View Poll Results: So, who goes?

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  • Rudy Gay

    15 25.42%
  • Andrea Bargnani

    54 91.53%
  • DeMar DeRozan

    27 45.76%
  • Amir Johnson

    7 11.86%
  • Landry Fields

    13 22.03%
  • Kyle Lowry

    20 33.90%
  • Jonas Valanciunas

    1 1.69%
  • Terrence Ross

    7 11.86%
  • Aaron Gray

    15 25.42%
  • Quincy Acy

    8 13.56%
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Thread: So, who goes?

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic All-Star Mr.Z's Avatar
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    Yeah, the question is who goes, and my opinion is the guys on the bench (Bargs and the rest). I'm not arguing who's better. I'm simply stating my opinion. I'm not asking you to agree with me. Yes "the man in charge" wants change, this is just what I think should be changed this off-season.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    I said DD and AB. AB for obvious reasons, it's just time. DD because he is the guy with the most value who is expendable in the long run. I don't think Fields or Ross will be adequate replacements at SG, so we'd need to get someone at the 2 in the DD and AB trades.
    Overall, I'm fine with anyone outside of Jonas being traded as long as it makes us better in the long run.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote TRex wrote: View Post
    Ok, let's say they move DD. What exactly can they get for him?? and who's going to start at the 2 for the Raptors?
    You can get Pau? Landry Fields has been a starter in this league before. On two successful team.

  4. #24
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    This is a team with maybe 5 or 6 players, yet 12 people getting player contracts. Is JL3 still on contract? If so I would try to move him too. I think the first step needs to be having a real bench with real players. Could moving AB help there? Who ever they bring in has to fit an actual team philosophy. So which of the 5/6 actual players that gets moved probably should happen during the season, unless a killer offer is made. Who should be safe? JV. I got fandom for DD, but for the right players-- see ya. Gay? He's good, but that contract for that performance? Lowry... you get my point. All 5/6 (the 6th being a healthy, rehabbed LF) have flaws.

  5. #25
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    Most likely to Least likely to go:

    K Lowry
    A Bargnani
    T Ross
    L Fields
    A Gray
    D Derozan
    A Johnson
    R Gay
    J V

    Assuming Ujiri is taking over, I think he'll make strengthening PG positions No. 1 priority. So Lowry heads the list of my 'most likely to go'.

    Trading Bargnani IMO will be his No.2 priority and so adding Ross, Amir or even JV may be necessary to make trade possible.

    Same may be done to get rid of Fields.
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  6. #26
    Raptors Republic All-Star tucas's Avatar
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    I would be 100% okay with starting fields if we could trade demar for a quality PF. He may not be an offensive threat, but he's a glue guy and IMO every team should have one in there starting lineup. It frees up more time for Ross to develop and even just his increase in minutes helps our lack of 3 point shooting ability. Him and Bargnani should be first to go and they should keep:
    Lowry,Fields,Gay,JV,Amir, and Ross. Everyone else is expendable or could be easily replaced by free agents.

  7. #27
    Raptors Republic Superstar TRex's Avatar
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    You can get Pau? Landry Fields has been a starter in this league before. On two successful team.
    Lol so you're going to trade a guy that just turned 24 for a guy that has 2-3 years of good basketball left in him?? no way.
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  8. #28
    Raptors Republic Starter torch19's Avatar
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    It's really tough to predict what next year will look like for us. I mean, the new GM can come in and blow the whole thing apart ... or he can come in and trade whatever prospect we have to buy an all-star & make a run for the playoffs. The fact that we are not 100% certain who the GM will be and what his intentions will turn out to be, it's making for an interesting, yet scary off season.

    If I were to be GM for the Raptors, I would certainly keep Valanciunas & dangle everyone on the roster for a chance to improve the team top down -- not to blow it apart.

    My list (in order of "keep" to "sell")

    VALANCIUNAS

    ***big***

    ***gap***

    GAY
    ROSS
    JOHNSON

    LOWRY
    FIELDS
    ACY
    DeROZAN
    GRAY
    LUCAS




    BARGNANI

    I'm certainly not hating on DeMar. I just think that aside from the rooks & maybe Gay?, he has the most value in the market. Someone will buy into his services -- an ever improving & athletic guard -- good character -- hard worker -- improved jump shot -- improved awareness .... someone will buy into that sort of thinking & would want to render his services. I figure Terrence Ross will likely improve & with consistent minutes, he should project to be at the very least, a capable rotation player. If DeMar nets you someone better than Pau Gasol (RE: expiring contract, former all star), then I think it's worth the tears (cause you know, we get attached to our boys).

