Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

If the team could stick a high-percentage 3pt shooter into the starting SG spot....

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    That would be like Christmas, your birthday and your income tax refund all landing on the same day.

    Comment


    • #17
      special1 wrote: View Post
      The bold sums up my opinion on this thread......


      Who is to say DeMar is traded for any of these players? The reason why I went with these players is because they are all easily attainable assuming they wish to play in Toronto (minus Dudley as he is with another team and Martin will likely cost too much).

      Your best five is often not the best five players.

      The Raptors are a collection of pieces that don't fit together... like Pete Rose:

      Last edited by mcHAPPY; Tue Jun 4, 2013, 12:01 PM.

      Comment


      • #18
        I'm sorry but they players MATT52 listed above are good shooters, but so was Jason Kapono...... Willie Green?? Are you serious? Please tell me you meant Danny or Jeff. Demar is currently/will be better than ALL of the players you listed above. It's nice when you get to play on the Clippers, Hawks, Thunder.....I wonder how these guys will look playing for the Raptors. Sure MAYBE they may make good fits (debateable)....BUT Do you really expect the Raptors to compete for a championship next year Matt52??

        What makes you think anyone of those players won't walk when they become free agents?? Do they even want to play in Toronto?? LOL Thats the part that gets me with these posters always throwing around DD's name in trades.

        Is DD the only good player on this team??
        Is he really the ONLY way we can improve our roster?

        I would argue that he's our best asset for a reason!! He has a mix of youth/potential/work ethic/scoring ability that NO ONE ELSE on our team has. If he's as horrible as MATT52 makes him out to be - WHY on earth would anyone else want DD??

        Please keep in mind that MATT52 was begging for the Rudy Gay trade (a guy that's basically a DD clone (with length) and costs twice as much.....lol The Collangelo school of team building at its best.....rash/quick decisions and constant turnover.

        Why on earth would we trade our best player (debateable) for older bench players / role players??? LOL

        Matt52 - If you want to impress me....PLEASE come up with trade scenarios for Bargnani, Fields, Kleiza or even Rudy Gay. That would be very interesting to see. ANY scenario where DD goes and the guys above are still around with a few bench players added would be unacceptable.

        If Fields is as good as you think he is, why can't he fetch us a decent role player or two? Isn't he healed now?

        Comment


        • #19
          special1 wrote: View Post
          I'm sorry but they players MATT52 listed above are good shooters, but so was Jason Kapono...... Willie Green?? Are you serious? Please tell me you meant Danny or Jeff. Demar is currently/will be better than ALL of the players you listed above. It's nice when you get to play on the Clippers, Hawks, Thunder.....I wonder how these guys will look playing for the Raptors. Sure MAYBE they may make good fits (debateable)....BUT Do you really expect the Raptors to compete for a championship next year Matt52??

          What makes you think anyone of those players won't walk when they become free agents?? Do they even want to play in Toronto?? LOL Thats the part that gets me with these posters always throwing around DD's name in trades.

          Is DD the only good player on this team??
          Is he really the ONLY way we can improve our roster?

          I would argue that he's our best asset for a reason!! He has a mix of youth/potential/work ethic/scoring ability that NO ONE ELSE on our team has. If he's as horrible as MATT52 makes him out to be - WHY on earth would anyone else want DD??

          Please keep in mind that MATT52 was begging for the Rudy Gay trade (a guy that's basically a DD clone (with length) and costs twice as much.....lol The Collangelo school of team building at its best.....rash/quick decisions and constant turnover.

          Why on earth would we trade our best player (debateable) for older bench players / role players??? LOL

          Matt52 - If you want to impress me....PLEASE come up with trade scenarios for Bargnani, Fields, Kleiza or even Rudy Gay. That would be very interesting to see. ANY scenario where DD goes and the guys above are still around with a few bench players added would be unacceptable.

          If Fields is as good as you think he is, why can't he fetch us a decent role player or two? Isn't he healed now?
          First, I don't think Matt was suggesting that the only roster move should be a straight-up trade of DeRozan for one of the players he listed. My assumption was that one of those players would be a decent replacement, should DeRozan wind up being traded (to address another need).

          Second, I think Matt (and others) are discussing DeRozan trades because DeRozan is likely the best trade asset the Raptors have, at least in terms of perceived value from other teams. Nobody is saying that he is the top priority to be traded in terms of value to the Raptors. Discussion of trades for Bargnani has been extremely well covered and the main reason why guys like Fields/Kleiza/Gay have not been discussed is because they're likely highly untradeable (exact opposite case of DeRozan) and we have no idea what their trade value might be (whereas most DeRozan scenarios have him being traded for all-star or at least near all-star level talent).

