Hindsight. We finally get to use it. Right up until going on to lose a heartbreaker to the pacers on opening night, we all debated extension vs restricted free agency for DeMar. So, now that the money is starting be thrown around at restricted free agents and others, it's a chance to see where we may have been if Colangelo didn't hand out that contract (stop laughing...it could happen). Tyreke Evans getting offered $44 million plus. Comparable? Who else? I'm not asking if DD is worth the contract. That's been beaten elsewhere. Just what might we have been facing now if he wasn't extended?
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Craiger wrote: View PostWe'd be facing the opportunity to let him walk instead of paying him too much for too little production.
Not a bad thing in my opinion.
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He would be a rfa and as such we have the right to match what the market would determine. In a way DD's contract is setting the market for Evans. As well...who is the better talent Tyreke Evans or DD? And this team lost flexibility by committing already to DD when it was done. I suppose the main reason for BC for doing this was he saw him as a core member of the team going forward. I did not and it seems he is in play by MU...but possibly constrained because of the contract.
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Craiger wrote: View PostWe'd be facing the opportunity to let him walk instead of paying him too much for too little production.
Not a bad thing in my opinion.
CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View PostOr use him in S&T to acquire a younger/cheaper/better player and/or one who plays a position of need and/or who fits with the rest of the Raptors roster better than he does - such as Dallas looking to S&T Mayo to LAC for Bledsoe, or Milwaukee looking to S&T Reddick to LAC for Bledsoe.
Bendit wrote: View PostHe would be a rfa and as such we have the right to match what the market would determine. In a way DD's contract is setting the market for Evans. As well...who is the better talent Tyreke Evans or DD? And this team lost flexibility by committing already to DD when it was done. I suppose the main reason for BC for doing this was he saw him as a core member of the team going forward. I did not and it seems he is in play by MU...but possibly constrained because of the contract.
No
"As well...who is the better talent Tyreke Evans or DD?"
Some would call that debatable, but that's not the topic. Evans got an offer of $1.5M/yr more than DD (another report had $2.5M/yr more), but we'll not know if DD may have gotten equal or more. Not only different skillsets, but apparently very different personalities/characters, and some teams value the DDs of the world more. In any case, if you feel Tyreke is worth more, then you should be happy that he's getting more, right?
"it seems he is in play by MU."
Did I miss something? Where has MU put him in play? You're not talking the Bledsoe speculation are you? Because nothing about that story says anything of the kind.Last edited by p00ka; Mon Jul 1, 2013, 10:46 PM.
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" In a way DD's contract is setting the market for Evans."
No
"As well...who is the better talent Tyreke Evans or DD?"
Some would call that debatable, but that's not the topic. Evans got an offer of $1.5M/yr (another report had $2.5M/yr), but we'll not know if DD may have gotten equal or more. Not only different skillsets, but apparently very different personalities/characters, and some teams value the DDs of the world more. In any case, if you feel Tyreke is worth more, then you should be happy that he's getting more, right?
"it seems he is in play by MU."
Did I miss something? Where has MU put him in play? You're not talking the Bledsoe speculation are you? Because nothing about that story says anything of the kind.
Second bold: Not going to quibble on this. Its what we do here...have opinions on players. The point was the early signing set a bar. And the more important one was it didnt need to be done. It has to do with the flexibility that was deprived the Raps not what TE ultimately is able to sign for. Due to many factors sometimes lesser players are able to sign larger contracts. eg. BC had enabled that quite liberally.
Third bold: I offer the following as an eg./basis for that statement. Possibility exists u dont read all the gossip:
"The Clippers, though, have been lukewarm on Toronto's pitches so far, sources say. The Raptors have been openly shopping out-of-favor forward Andrea Bargnani and have likewise pitched a trade scenario in which L.A. would receive both Bargnani and shooting guard DeMar DeRozan, but sources say that new Clippers coach Doc Rivers -- who was also named senior vice president of basketball operations -- continues to express interest in not only hanging onto Bledsoe but also keeping center DeAndre Jordan. ESPN.com"
....from the Hoopshype site
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Bendit wrote: View PostFirst bold: You didnt say why not? They are both SGs and DD got signed before TE so TE's agent worked off of that number plus ancillary items like current demand for TE and possibly stats (have not checked into that). Besides TE fancies himself as a PG as well I believe.
