Primer wrote:
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Why aren't we going hard in the paint for Eric Bledsoe?
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Not that I think we should trade for Bledsoe, but Lowry is entering his 7th season in the league while Bledsoe is entering his 4th. Comparing both their 3rd seasons, and you have:
WS/48
Lowry .103
Bledsoe .115
TS%
Lowry .547
Bledsoe .513
eFG%
Lowry .464
Bledsoe .473
Ast%
Lowry 26.4%
Bledsoe 23.5%
Ortg
Lowry 109
Bledsoe 102
TRB%
Lowry 6.8%
Bledsoe 8.6%
Drtg
Lowry 108
Bledsoe 101
PER
Lowry 14.4
Bledsoe 17.3
Per 36 Ast/TO ratio
Lowry 2.36
Bledsoe 1.69
Suddenly a lot more comparable. 4 categories now go the other way. Bledsoe is clearly the favorite, but as I said I'm not fully on board with paying for Bledsoe -- much rather trade for PF (and I laugh at the suggestions of what we could do to get Bledsoe and Griffin -- it's not gonna happen. There's a very obvious reason why they were a playoff team and we weren't. We don't have the talent.)your pal,
ebrian
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Primer wrote: View PostHow about because Kyle Lowry is better than Bledsoe in just about every facet of the game? All this Bledsoe mania never made any sense to me. He is a fine backup PG, and that's it. Let's look at some advanced stats to compare the two.
WS/48
Lowry .133
Bledsoe .115
TS%
Lowry .543
Bledsoe .513
eFG%
Lowry .482
Bledsoe .473
Ast%
Lowry 34.6%
Bledsoe 23.5%
Ortg
Lowry 110
Bledsoe 102
TRB%
Lowry 9.5%
Bledsoe 8.6%
Drtg
Lowry 106
Bledsoe 101
PER
Lowry 17.5
Bledsoe 17.3
Per 36 Ast/TO ratio
Lowry 2.79
Bledsoe 1.69
Literally the only category that Bledsoe is better than Lowry in is Drtg by a small but appreciable margin. Everything else Lowry trumps him, and he trumps him by a lot in the stats that really matter for PG's (Ast%, Ast/TO ratio). Not to mention this was a poor shooting year for Lowry, yet he still easily outperformed Bledsoe. Also, Bledsoe is also signed for just one more year, so we'd have to resign him to a similar amount we'd have to pay Lowry, so it really is a straight up comparison.
So, please remind me again why we would want Bledsoe over Lowry in the first place?
DRTG should not be used to compare players across teams, atleast not directly.
Its opposition pts scored per 100 possessions, while said player is on the floor. To put in a simple, although not all together accurate way, teammates account for 80% of a players DRTG.
It is useful for making comparison to the team itself (was he a net negative or positive) and across teammates.
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ebrian wrote: View PostNot that I think we should trade for Bledsoe, but Lowry is entering his 7th season in the league while Bledsoe is entering his 4th. Comparing both their 3rd seasons, and you have:
WS/48
Lowry .103
Bledsoe .115
TS%
Lowry .547
Bledsoe .513
eFG%
Lowry .464
Bledsoe .473
Ast%
Lowry 26.4%
Bledsoe 23.5%
Ortg
Lowry 109
Bledsoe 102
TRB%
Lowry 6.8%
Bledsoe 8.6%
Drtg
Lowry 108
Bledsoe 101
PER
Lowry 14.4
Bledsoe 17.3
Per 36 Ast/TO ratio
Lowry 2.36
Bledsoe 1.69
Suddenly a lot more comparable. 4 categories now go the other way. Bledsoe is clearly the favorite, but as I said I'm not fully on board with paying for Bledsoe -- much rather trade for PF (and I laugh at the suggestions of what we could do to get Bledsoe and Griffin -- it's not gonna happen. There's a very obvious reason why they were a playoff team and we weren't. We don't have the talent.)
Why exactly do you like Bledsoe? How is he anything more than a backup PG with a weak Ast/TO ratio?
Considering we already have Lowry, and we'd have to give up assets to get Bledsoe, and Bledsoe is the inferior player, I really don't see any reason at all to try and trade for him.
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Craiger wrote: View PostDRTG should not be used to compare players across teams, atleast not directly.
Its opposition pts scored per 100 possessions, while said player is on the floor. To put in a simple, although not all together accurate way, teammates account for 80% of a players DRTG.
It is useful for making comparison to the team itself (was he a net negative or positive) and across teammates.
The other site I like for defensive comparisons is 82games and opponent counterpart PER.
Lowry 15.6
Bledsoe 14.9
So similar to above, Bledsoe is a slightly better defender. Not nearly enough to offset how much worse he is on the offensive end, both scoring and passing.Last edited by Primer; Tue Jun 25, 2013, 06:51 PM.
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ceez wrote: View PostWord is the clips are shopping Bledsoe pretty hard, looking for a sg, don't we have a sg we'd be more than willing to part with for a future starter at PG?
Doesn't Rivers LOVE Derozen supposedly? Was he just blowing smoke up our chimney? Is there a trade to be had here? why am i speaking in questions?If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?
Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.
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Primer wrote: View PostEven with you cherry picking seasons, which makes pretty much no sense since we'd have to pay both guys about the same after this year when their contracts are up, Lowry still dominates in the categories that matter for a PG (ast%, and ast/to ratio). He also has a much better Ortg and TS%.
Why exactly do you like Bledsoe? How is he anything more than a backup PG with a weak Ast/TO ratio?
Considering we already have Lowry, and we'd have to give up assets to get Bledsoe, and Bledsoe is the inferior player, I really don't see any reason at all to try and trade for him.your pal,
ebrian
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Primer wrote: View PostI worked with the best stat available. If you have a preferred stat to compare defensive performance then by all means please add that comparison to the discussion.
The other site I like for defensive comparisons is 82games and opponent counterpart PER.
Lowry 15.6
Bledsoe 14.9
So similar to above, Bledsoe is a slightly better defender. Not nearly enough to offset how much worse he is on the offensive end, both scoring and passing.
Not perfect but all help paint a picture.
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ebrian wrote: View PostAs I said, I don't see any reason at all to try to trade for him either. Both are backup point guards in the NBA. One is 3 years younger and already as good as the other, but again, they're both backups. Throw Bledsoe on a non-playoff team and he'd start as many games as Lowry did and post similar numbers.
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ebrian wrote: View PostAs I said, I don't see any reason at all to try to trade for him either. Both are backup point guards in the NBA. One is 3 years younger and already as good as the other, but again, they're both backups. Throw Bledsoe on a non-playoff team and he'd start as many games as Lowry did and post similar numbers.
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Primer wrote: View PostI worked with the best stat available. If you have a preferred stat to compare defensive performance then by all means please add that comparison to the discussion.
The other site I like for defensive comparisons is 82games and opponent counterpart PER.
Lowry 15.6
Bledsoe 14.9
So similar to above, Bledsoe is a slightly better defender. Not nearly enough to offset how much worse he is on the offensive end, both scoring and passing.
A few others that are useable would be:
defensive on/off
Bledsoe: -4.9
Lowry: -0.3
Player Drtg - Team Drtg
Bledsoe: -2.6
Lowry: -1.5
DWS/48 (think I did this right, but rushed it cause I don't think people will care that much)
Bledsoe: 0.127
Lowry: 0.071
The way I see it, Lowry is a better offensive player and Bledsoe a better defensive player. However, the difference between Lowry's better offense > than Bledsoe better defense. (does that make sense?)
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