          Comment


          • #20
            special1 wrote: View Post
            I'm sorry but they players MATT52 listed above are good shooters, but so was Jason Kapono...... Willie Green?? Are you serious? Please tell me you meant Danny or Jeff. Demar is currently/will be better than ALL of the players you listed above. It's nice when you get to play on the Clippers, Hawks, Thunder.....I wonder how these guys will look playing for the Raptors. Sure MAYBE they may make good fits (debateable)....BUT Do you really expect the Raptors to compete for a championship next year Matt52??

            What makes you think anyone of those players won't walk when they become free agents?? Do they even want to play in Toronto?? LOL Thats the part that gets me with these posters always throwing around DD's name in trades.

            Is DD the only good player on this team??
            Is he really the ONLY way we can improve our roster?

            I would argue that he's our best asset for a reason!! He has a mix of youth/potential/work ethic/scoring ability that NO ONE ELSE on our team has. If he's as horrible as MATT52 makes him out to be - WHY on earth would anyone else want DD??

            Please keep in mind that MATT52 was begging for the Rudy Gay trade (a guy that's basically a DD clone (with length) and costs twice as much.....lol The Collangelo school of team building at its best.....rash/quick decisions and constant turnover.

            Why on earth would we trade our best player (debateable) for older bench players / role players??? LOL

            Matt52 - If you want to impress me....PLEASE come up with trade scenarios for Bargnani, Fields, Kleiza or even Rudy Gay. That would be very interesting to see. ANY scenario where DD goes and the guys above are still around with a few bench players added would be unacceptable.

            If Fields is as good as you think he is, why can't he fetch us a decent role player or two? Isn't he healed now?

            You cra cra

            All of your questions have been answered before and it is clear you are not reading my posts based on a number of the questions. I've put a lot of trade scenarios up for a lot of different players.

            What makes you so emotional towards DeRozan?

            Comment


            • #21
              I bet Pete Rose 20,000 he wouldn't wear that.
              For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

              Comment


              • #22
                thead wrote: View Post
                I bet Pete Rose 20,000 he wouldn't wear that.
                He probably didn't take you up on it though. I hear he only bets on baseball.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Matt52 wrote: View Post
                  The problem is those guys are under contract (like Dudley) but may not be available. If we were choosing who we want, I'd be going after Danny Green or Wesley Matthews or Sefolosha.

                  As for starting:

                  Hayward started 27 of 72 (29mpg)
                  Korver 60 of 74 (30mpg)
                  Dudley 50 of 79 (28mpg)
                  Dunleavy 3 of 75 (26mpg)
                  Redick 13 of 78 (30mpg)
                  Green 60 of 72 (17mpg)
                  Martin 0 of 77 (28mpg)

                  SG is such a weak spot in the NBA right now.
                  Which is why we may want to hold our horses on trading DeRozan, or if he is traded we just throw Ross in as the starter certainly he wont be such a liability playing beside Gay, Lowry a vet Big and JV. Ross can be better than all those guys if his 3 is dropping like it was in college plus he is crazy explosive on the attack.

                  Is Ross too small to learn a post up? hes tall for his position.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Matt52 wrote: View Post
                    Who is to say DeMar is traded for any of these players? The reason why I went with these players is because they are all easily attainable assuming they wish to play in Toronto (minus Dudley as he is with another team and Martin will likely cost too much).

                    Your best five is often not the best five players.

                    The Raptors are a collection of pieces that don't fit together... like Pete Rose:

                    1st bold - I think you meant to say your best five is often not your five best players - Which may be true - BUT when the game's on the line I always think you should go with your 5 best players (best defender, best rebounder, best scorer, best shooter, etc).

                    In this current NBA you need stars/talent to win. DD is still a VERY good player. You may not think so, but I believe it's due to Collangelo's team building where EVERYONE on this team seems to be worse because it is just a collection of pieces that don't really fit together.

                    Instead of Offering OJ Mayo a contract (to play our backup SG/spot starter who can also play some point - BC offers Landry fields an 18 million dollar contract). Instead of then picking Drummond in the draft, we pick T Ross...

                    Players like Jose, Jarrett Jack or even Bayless received a lot of flack from SOME fans because of decisions our former GM made putting the team together. HOPEFULLY, this will no longer be the case, now that Ujiri is back.

                    Personally, I think DD, AJ and JV are pieces that we HAVE to hold onto unless we're blown a way with an offer. DD/AJ loves the city and the fans love them.