    I would trade Bargnani for Araujo.

    Amir and Lowry would be included if packaged along with DeMar to net someone like Aldrige -- something along those lines.

    Fields would be included if someone is willing to take him on. I think we can find quality defensive guys (who can shoot threes better than him) for a fraction of his cost .... Corey Brewer?

    Lucas, Acy & Gray would be fillers a la Hamed Haddadi although my preference would be to keep Acy since he's a mobile defender who seems like he's always on Red Bull.

    Last but not the least, I will get a new coach or at the very least, hire an assistant who is regarded as one of those "brains behind the operation." [most likely just hire a new coach]
    “I don’t create controversies. They’re there long before I open my mouth. I just bring them to your attention.”

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  9. #29
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    Honestly, I only want Bargs out and just replace the rest of the scrubs not listed here (anderson, lucas, telfair) with better players. Bargs for Boozer. Derozan is probably the most marketable, and I thought it would have been better if they traded him to get rudy gay since we still have terrence ross. I'm not hating on derozan, i like his work ethic and i'm hoping he can improve and be a top 10 sg in the future. i'm not impressed with lowry. i might be biased coz of my preference on point guards who pass first and make plays, vs. shoot first point guards. we need a decent backup pg, maybe not jose calderon (as much as i would love him to come back) as he might take the starting job again. maybe ridnour, hinrich, flynn. i'm hoping to get a late 1st rounder or early 2nd round pick so we could draft kabongo (not only coz hes cdn).

  10. #30
    Raptors Republic Starter c_bcm's Avatar
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    Demar, gay, bargs are gone.

  11. #31
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    For all those thinking that Lowry is moveable consider the fact that most teams already have their starting PG. If we trade Lowry then who do we get back? What team would be willing to trade their starting PG for a guy that will be entering free agency after one year? And we still need a capable backup PG as well.

    I think Lowry is an asset, but once he's traded we have no PG. I don't think he will be moved.

  12. #32
    Raptors Republic Starter Pele's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    These Tim Leiweke quotes are stolen from main page of RaptorsRepublic.com:






    There has been a lot of talk in these forums about the "core" of Lowry-DeRozan-Gay-Amir-JV moving forward. It seems pretty clear that the status quo is not going to remain for whoever comes in to take control of this franchise from a basketball operation/decision-making perspective based on the comments of the ultimate boss.

    With that said:

    Who goes and, if you are really adventurous or just have time on your hands, why?



    **In the poll, only included guys under contract for next season minus Kleiza and it is multiple choice!**
    Thanks for the post. I went back and listened carefully to the whole interview, focussing on the quotes you included.

    It seems to me that Tim L doesn't have any faith in Brian's ability to assess the quality of a player.

    Also, it's clear that Tim L believes this team is fundamentally flawed, and currently without an adequate base to build a contender.

    Let's look at Toronto's current core in relation to more successful teams.

    DeRozen, Gay Lowry.

    Indiana, West, George, Hibbert
    San An Ginobli, Parker, Duncan
    Memphis Gasol, Randolph, Conley
    Golden Stat, Curry, Lee, Bogut, Barnes

    I think Tim L is looking to dismantle and re-build, and has his eyes set on DeRozen and Andrea as the first to go. After that, I think he sees Gay as having no future in Toronto, not at that price. I believe these three will be peddled for lottery picks in the 2014 draft. FYI, I see Tim L. picking a GM who shares his vision.

    Of the rest, only JV and Amir approach the untradable, but would be packaged in the right deal.

  13. #33
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    For all those thinking that Lowry is moveable consider the fact that most teams already have their starting PG. If we trade Lowry then who do we get back? What team would be willing to trade their starting PG for a guy that will be entering free agency after one year? And we still need a capable backup PG as well.

    I think Lowry is an asset, but once he's traded we have no PG. I don't think he will be moved.
    A team that ends up blowing it up. I keep thinking of Boston. Their future is really cloudy. KG and Ainge have publicly said they're far from being a contender even if everybody comes back healthy next year. I don't buy the "quick re-build around Rondo". They could easily rebuild a playoff team, but would struggle mightily to add the calibre of players Rondo needs around him. He's a pass-first guard who's had 3 of the best scorers of their generation at their respective positions to pass to (counting Allen before he left).

