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Pistons interested in Rudy Gay

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  • #91
    Guys forget the Wiggins we have got 1/15 chance to get him. Why to bother? Why to set yourselves for another total dissapointment. Let's talk about playofffs not about another year of pointless "tanking" (7-11). I'm surprised you are not tired of this eternal tanking. Let's leave that for Bobcats..
    Official Pope of the Raptors sponsored by MLSE.

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    • #92
      This pitch from Detroit was so goddam insulting *** also let me add Raptors having lots of financial flexibilty means nothing until we string together playoff years and show players in the league that Toronto is irrelevant..... financial flexibility and CAP means nothing to a losing team.

      Ujiri isn't a tanking devotees GM, he builds teams.
      Last edited by Rapstor4Life; Wed Jul 3, 2013, 10:34 AM.

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      • #93
        RandomGuy wrote: View Post
        Guys forget the Wiggins we have got 1/15 chance to get him. Why to bother? Why to set yourselves for another total dissapointment. Let's talk about playofffs not about another year of pointless "tanking" (7-11). I'm surprised you are not tired of this eternal tanking. Let's leave that for Bobcats..
        Wiggins isn't the only savior in this draft. Lots of players at the top, Jabari Parker, Julius Randle, or Marcus Smart all would be difference makers. This draft isn't just talented, it's deep.
        Heir, Prince of Cambridge

        If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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        • #94
          I was indeed being sarcastic when I proposed that Rudy deal with Charlotte.

          That having been said: BC met the price Memphis set for Rudy, which was: two good players (one large expiring contract, one young), a second-rounder and cash. That price was predicated on the idea that Memphis without Rudy was worse and Toronto with Rudy was a playoff threat. Guess what happened? Memphis got better without Rudy and Toronto basically stayed the same. Rudy's value has gone down, so expecting to get same return on Rudy's contract if we trade him is a bit naive.

          In seriousness, I would do the trade for Stuckey, KCP, and Detroit's lottery pick in 2014 or a first-rounder in 2016 if Charlotte snags the 2014 pick instead. Stuckey is good enough to be a third-string PG, at least, and he's a decent expiring contract ($8.5 million), KCP is a future answer at shooting guard which frees up DeMar for a potential trade, and the pick is the rest of the compensation. I'd say that's less value then went out for Rudy, but still significant.

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          • #95
            Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
            This pitch from Detroit was so goddam insulting *** also let me add Raptors having lots of financial flexibilty means nothing until we string together playoff years and show players in the league that Toronto is irrelevant..... financial flexibility and CAP means nothing to a losing team.

            Ujiri isn't a tanking devotees GM, he builds teams.
            Flexibility gives us the chance to be more active in trades and the ability to pounce when a guy is available. Being flexible isn't the same as having cap room, it means having lots of well priced assets that can be moved easily. The problem for the Raps to trade anyone is the salaries on this bloated roster. Gay, DeRozan, & Fields (formerly Bargnani) are harder to deal because of their price tag. If any one of those guys was half the price, the Raps would have plenty of offers and could bring in real assets for the future.
            Heir, Prince of Cambridge

            If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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            • #96
              Rudy Gay will be much more valuable if he has his break out season this year and Masai can Melo the shit out of him next year.
              For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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              • #97
                thead wrote: View Post
                Rudy Gay will be much more valuable if he has his break out season this year and Masai can Melo the shit out of him next year.
                I know when I look for a breakout season, I turn to a 27-year old player entering his eighth season. That's when breakouts happen.

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                • #98
                  I am so torn as to what direction I want MU to go.

                  On one hand, retooling to make a legit run at the 2nd round of the playoffs while also keeping an eye on the future, makes a lot of sense. With successfull tanking being such an uncertainty (many tankers, near impossible to trade for 2014 1st round picks, draft lottery luck, etc...), I'm still not ready to fully commit to it.

                  On the other hand, I'd have no issue tearing down the entire roster and trading everybody not named Valanciunas. I wouldn't want to see the top assets (ie: Gay, DeRozan, Lowry, Ross) traded just for expiring contracts and draft picks though (even 2014 picks). I'd definitely want to see good young talent coming back in trade as well, in addition to the expiring contracts and draft picks. In this case, I'd want to see the team built with success starting in 2-3 seasons being the plan, which gets faithfully adhered to throughout the next 2-3 seasons.