Second bold: Not going to quibble on this. Its what we do here...have opinions on players. The point was the early signing set a bar. And the more important one was it didnt need to be done. It has to do with the flexibility that was deprived the Raps not what TE ultimately is able to sign for. Due to many factors sometimes lesser players are able to sign larger contracts. eg. BC had enabled that quite liberally.
Third bold: I offer the following as an eg./basis for that statement. Possibility exists u dont read all the gossip:
"The Clippers, though, have been lukewarm on Toronto's pitches so far, sources say. The Raptors have been openly shopping out-of-favor forward Andrea Bargnani and have likewise pitched a trade scenario in which L.A. would receive both Bargnani and shooting guard DeMar DeRozan, but sources say that new Clippers coach Doc Rivers -- who was also named senior vice president of basketball operations -- continues to express interest in not only hanging onto Bledsoe but also keeping center DeAndre Jordan. ESPN.com"
....from the Hoopshype site
3rd bold: Oh, I read most of the gossip, but just don't waste time taking them as more than anonymous speculation to stoke the passions of naive fans that need a fix. Some turn out to be true, but many not. If you wish to play along with that game, be my guest, but I'm saying I don't think it's fair to MU or DD or the Raps to be spouting it as truth.
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p00ka wrote: View Post1st & 2nd bold; I didn't explain because I think it's ridiculous to suggest one player's contract set the bar for another. The NBA isn't 30 mom & pop corner stores and negotiating contracts factors in many much more important factors than DDs contract.
3rd bold: Oh, I read most of the gossip, but just don't waste time taking them as more than anonymous speculation to stoke the passions of naive fans that need a fix. Some turn out to be true, but many not. If you wish to play along with that game, be my guest, but I'm saying I don't think it's fair to MU or DD or the Raps to be spouting it as truth.
On the second para: Are you sure you are not wasting your time tapping out condescending notes on a frivolous subject such as the misfortunes of the Raptors Basketball club and the skills or future prospects of Demar D.? Alas I am unlike you it seems restricted to sites like ESPN for my information. Even then I try to filter out the Stephen Smiths. You must have more pristine contacts.
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Tyreke Evans is as comparable as it gets to Derozan. Same draft, same position, and same not quite living up to their potential. The fact that Evans got offered $12M per year over 4 years ($2.5M more per year than Derozan) makes it clear it was a good idea to lock up Derozan when we did. Even if you don't think he's a good fit for the team (I'm not terribly attached to him), we can now use him as a valuable trade asset. After what we got for Bargs imagine what we could get for Derozan (could probably return a 2014 lotto pick + decent player). If we waited until someone like New Orleans offered him 4 years $48M, we'd either get stuck not matching and get nothing or have to take on a particularly onerous contract. The DD signing looks very reasonable in hindsight. Dare I say it, it looks good.
Something like this seems plausible to me:
To Cleveland:
Derozan
To Toronto:
Tristan Thompson
Alonzo Gee
Cavs Top 3 protected 2014 draft pickLast edited by Primer; Tue Jul 2, 2013, 03:38 AM.
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Primer wrote: View PostSomething like this seems plausible to me:
To Cleveland:
Derozan
To Toronto:
Tristan Thompson
Alonzo Gee
Cavs Top 3 protected 2014 draft pick
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Primer wrote: View PostTyreke Evans is as comparable as it gets to Derozan. Same draft, same position, and same not quite living up to their potential. The fact that Evans got offered $12M per year over 4 years ($2.5M more per year than Derozan) makes it clear it was a good idea to lock up Derozan when we did. Even if you don't think he's a good fit for the team (I'm not terribly attached to him), we can now use him as a valuable trade asset. After what we got for Bargs imagine what we could get for Derozan (could probably return a 2014 lotto pick + decent player). If we waited until someone like New Orleans offered him 4 years $48M, we'd either get stuck not matching and get nothing or have to take on a particularly onerous contract. The DD signing looks very reasonable in hindsight. Dare I say it, it looks good.
Something like this seems plausible to me:
To Cleveland:
Derozan
To Toronto:
Tristan Thompson
Alonzo Gee
Cavs Top 3 protected 2014 draft pick
But I doubt such a deal goes through. 2014 draft picks.....so hard to gauge their value. I have a hard time seeing Cleveland give one up.
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If he wasn't extended, there wouldn't have been a precedent for Evans. He might have gotten the same offer, or he might have not. Either way, the Raptors would have had options as to what to do with him. I'm thinking since Ujiri has put him on the block, he'd rather just have the cap space and make his own free-agent decisions than work via trade.
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