    Basically, if Boston is willing to blow it up and trade Rondo, I don't think they will be super-concerned about holes that arise, since they will clearly go into tank mode to stockpile picks for a couple of years. I do think it's possible they decide to keep building around him, but I also think he'll attract far and away the best trades packages, so they really will have to at least consider trading him, especially if KG (retirement?) and Pierce (trade?) are gone.

    Now, I also realize any such deal is a long shot...but I also have to believe it's the kind of deal a new GM will be pushing for if he doesn't just want to dump guys, but also improve the team.

  14. #34
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    A team that ends up blowing it up. I keep thinking of Boston. Their future is really cloudy. KG and Ainge have publicly said they're far from being a contender even if everybody comes back healthy next year. I don't buy the "quick re-build around Rondo". They could easily rebuild a playoff team, but would struggle mightily to add the calibre of players Rondo needs around him. He's a pass-first guard who's had 3 of the best scorers of their generation at their respective positions to pass to (counting Allen before he left).

    Basically, if Boston is willing to blow it up and trade Rondo, I don't think they will be super-concerned about holes that arise, since they will clearly go into tank mode to stockpile picks for a couple of years. I do think it's possible they decide to keep building around him, but I also think he'll attract far and away the best trades packages, so they really will have to at least consider trading him, especially if KG (retirement?) and Pierce (trade?) are gone.

    Now, I also realize any such deal is a long shot...but I also have to believe it's the kind of deal a new GM will be pushing for if he doesn't just want to dump guys, but also improve the team.

    Rondo is an asset of course but he is held in very high regards for Boston. He was mentioned in a Paul trade for example. The Raptors do not have any players on their team that are even close to Paul's level of talent.

    If Rondo was to be traded then Boston would most likely be looking for a top 5 pick in a draft. I don't think Toronto is going to be in the bottom 5 next year, and especially with a team that has Rondo on their roster.

    I understand where you are coming from with this idea but I just don't see it happening.

    But speaking of long shots, how about Tony Parker? We all know that Duncan is getting close to retirement, and if the Spurs win this year could this be his last hurrah? Ginobili is a free agent next year. Is he going to retire?

    Toronto has young assets. Perhaps a Lowry+DeMar+future first for Parker? Parker is 31 years old, but for PG's that's actually pretty young. He'd be on the top of my list, even ahead of Rondo (if he was available).

  15. #35
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    For all those thinking that Lowry is moveable consider the fact that most teams already have their starting PG.

    I think Lowry is an asset, but once he's traded we have no PG. I don't think he will be moved.
    Not all teams have their starting PG's. Two teams that come to mind are the Clippers and Hawks.

    Secondly, he will not be traded without a 'CERTAIN PLAN' of a better PG coming to Toronto either via trade or FA. In fact, considering he is in the final year of a good contract, he would be very attractive to a lot of GM's.
    Attitude Is A Choice.

  16. #36
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    Quote Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    Not all teams have their starting PG's. Two teams that come to mind are the Clippers and Hawks.

    Secondly, he will not be traded without a 'CERTAIN PLAN' of a better PG coming to Toronto either via trade or FA. In fact, considering he is in the final year of a good contract, he would be very attractive to a lot of GM's.
    I recognize that Lowry is an asset.. but I just don't see him being traded. Teams like LAC might be interested but then who are we getting back that can play PG for us next season and would be considered an upgrade to Lowry?

    The new GM has to get a new PG before they trade Lowry or they need to swap PG's (trading Lowry and then scrambling to find a replacement is a very risky move that could backfire big time). Which team would be willing to swap their starting caliber PG for Lowry and then is that an upgrade for Toronto? If there was a 3rd team, then which team has 2 starting caliber PG's so that they would be willing to trade one and not the other (where either PG would be considered an upgrade to Lowry)?

    The Raptors do not have cap space, so they can't just sign a PG in free agency. They would have the MLE but is any guard worth the MLE an upgrade over Lowry, and would Toronto make that move, considering they are so close to the luxury tax if they spend most of that MLE? S&T is possible, but then the only guy I see that fits a S&T is Jennings, and I'd rather have Lowry.

