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Thread: Sammy Yatim: Whats your opinion?

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Default Sammy Yatim: Whats your opinion?

    After having a few days to process the information that has come through, and there has been a lot of it, I think I've developed my opinion on the situation...


    I think its absolutely OUTRAGEOUS people are protesting this shooting.

    The guy pulls a knife (and his c*ck out) on a streetcar and tells nobody to get off. Sounds f*cking twisted to me, and not someone I want roaming the streets and riding the same streetcars as me.. he threatened countless amounts of people. The police told him numerous times to put the knife down and he called them "pussies" in response.
    He would've hurt someone eventually. Better him than an innocent bystander.

    What do you think? Am I way off for feeling like this?
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    Raptors Republic Superstar lilmamba_'s Avatar
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    my first reaction- is this man crazy, good thing he died
    my reaction after seeing the video- man, what was it a 4'' knife? there where 4 police men around, they could have went up to him and pinned him or something, its your job to stop him not kill him. nine bullets too....

    i get what he did was terribly wrong but he could have served for his retardedness later on.
    i dont know much, but wasn't a taser an option that could have came before a bullet?
    What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
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    Quote lilmamba_ wrote: View Post
    my first reaction- is this man crazy, good thing he died
    my reaction after seeing the video- man, what was it a 4'' knife? there where 4 police men around, they could have went up to him and pinned him or something, its your job to stop him not kill him. nine bullets too....

    i get what he did was terribly wrong but he could have served for his retardedness later on.
    i dont know much, but wasn't a taser an option that could have came before a bullet?
    There's a video of a guy killing 4 armed police officers with a knife. If a person with a knife is in a certain range, they can lunge at you and stab you before you even have time to fire your gun at them.

    Which one of those guys is supposed to go up and pin him and get stabbed? The guy was asked repeatedly to drop the weapon and he didn't, so they shot him. If they had tried to do what you suggested and a police officer ended up getting stabbed and killed, people would be complaining that they didn't take action fast enough.

    The reason it took nine bullets is because the guy kept getting up after being shot because he was on some type of drugs.

    Life Lesson: Do what the police fucking tell you and don't do drugs.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar lilmamba_'s Avatar
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    Quote Xixak wrote: View Post
    There's a video of a guy killing 4 armed police officers with a knife. If a person with a knife is in a certain range, they can lunge at you and stab you before you even have time to fire your gun at them.

    Which one of those guys is supposed to go up and pin him and get stabbed? The guy was asked repeatedly to drop the weapon and he didn't, so they shot him. If they had tried to do what you suggested and a police officer ended up getting stabbed and killed, people would be complaining that they didn't take action fast enough.

    The reason it took nine bullets is because the guy kept getting up after being shot because he was on some type of drugs.

    Life Lesson: Do what the police fucking tell you and don't do drugs.
    now it makes sense but tell me smart one, why didnt they taser him
    What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
    The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
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    There's no universe in which what happened to this kid is ok. I don't care what kind of threat he is. Cops are not executioners. To shoot first, well, the threat better be something much more significant than a cracked out kid (I don't know if he was on something, have they said that yet? Either way he was clearly not in his right mind) with a knife in an empty streetcar, surrounded by cops who are on average probably 50 lbs heavier than him, and trained to diffuse situations, including disarming perps without the use of lethal force.

    It's so not ok to shoot that kid, and there's no argument that favours it. You can't say "maybe he'd hurt somebody", because then we might as well gun down every kid who's ever pulled a knife (or any weapon really) and/or has a violent history. And again, they shot this kid 9 times. That's shoot to kill, not incapacitate. There's no doubt in my mind this cop decided "if this kid doesn't do exactly what I tell him I'm going to light him up", and that's a stupidly dangerous mentality to have with your police force. The more force is used, the less credibility police have.

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    Quote Xixak wrote: View Post
    There's a video of a guy killing 4 armed police officers with a knife. If a person with a knife is in a certain range, they can lunge at you and stab you before you even have time to fire your gun at them.

