaces him the expected return on AB would be much lower. Most of us would trade Bargs for a couple peanuts, a pick and some cap relief.

    Hopefully the same rumoured deals (Boozer or Hawes package) are still on the table.

  2. #9382
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    Wow, I'm afraid to vote because of the dictatorship tone of option 3.

    We should trade him for any player that expires at the end of this season. I will take absolutely anyone, even if the player is retired, or missing a limb. Don't get me wrong, I don't think we should just take the first offer we get, but if there are no offers (which I think very likely), I'll take anything we can get.

    Put it this way, another NBA team could sign Jiroemon Kimura to a 1-year $10M contract and I'll trade Bargnani straight up for him if there's nothing else we can do. We really should save the Amnesty so we can also get rid of Kleiza. No matter how low Bargnani's trade value gets, I doubt it's worse than Kleiza's. At the end of the day Bargs is still a 7 footer and someone is will be willing to take a flyer on him purely based on his height.
    your pal,
    ebrian

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  4. #9383
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    Quote Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
    Stuckey is awful I want no part of him in Tdot hes not a PG either hes a small 2 that cant shoot. Mentioning JV in trades is blasphemy.
    'Awful' is the way a lot of teams view Bargnani as well. So I'm suggesting an 'awful for awful' deal AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, as Matt says, he's an expiring deal. He's a combo guard who can ably serve as a back up PG for a year.

    As far as JV is concerned, it's a matter of opinion. Personally I think it's a deal worth making. Millsap is one of the best PF's in the league and Kanter is potentially a solid Center.
    Attitude Is A Choice.

  5. #9384
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    Quote Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    I think Bargnani will bounce back and revive his career but not here in Toronto. It'll be nice to wait until he starts playing better(which he's very much capable of) but considering what's happened with him lately, it most probably won't happen here. The longer he's hung on to, the worse it'll get for both Bargnani and the Raps. The most sensible thing to do IMO is despite his falling stock, trade him for the best possible return.

    A couple of ideas:

    1) Toronto/Utah
    Jonas V and Bargnani for E Kanter and P Millsap(S & T).

    2) Toronto/Detroit
    Bargnani and 2nd rounder for R Stuckey(back up PG) and V Kravtsov.
    I would be on board for both deals. Even the Utah one. Kanter in my opinion is going to be just as good as JV. JV may have a bit more upside but the different I think will be minute. To trade Bargnani for a player as good as Millsap makes the deal so much more one sided in Toronto's favour that it would be hard to pass up.

  6. #9385
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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    Wow, I'm afraid to vote because of the dictatorship tone of option 3.

    We should trade him for any player that expires at the end of this season. I will take absolutely anyone, even if the player is retired, or missing a limb. Don't get me wrong, I don't think we should just take the first offer we get, but if there are no offers (which I think very likely), I'll take anything we can get.

    Put it this way, another NBA team could sign Jiroemon Kimura to a 1-year $10M contract and I'll trade Bargnani straight up for him if there's nothing else we can do. We really should save the Amnesty so we can also get rid of Kleiza. No matter how low Bargnani's trade value gets, I doubt it's worse than Kleiza's. At the end of the day Bargs is still a 7 footer and someone is will be willing to take a flyer on him purely based on his height.
    The thing is... how can you vote for a trade, but have no realistic option to present. Its different than wanting BC gone but not knowing a possible replacement because we dont see GMs working 3 hours a day on OK for 82 times a year. And because we need a willing dance partner to part ways with Bargs via trade.

    You say any team will take a shot on him based on height, but its very well documented the be plays like a much smaller player. Maybe some team will be willing to take a flyer on him, but not with the money he is due this year and next.

    Your Kimura option is akin to a team signing Bargs this summer for 2 years and $23 mil. Thats unrealistic.







    As for Stuckey, that deal is good for use because of the ball-handling need we have and the expiring deal Stuckeys on. But Detroit isnt signing up to pay Bargnani for the next couple of years just so he can eat into Monroe and Drummonds minutes. Its not a realistic deal.