                  The Bargnani move was as much about 'addition by subraction' and didn't really give away MU's intentions. The next move(s) should definitely give us a much better indication of which direction this team is going.

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                  • #99
                    magoon wrote: View Post
                    I was indeed being sarcastic when I proposed that Rudy deal with Charlotte.

                    That having been said: BC met the price Memphis set for Rudy, which was: two good players (one large expiring contract, one young), a second-rounder and cash. That price was predicated on the idea that Memphis without Rudy was worse and Toronto with Rudy was a playoff threat. Guess what happened? Memphis got better without Rudy and Toronto basically stayed the same. Rudy's value has gone down, so expecting to get same return on Rudy's contract if we trade him is a bit naive.

                    In seriousness, I would do the trade for Stuckey, KCP, and Detroit's lottery pick in 2014 or a first-rounder in 2016 if Charlotte snags the 2014 pick instead. Stuckey is good enough to be a third-string PG, at least, and he's a decent expiring contract ($8.5 million), KCP is a future answer at shooting guard which frees up DeMar for a potential trade, and the pick is the rest of the compensation. I'd say that's less value then went out for Rudy, but still significant.
                    Memphis had additional criteria in trading Gay. There were numerous financial considerations limiting what they were willing to take back.

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                    • First, can someone confirm if Rudy Gay's contract has the potential to save a luxury tax team something in the range of $40 million? If so isn't there huge value in holding onto him? Lakers, New Jersey, New York and soon Clippers will all be in the luxury tax won't they?

                      Secondly, I don't know if Detroit really wants Rudy Gay or if they want his contract for when it expires. Remember when Miami took Jermaine Oneal's contract off our hands?

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                      • magoon wrote: View Post
                        I know when I look for a breakout season, I turn to a 27-year old player entering his eighth season. That's when breakouts happen.
                        generally you would be correct.

                        BUT i counter thusly

                        1.) Corrective eye surgery

                        2.) Transition to 1st option from 3rd

                        3.) 10 - 15lbs of additional muscle

                        4.) That would be his contract year next year. Further ridiculous payouts would require he tear it up
                        For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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                        • Mediumcore wrote: View Post
                          First, can someone confirm if Rudy Gay's contract has the potential to save a luxury tax team something in the range of $40 million? If so isn't there huge value in holding onto him? Lakers, New Jersey, New York and soon Clippers will all be in the luxury tax won't they?

                          Secondly, I don't know if Detroit really wants Rudy Gay or if they want his contract for when it expires. Remember when Miami took Jermaine Oneal's contract off our hands?
                          Detroit has just $1M guaranteed for next season and $21M on the books for 8 players.

                          Granted, one of those players is Monroe who is due for a raise but has a $5.5M QO and $8M cap hold.

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                          • Just gut it

                            Matt52 wrote: View Post
                            I'd have no problem trading BOTH.

                            In fact part of me hopes it happens.

                            Both players are vastly overpaid and limited.

                            They are from an era where individual pieces were valued and collected rather than building a team.



                            The Pistons and Bucks are two teams I'd keep an eye on. Both are in no position to lose (Pistons because they have been losing forever and have 2014 pick heading out; Bucks trying to build a new arena with public money and with owner concerned about profits first and foremost).
                            Agreed. BC's past moves were so glaring at this point. I want picks, a player w/ potential, and one expiring please for Mr. Gay. God, every time I look at that feature where Demar runs in the tunnel to sign his new contract, the angrier I get.
                            “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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                            • If I was him I would look to secure his current pay out rate for another long term contract, 5 years at least.
                              This way, if I were to fall backwards in production, I'm just under the 'all star' payrate, and yet, if I have sparks of achievement, I'm still quoted as 'almost allstar'.

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                              • Matt52 wrote: View Post
                                Detroit has just $1M guaranteed for next season and $21M on the books for 8 players.

                                Granted, one of those players is Monroe who is due for a raise but has a $5.5M QO and $8M cap hold.
                                This. Detroit is busy negotiating with Iggy and Josh Smith for the same reason: they want a stud who can play small forward (Smith is more of a power forward, but he can play the 3) to complete their starting five, and they can afford to overpay a little. Rudy is actually a safer bet for them; he's younger than Iggy or Smith and they can turn at least one of their terrible expiring deals into part of Rudy's contract, which would give them more flexibility to pursue the other pieces they need.

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