    Which one of those guys is supposed to go up and pin him and get stabbed? The guy was asked repeatedly to drop the weapon and he didn't, so they shot him. If they had tried to do what you suggested and a police officer ended up getting stabbed and killed, people would be complaining that they didn't take action fast enough.

    The reason it took nine bullets is because the guy kept getting up after being shot because he was on some type of drugs.

    Life Lesson: Do what the police fucking tell you and don't do drugs.
    He didn't keep getting up what are you talking about?

    You see in the video that 3 billets are fired and then the police changed his stance and lowers the gun as if he is aiming lower towards the ground and fires 6 more times and then finally they taser him. The kid was not standing or "getting up" after the 3 bullets.

    That's what I saw from the video.

    First 3 bullets are warranted if they believe he was an extremely dangerous threat.

    6 bullets after and then a taser. That is beyond excessive force. You'd think they were trying to kill the terminator or sonething..
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    Quote lilmamba_ wrote: View Post
    now it makes sense but tell me smart one, why didnt they taser him
    Because in order to taser someone you need to get very close to them, which is dangerous when the person has a knife (also most tasers only have one shot). Also none of the police officers on site had tasers apparently.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar lilmamba_'s Avatar
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    Quote Xixak wrote: View Post
    Because in order to taser someone you need to get very close to them, which is dangerous when the person has a knife (also most tasers only have one shot). Also none of the police officers on site had tasers apparently.
    a four inch knife, much harm cant be done -4 officers to one sammy
    What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
    The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
    No Where Near the South Side #WeTheNorth

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    Quote Xixak wrote: View Post
    Because in order to taser someone you need to get very close to them, which is dangerous when the person has a knife (also most tasers only have one shot). Also none of the police officers on site had tasers apparently.
    where are you getting this info from? Did you watch the video? They tasered his dead body...!!
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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    Raptors Republic Superstar lilmamba_'s Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    where are you getting this info from? Did you watch the video? They tasered his dead body...!!
    they did!??!?!?!
    What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
    The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
    No Where Near the South Side #WeTheNorth

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    Quote lilmamba_ wrote: View Post
    they did!??!?!?!
    http://globalnews.ca/news/753484/com...atim-shooting/

    After all nine shots are fired into the streetcar, several other officers gather and wait more than 30 seconds before using a Taser on the 18-year-old Yatim as he lay on the floor.
    EDIT:Here's a better video adn article

    http://globalnews.ca/news/751568/wat...hooting-video/
    Last edited by LBF; Fri Aug 2nd, 2013 at 10:41 PM.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar Mack North's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    After having a few days to process the information that has come through, and there has been a lot of it, I think I've developed my opinion on the situation...


    I think its absolutely OUTRAGEOUS people are protesting this shooting.

    The guy pulls a knife (and his c*ck out) on a streetcar and tells nobody to get off. Sounds f*cking twisted to me, and not someone I want roaming the streets and riding the same streetcars as me.. he threatened countless amounts of people. The police told him numerous times to put the knife down and he called them "pussies" in response.
    He would've hurt someone eventually. Better him than an innocent bystander.

    What do you think? Am I way off for feeling like this?
    Gotta disagree Joey. There had to have been plenty other ways for them to go about the situation.
    From what I've read, he didn't seem to be in his right state of mind(could've been whacked out on some pill), and he wasn't exactly showing aggression towards the other riders from the interview I read yesterday from one female witness from NY or something. I'm not excusing his actions whatsoever, and he definitely had something coming to him... but, there was no reason to use deadly force when they did.

    Couldn't they have tased(sp?) him from the beginning? Maybe throw a smoke bomb on there and try to subdue him that way? Shoot him in the leg? 3 initial shots followed up by 6 more? That's insane. He didn't have any hostages. And finally the police supervisor shows up and tazes him after he's been shot numerous times? I dunno man, that just seems senseless.
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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    While I can't disagree with the 'excessive force' argument, the fact remains, no police officer should be put into the scenario where they are forced to try and take this guy down when he's got a knife and won't drop it, despite warning and commands from armed police officers. At this point, if you've got a gun pointed at him, and he still doesn't drop it (and calls you a pussy), you know he's looking for trouble.