    As for Boozer, I realize that was rumoured around the deadline, but I flatly dont buy it. Can you think of a worse player-coach match than Bargs-Thibs, because I sure as hell cannot. Thibs throws his body in front of that deal. Especially because Noah needs Boozers competent offense beside him to operate the offense from the high post.

  7. #9386
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    Quote NoBan wrote: View Post
    The thing is... how can you vote for a trade, but have no realistic option to present. Its different than wanting BC gone but not knowing a possible replacement because we dont see GMs working 3 hours a day on OK for 82 times a year. And because we need a willing dance partner to part ways with Bargs via trade.

    You say any team will take a shot on him based on height, but its very well documented the be plays like a much smaller player. Maybe some team will be willing to take a flyer on him, but not with the money he is due this year and next.

    Your Kimura option is akin to a team signing Bargs this summer for 2 years and $23 mil. Thats unrealistic.
    Right on man. I used Kimura as an extreme example to illustrate my point. I want to vote trade but I can't come up with one because I can't think of a single reason why any team would want to trade for Bargnani unless they're trading a player who is about to die.

    I suppose based on this discussion, the only realistic answer is perhaps option B. Keep him. Because we have no other alternative.
    your pal,
    ebrian

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  9. #9387
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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    Right on man. I used Kimura as an extreme example to illustrate my point. I want to vote trade but I can't come up with one because I can't think of a single reason why any team would want to trade for Bargnani unless they're trading a player who is about to die.

    I suppose based on this discussion, the only realistic answer is perhaps option B. Keep him. Because we have no other alternative.
    Yep, I think I agree. Thats why I havent voted yet. I really, really want to vote Trade, but Ive drawn a similar conclusion to you and cant bring myself to vote Keep just yet. That's kind of the direction I wanted this thread to go in. Everyone seems to think Trade is a no-brainer, but it's not terribly realistic. I'm encouraged by the 1/4 of people voting Keep. I may add my name there.

    Im trying to convince myself that the Chuckwagon-Jimmer deal is realistic and worthwhile. Not there yet on either front.

    The only other way we get a trade done is if we take back an albatross (Amare) or include another asset in the deal (JV). Im not ready to go there, either (although that Utah deal is interesting). I don't think Utah does that deal tho. They have no reason to want Andrea, and they already had the chance to take JV over Kanter and chose Kanter.
    Last edited by NoBan; Mon May 13th, 2013 at 03:30 PM.

  10. #9388
    Raptors Republic Starter T.Dot's Avatar
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    So the idea is to send him to a shitty team just like we did we Calderon...

  11. #9389
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    Quote T.Dot wrote: View Post
    So the idea is to send him to a shitty team just like we did we Calderon...
    yup

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  13. #9390
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    The idea is so send him... somewhere. Anywhere, really. Bad teams may be more likely to make a bad decision, which is what acquiring Andrea would be. But sending him anywhere is the idea.

  14. #9391
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    If the goal is to get better after a Bargnani trade an asset has to go with it.

    The question becomes what asset? I would think Ross or DeRozan with Ross being more likely due to DeRozan's contract.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  15. #9392
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    Quote T.Dot wrote: View Post
    So the idea is to send him to a shitty team just like we did we Calderon...
    Who gives a shit? as long as we get some decent pieces back. No one told Bargnani to play his way off the team, he did it himself because he doesn't know what effort is.
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

  16. #9393
    Raptors Republic Starter T.Dot's Avatar
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    Quote NoBan wrote: View Post
    The idea is so send him... somewhere. Anywhere, really. Bad teams may be more likely to make a bad decision, which is what acquiring Andrea would be. But sending him anywhere is the idea.
    This is why raptors will not reach anywhere.

  17. #9394
    Raptors Republic Starter T.Dot's Avatar
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    Who gives a shit? as long as we get some decent pieces back. No one told Bargnani to play his way off the team, he did it himself because he doesn't know what effort is.
    Play his way off. Wow. How do you know he doesn't know what it is? Small minded fans like you piss me off. Hopefully he goes to a mediocre team which he can possibly help. He is a good player so don't even comeback with that bull that he isn't. Side note, Calderon deserved better than Detroit. Offloading for offloading sake is always a bad idea to appease fans like you and for someone aka colangelo to keep onto his job to save face with the fans and with the organization.