                    P.S. Any GM worth his salt should find a way to trade Rudy over Demar. The guy makes twice as much as DD to put up (close to the same numbers). That's a no-brainer.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      I'm sorry but they players MATT52 listed above are good shooters, but so was Jason Kapono...... Willie Green?? Are you serious? Please tell me you meant Danny or Jeff. Demar is currently/will be better than ALL of the players you listed above. It's nice when you get to play on the Clippers, Hawks, Thunder.....I wonder how these guys will look playing for the Raptors. Sure MAYBE they may make good fits (debateable)....BUT Do you really expect the Raptors to compete for a championship next year Matt52??
                      DeMar is not currently the better player of all those. Didn't you click the link I provided? He was at the bottom of 7 statistical categories. Oh sure, he scores the most per game, but what happens if you give those other players 15 shots per game? What happens when you redistribtue DD's shots among Lowry-Gay-JV with floor spacers?

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      What makes you think anyone of those players won't walk when they become free agents?? Do they even want to play in Toronto?? LOL Thats the part that gets me with these posters always throwing around DD's name in trades.
                      Ummm. They were all free agents except Dudley and Green who is non-guaranteed.

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      Is DD the only good player on this team??
                      Is he really the ONLY way we can improve our roster?

                      I would argue that he's our best asset for a reason!! He has a mix of youth/potential/work ethic/scoring ability that NO ONE ELSE on our team has. If he's as horrible as MATT52 makes him out to be - WHY on earth would anyone else want DD??
                      I think there are a lot of teams who would balk at him. He is extremely overpaid. He is still relatively young but he is hardly cheap. His potential is likely maxed or near maxed unless he is the rare exception of guys who become great many years in to the league but considering he has been given the green light for 3 years I think what you see is what you get so remove the potential label. He definitely has scoring ability but he does it inefficiently - as every player I have listed is much more efficient and all except Green have more PPS.

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      Please keep in mind that MATT52 was begging for the Rudy Gay trade (a guy that's basically a DD clone (with length) and costs twice as much.....lol The Collangelo school of team building at its best.....rash/quick decisions and constant turnover.
                      Gay was always based on the premise Bargnani was a near all-star... whoops. Bargnani is also a great example of what happens when you expect guys to be more than they are.

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      Why on earth would we trade our best player (debateable) for older bench players / role players??? LOL
                      Read the post again. Who said anything about trading DeMar for any of these players? LOL

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      Matt52 - If you want to impress me....PLEASE come up with trade scenarios for Bargnani, Fields, Kleiza or even Rudy Gay. That would be very interesting to see. ANY scenario where DD goes and the guys above are still around with a few bench players added would be unacceptable.
                      I'm not out to impress you, special1.

                      special1 wrote: View Post
                      If Fields is as good as you think he is, why can't he fetch us a decent role player or two? Isn't he healed now?
                      Fields is actually overpaid, haven't you heard? At the end of last season he still wasn't 100%. You think a condition that has been effecting him for nearly 2 years is going to be fixed in 4 months? You don't need biomechanics or physiology courses to figure that out.
                      Last edited by mcHAPPY; Tue Jun 4, 2013, 12:46 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        special1 wrote: View Post
                        1st bold - I think you meant to say your best five is often not your five best players - Which may be true - BUT when the game's on the line I always think you should go with your 5 best players (best defender, best rebounder, best scorer, best shooter, etc).

                        In this current NBA you need stars/talent to win. DD is still a VERY good player. You may not think so, but I believe it's due to Collangelo's team building where EVERYONE on this team seems to be worse because it is just a collection of pieces that don't really fit together.

                        Instead of Offering OJ Mayo a contract (to play our backup SG/spot starter who can also play some point - BC offers Landry fields an 18 million dollar contract). Instead of then picking Drummond in the draft, we pick T Ross...

                        Players like Jose, Jarrett Jack or even Bayless received a lot of flack from SOME fans because of decisions our former GM made putting the team together. HOPEFULLY, this will no longer be the case, now that Ujiri is back.

                        Personally, I think DD, AJ and JV are pieces that we HAVE to hold onto unless we're blown a way with an offer. DD/AJ loves the city and the fans love them.