    I honestly think this guy was trying to commit 'suicide by cop'.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_by_cop
    The most common scenario is pointing a firearm at a police officer or an innocent person, which would reasonably provoke an officer to fire on them in defense. However, many variants exist; for example, attacking with a knife or other hand weapon, trying to run an officer or other person over with a car, or trying to trigger a (real or presumed) explosive device.
    Last edited by Joey; Sat Aug 3rd, 2013 at 03:00 AM.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar Mack North's Avatar
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    http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2013...al_threat.html

    That's one article I read. I'm not sure why it hasn't come out yet, but I haven't read anything about a drug analysis on his body(I may have missed it). None of his friends seem to have knowledge of him doing hard drugs, but it's a little weird that he was just staring straight forward, jaw clenched. It really sounds like he was on something, other than weed and booze. I could be wrong, but hey... it'll be nice to hear more of the story once the SIU is done.

    To me, all that doesn't even matter. I just feel that he didn't pose enough of a threat to warrant being shot at 9 times and then tazed. There had to be a better solution with all the police officers that were around.

    While I first thought you were way off in saying it was a way to commit suicide, you may have a point. It seems he may have been depressed... http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ticle13587522/
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    While I can't disagree with the 'excessive force' argument, the fact remains, no police officer should be put into the scenario where they are forced to try and take this guy down when he's got a knife and won't drop it, despite warning and commands from armed police officers. At this point, if you've got a gun pointed at him, and he still doesn't drop it (and calls you a pussy), you know he's looking for trouble.

    I honestly think this guy was trying to commit 'suicide by cop'.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_by_cop
    Yeah, but that doesn't mean your solution is to empty a cartridge on his ass. I can't find a single version from the videos where it appears this kid is any threat.

    I understand the "he could be dangerous", and "someone doesn't need much tie or space to inflict injury", but he was confined in a streetcar. He had no direct path to attack any cop, as he had to navigate around the rails and stairs of the streetcar entrance.

    And then, just to add something totally random to the discussion, if my buddy, who's about my size at 5'10, 180lbs, could be a bouncer at peel pub, taking guys down twice his size, sometimes with bottles (or broken bottles), and a couple of times even with knives....then a platoon of armed police officers could've have certainly taken down this kid without shooting him 9 times.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mr.Z's Avatar
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    What I think is police should be better trained to deescalate situations by speaking, I mean, any person can say "put the knife down" and then shoot the person nine times. Anyone could do that, as a police office though you should be better than that and not have to resort to that option so quickly.

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    Not to mention the police were wearing vests and had tasers so the chance of Sammy stabbing one of those police officers to death had they simply tasered him and then subdued him is highly unlikely.

    The kid did not have to die, he was clearly in the wrong but he didn't deserve death.

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    Quote Mr.Z wrote: View Post
    Not to mention the police were wearing vests and had tasers so the chance of Sammy stabbing one of those police officers to death had they simply tasered him and then subdued him is highly unlikely.

    The kid did not have to die, he was clearly in the wrong but he didn't deserve death.
    The sergeant on squad is the only one with a taser and if you check out the video in that second article I posted it explains the situation in the video step-by-step
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    While I can't disagree with the 'excessive force' argument, the fact remains, no police officer should be put into the scenario where they are forced to try and take this guy down when he's got a knife and won't drop it, despite warning and commands from armed police officers. At this point, if you've got a gun pointed at him, and he still doesn't drop it (and calls you a pussy), you know he's looking for trouble.

    I honestly think this guy was trying to commit 'suicide by cop'.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_by_cop
    They are police officers, they're paid to deal with these sorts of situations.

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    Quote Mr.Z wrote: View Post
    They are police officers, they're paid to deal with these sorts of situations.
    I don't know how this is in Canada, but most police officers over here don't get into these kind of situations daily. It also doesn't matter that they are paid to deal with these situations, it's more about proper training and evaluating whether they are capable of handling these kind of situations.

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