  18. #9395
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    Quote T.Dot wrote: View Post
    This is why raptors will not reach anywhere.
    I'm not following your logic here. The Raptors wont reach anywhere by trading Bargnani for whatever they can get? Is that what your saying? Are you saying they won't reach anywhere because the player they built around has no value and cannot contribute? Are you saying that they will get somewhere if they keep Bargnani? Whatever point you're trying to make here, it needs to be more clearly articulated.

  19. #9396
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    Quote T.Dot wrote: View Post
    Play his way off. Wow. How do you know he doesn't know what it is? Small minded fans like you piss me off. Hopefully he goes to a mediocre team which he can possibly help. He is a good player so don't even comeback with that bull that he isn't. Side note, Calderon deserved better than Detroit. Offloading for offloading sake is always a bad idea to appease fans like you and for someone aka colangelo to keep onto his job to save face with the fans and with the organization.
    You're a small minded fan. All you care about it bargnani, why don't you join him on his journey to no where? he's going to be out of the league soon enough. Bargnani is trash and he is the reason this team has sucked as much as it did. And honestly, its a business. You do whats best for the team, i could care less where bargnani ends up, as long as we benefit from it.
    Last edited by NoPropsneeded; Mon May 13th, 2013 at 06:27 PM.
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

  20. #9397
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    I thought that this was an interesting article, analyzing the effectiveness of NBA players at interior defense (http://www.sloansportsconference.com...0the%20NBA.pdf).

    To summarize:

    Top 5 (proximal FG% when defender is within 5 feet):
    1. Larry Sanders (34.9%)
    2. Andrea Bargnani (35.2%)
    3. Kendrick Perkins (37.3%)
    4. Elton Brand (38.0%)
    5. Roy Hibbert (38.7%)

    Bottom 5:
    48. Kevin Love (52.1%)
    49. Jonas Valanciunas (52.8%)
    50. David Lee (53.0%)
    51. Jordan Hill (53.9%)
    52. Anderson Varejo (54.2%)
    Last edited by Bouncepass; Tue May 14th, 2013 at 06:39 PM.

  21. #9398
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Bouncepass wrote: View Post
    I thought that this was an interesting article, analyzing the effectiveness of NBA players at interior defense.

    To summarize:

    Top 5 (proximal FG% when defender is within 5 feet):
    1. Larry Sanders (34.9%)
    2. Andrea Bargnani (35.2%)
    3. Kendrick Perkins (37.3%)
    4. Elton Brand (38.0%)
    5. Roy Hibbert (38.7%)

    Bottom 5:
    48. Kevin Love (52.1%)
    49. Jonas Valanciunas (52.8%)
    50. David Lee (53.0%)
    51. Jordan Hill (53.9%)
    52. Anderson Varejo (54.2%)
    link?
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  22. #9399
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    link?
    You are fast on the draw Matt. I was just going there.

  23. #9400
    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote Bouncepass wrote: View Post
    I thought that this was an interesting article, analyzing the effectiveness of NBA players at interior defense.

    To summarize:

    Top 5 (proximal FG% when defender is within 5 feet):
    1. Larry Sanders (34.9%)
    2. Andrea Bargnani (35.2%)
    3. Kendrick Perkins (37.3%)
    4. Elton Brand (38.0%)
    5. Roy Hibbert (38.7%)

    Bottom 5:
    48. Kevin Love (52.1%)
    49. Jonas Valanciunas (52.8%)
    50. David Lee (53.0%)
    51. Jordan Hill (53.9%)
    52. Anderson Varejo (54.2%)
    This can't be right. Never mind Bargs...Kendrick Perkins cannot be 3rd. People who say he's a good defender clearly have no idea what they're talking about. He's horrific on both ends of the floor.
    Twitter - @thekid_it

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