                        P.S. Any GM worth his salt should find a way to trade Rudy over Demar. The guy makes twice as much as DD to put up (close to the same numbers). That's a no-brainer.
                        You are gone off on numerous tangents. This is what the thread is about, from Chisholm:

                        An offense centered around Valanciunas-Gay-Lowry could be potent if balanced right, especially if the team could stick a high-percentage three-point shooter into the starting shooting guard spot.
                        Your bold P.S. - Big picture thinking time: Gay brings more to the table. You continue to focus on strictly points per game. Gay also is a huge expiring contract in 2 years. Can you tell me exactly what DeRozan has done in his time in Toronto to warrant such praise?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          The Raptors need a 3 and D guy on their roster (assuming Fields doesn't improve next year).

                          Lowe, back in April, talks about guys that fit the mold that we are talking about here:
                          http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...isdom-suggests

                          His nominees are:
                          Kawhi Leonard
                          Arron Afflalo
                          Matt Barnes
                          Caron Butler
                          Gerald Henderson
                          Jared Dudley
                          Jimmy Butler
                          Wesley Matthews
                          Corey Brewer
                          Danny Green
                          Quincy Pondexter

                          Would love someone like Matthews or Butler but it would be hard to pry them away from Portland/Chicago.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Matt52 wrote: View Post
                            You cra cra

                            All of your questions have been answered before and it is clear you are not reading my posts based on a number of the questions. I've put a lot of trade scenarios up for a lot of different players.

                            What makes you so emotional towards DeRozan?
                            I don't believe i'm emotional at all towards DD....I'm actually quite enthusiastic about my team. I live in Toronto and have followed the Raptors since day 1. Actually, they had us help pick the name in school if i remember correctly (Jurassic Park was very popular at the time).

                            I would gladly trade DD if we can get back an all-star quality player OR a couple of really good young players (unfortunately, not many realistic opportunites come to mind).

                            I understand you meant purely as a replacement (not necessarily in a trade involving the players) BUT at the same time I dont see why we cant get one of those players and keep DD.... It appears to me that those players are suited to be role players / 6th men type anyways.

                            Maybe you should read your thread and go over the names you suggest to replace DD with and ask yourself why anyone would be annoyed..... Willie Green?

                            The truth is many of us like the guy. I think he represents the Raptors well throughout the league. He's definitely far from perfect BUT he works pretty hard. Some of us believe he can get better. Maybe we're just not afraid of another Bargs situation because we notice the difference in the two. Honestly, I really don't know what exactly it is that we see in him that you guys don't. I personally think it would be a big mistake to trade him because i know his biggest flaws are defence and 3 point shooting. Both can be improved upon. I've seen it happen.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Matt it's easy to be very effecient when all you do is take open shot 3s. There is a reason why those players take 8 shots a game. If they did you would those effeciency drop dramatically. With the amount of minutes he plays and amount of shots he takes DD is one of most effecient 2 guards in the league. He shots %45 from the field. How many perimeter players shot over %50 in this league. It's not all about stats and fits. Wade and LeBron do not fit together at all but, they make it work. I don't think the duo of DD/RG are better but, I do think thier a better fit Wade/James.

                              DeMar is way more of slasher than Rudy is. Rudy plays kind of soft. All his moves to just create enough separation for his shot.

                              I do think that Rudy Gay's 3 point shot will come back this upcoming season. You have think about his body and psyche has been through the last couple years. He goes through a serious shoulder injury, that has out for a while. The next year he come back but, obviously his psyche off cause of his injury. He lacks confidence in his shot. It probably took him a full season to get back confidence. You think last summer he will work on his body to get back to form but, than women(grandmother) who raised him falls ill. The whole summer than becomes about her. Going into the season his grandmother's condition worsen in till she finally dies at the beginning of the season. Instead of having time to mourn like regular ppl he has to go perform when his mentally checkout. He finally gets trade and gets away from Memphis(where his grandmother lived with him in his home). The little things that would remind them of her are now gone. His able to focus to the task at hand more.

                              Now his gotten laser eye surgery to fix his version problem. I for one will really be surprised if Rudy shots under 35% from the the 3 this up and coming year.
                              @Chr1st1anL

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                to Me Rudy is confident in what he is DeMar never is guy is always looking to improve. Rudy still isnt working out or anything preparing for next season DeMar and Ross are. DeMar hitting 3s decently 31% or so the organization has to look at Rudy as the asset on the table to be traded. Ujiri stressed youth so Im pretty sure guys like DeMar, Ross, JV, Amir are safe I can see him grabbing some picks soon for this draft.

                                DeMar has been solid in his tenure its not his fault why the Raps suck, for the past 4 years hes been the only guy worth following the team for hes a guy surrounded by scrubs till most recently. DeMar is probably the only player the US media even knew about over here.
                                Last edited by Rapstor4Life; Tue Jun 4, 2013, 01:59 PM.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X