    Of course Lowry can be traded and he'd bring back a good return, but I just don't think it makes sense for Toronto since we also need to strengthen our backup PG spot as well. If we had an emerging PG that could take the starting reigns then it's a no brainer. But when your backup is JL3 then I think it becomes a lot harder to trade Lowry, and that's why I don't see him being moved this off season.

    It just seems like if we traded Lowry a lot of other things would have to happen too. That's just a lot of work for a GM, especially when the PG you already have seems to be happy playing for you and is a good quality starter in the league.

    Perhaps the one guy that we could sign that could realistically replace Lowry is Jose. Perhaps we sign Jose at the MLE then use Lowry in a trade to upgrade the roster? I could see Detroit resigning him though and they can offer a lot more than the MLE.

  17. #37
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    When you look at the roster, it is designed for and around Bargnani. Everyone is available for the right trade but the three trade chips I'd be looking at are DeRozan, Lowry, and Gay (in that order).

    I was looking at the draft prospects a few weeks back. I was impressed by Schroeder then and am more impressed now. I think he is going to be special - likely more so than Burke to be honest because of his athleticism and defense. He is also 6'2" with a 6'7" wingspan that would be nice running the pick and roll with Jonas.


    Teams in need of SG:
    Milwaukee
    Utah
    Minnesota
    Phoenix


    Teams in need of a PG (a lot could change once draft night/July 1st rolls around):
    Utah
    Sacramento (is Thomas a starter?)
    New Orleans (is Vasquez a starter?)


    Minnesota would be a good destination for DeRozan, in my opinion. Not sure if there is still interest there with Kahn gone.
    #9/Ridnour for DeRozan?

    Milwaukee might be another possibility. Henson/Mbah a Moute for DeRozan? Ilyasova for DeRozan? Henson/Gooden/15 for DeRozan?


    Utah seem to be the most likely partner for Lowry. Sign and trade Millsap (max contract $9.3M)? Lowry for 14 (Schroeder) and 21 (stash Adetokunbo)?


    I am just talking out of my ass. Obviously I have no idea.
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  18. #38
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    Not all teams have their starting PG's. Two teams that come to mind are the Clippers and Hawks.

    Secondly, he will not be traded without a 'CERTAIN PLAN' of a better PG coming to Toronto either via trade or FA. In fact, considering he is in the final year of a good contract, he would be very attractive to a lot of GM's.
    Teague is restricted. If he leaves Atlanta, it will be the Hawks' choice.

    Who knows what happens with CP3, but the Clippers have Eric Bledsoe who as a starter averaged 14ppg (on 41/44/80 shooting), 5.3ast, 4.8reb, and 2.5stl in 12 starts.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  19. #39
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    I'm pretty excited to hear Leweike doesn't think this roster is worth much of a damn. I've been on the "just blow it up and start fresh" stance since last season and the DD contract and Gay trade only made it more real.

  20. #40
    Raptors Republic Starter Dino4life's Avatar
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    I haven't worked out the details because i'm at work (shuuuuush), but as i was reading an article about D12 and what houston has to do to sign him, it occured to me that theres a Golden oppertunity for the next GM.
    Houston does not have the cap space to offer a Max contract as they are today, and on June 30th, their contracts become garanteed, so they have to create that cap space before Free Agency, before they can talk to dwight under the assumptions that media reports are true they are the favorites to steal him. Meaning they will have to give Away some of their bigs for nothing, or 2015, 2016 Draft Picks. We dont have the cap space, but we are over crowed at the wings, so a 3 team trade is necessarry with someone good on bigs but missing depth on the wings.

    Houston Bigs in order i like them for the raps:

    1- Donatas Montiejunas (1.3 mil) : yes he's JV's buddy but it goes beyond that, i watched him from the moment he got drafted untill the summer league, but i have to admit haven't seen much since. But he's got potential he's a sophmore so a little expeience under his Belt. He's 7'' feet Tall (i dream of a twin Tower team, not sure why i guess the TD and admiral years left an impression on me)

    2- Thomas Robinson (3.3 mil): again young talented sophmore, who just needs good coaching to grow with the rest of the young team. Plus only next year is garanteed so if he really is a bust, just dont pick up the option.

    3- Omer Asik (8.3 mil): in terms of skills and heart he should be 1st, but that contract pushed him down to 3 for me.

    Terrence jones & Greg Smith i dont want, no knock on them i just dont think they can bring anything amir doesnt give us already, and Amir Loves T.O. and Canada Loves Amir so no.

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