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Thread: Tim Leiweke Apologizes to Colangelo

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    All due respect Pele, I'm pretty sure I am not missing anything here. Perhaps when a person feels like stating a guy should be "booted and pissed on" when speaking of a Managerial dismissal in pro sports may actually be missing the point more.

    Business and the politics of corporate structure, culture, and public identity are pretty complicated man, maybe you don't think they are, and thats your right, to have that opinion, I don't happen to agree.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote saints91 wrote: View Post
    I actually respect Lieweke for apologizing. There were times in the last month when he went to far. It came off as classless, and I'm glad he cleared the air. BC didn't deliver on the court, but he did a lot for the marketing and branding of this franchise. He handled his position with class and respect, and represented the organization well. The firing was handled poorly, and things probably got nasty behind the scenes. I'm just glad the new regime can let go of the past and move on.
    I'm inclined to agree with you. Except, Leiweke opened his mouth and said these things and now by apologizing he's contradicting himself and his entire persona or first impression..

    If you're going to say bold things and be brash. You best stick to your guns and keep it that way.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    I'm inclined to agree with you. Except, Leiweke opened his mouth and said these things and now by apologizing he's contradicting himself and his entire persona or first impression..

    If you're going to say bold things and be brash. You best stick to your guns and keep it that way.
    I'm inclined to disagree with this.

    There's a very famous saying that I believe is appropriate here: "Its easier to ask for Forgiveness than it is to ask for Permission."

    He came in here, and shook the very ground he walked in on, firing up not just one fanbase, but several fanbase's; while upsetting a small minority of sensitive people.
    Apologizing to them is just a face saving move that MLSE PR asked of him. Nothing more.

    TL is who he is, and most people see it as a breath of fresh air.
    To those who don't, TL will have to ask their forgiveness several times along his way to burning a path to a championship.
    Last edited by Joey; Mon Jul 29th, 2013 at 11:24 PM.
    In Masai we Trust.

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  6. #24
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    I'm inclined to disagree with this.

    There's a very famous saying that I believe is appropriate here: "Its easier to ask for Forgiveness than it is to ask for Permission."

    He came in here, and shook the very ground he walked in on, firing up not just one fanbase, but several fanbase's; while upsetting a small minority of sensitive people.
    Apologizing to them is just a face saving move that MLSE PR asked of him. Nothing more.

    TL is who he is, and most people see it as a breath of fresh air.
    To those who don't, TL will have to ask their forgiveness several times along his way to burning a path to a championship.
    Yeah, that was evidently clear. But, nobody likes MLSE anyway,so I'm not sure what "face saving" they are trying to do
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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  7. #25
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    I've been a member here for a few years and before that was on RF. I don't remember anyone when Bosh was still here criticizing BC for trying to build around him.

    He only started getting criticized after Bosh left. Maybe a few when Bosh wasn't traded by the deadline. But thing is BC was trying to convince Bosh to stick around, he was trying to make the playoffs, trying to win now. It back fired and than (rightfully so) everyone turned on him.
    Sorry LBF, I have been here for a while too and remember differently. There were grumbles. Havent gone thru the archives entirely but found this thread which touches on the subject that Bosh was a dubious franchise player....and by extension disagreeing with BC.

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...anchise-Player

    I am sure there are other threads.

  8. #26
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    But, nobody likes MLSE anyway,so I'm not sure what "face saving" they are trying to do
    They were ousting one regime for being incompetent. They didn't want to have the incoming one be seen as Bruteish or Obnoxious (ala Mark Cuban, Dan Gilbert). TL's presence did temporarily distract from the teams, and that is a no-no for any management. Always keep the focus on the product.
    In Masai we Trust.

  9. #27
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Bendit wrote: View Post
    Sorry LBF, I have been here for a while too and remember differently. There were grumbles. Havent gone thru the archives entirely but found this thread which touches on the subject that Bosh was a dubious franchise player....and by extension disagreeing with BC.

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...anchise-Player

    I am sure there are other threads.
    That was a rather weak example. But, I guess i'll give it to you. To quote Roger Clemens; I "misremembered"

    I even commented on said thread...

    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    they either have a come over or slicked back hair, sometimes or always wear glasses and have a big schnaz


    hahaha
    Though, it had nothing to do with the OP...like many of my posts

    EDIT: I found this

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...anchise+player

    some rumblings there by apollo and the greatest troll ever in Multipaul
    Last edited by LBF; Tue Jul 30th, 2013 at 12:16 AM.
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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  10. #28
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    I think the only reason to apologize to Colangelo was to show respect to another guy -- Jerry Colangelo.

    Bryan's a big boy, and business is business.
    your pal,
    ebrian

  11. #29
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    This thread is as close to high school gossip as anything can get.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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  13. #30
    Raptors Republic All-Star Craiger's Avatar
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    Quote Bendit wrote: View Post
    Sorry LBF, I have been here for a while too and remember differently. There were grumbles. Havent gone thru the archives entirely but found this thread which touches on the subject that Bosh was a dubious franchise player....and by extension disagreeing with BC.

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...anchise-Player

    I am sure there are other threads.
    Not to pile on LBF but:

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...eam-quot/page2

    but coaching isn't the REAL crux of the problem...the guy who hired the coach...the guy who acquired the players...isn't that the crux of the problem? i mean, why would anyone trust that any moves BC makes at this point will actually help the team.
    This team has been on downward spiral for years now. Different players, different coaches, worse results. Only one thing hasn't changed and it's time to change it.

    Colangelo has brought NOTHING to this franchise except headaches and little wiggle room
    there are plenty of discussion questioning both directly and indirectly whether Bosh was a 'franchise player' or 'superstar' deep in annuals of RRForums. Talking about trading him before he walks, and others just letting him walk for nothing is better than trading him.

    That said, I doubt those voices are the majority (mind you its quite interesting to see page after page of posts that don't go into double digit responses - is that even possible now a days?)

  14. #31
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    I've been a member here for a few years and before that was on RF. I don't remember anyone when Bosh was still here criticizing BC for trying to build around him.

    He only started getting criticized after Bosh left. Maybe a few when Bosh wasn't traded by the deadline. But thing is BC was trying to convince Bosh to stick around, he was trying to make the playoffs, trying to win now. It back fired and than (rightfully so) everyone turned on him.
    I think there were lots of RR posters who were strongly opposed to BC attempting to build a team around Bosh. Personally, I first started coming to RR the summer of 2009, prior to Bosh's last season, specifically to see how other fans felt about that plan and to voice my desire to trade Bosh before he became a free agent when many more potential trading partners were in the mix (ie: Philly, NYK, Houston - and I didn't believe for a second that he would re-sign here). I was a big Bosh fan and felt he'd be a great "Robin", but knew we desperately needed our "Batman" (similar to the Shaq/Wade combo in Miami). When Bosh became the face of the franchise and key marketing tool, I was worried that the team thought highly of him - he put up big numbers as the best player on a bad team, but should never have been made the #1. I remember that I was not alone in this, as many posters were concerned about the Raptors future if Bosh was built 'around', instead of 'with'.

    TL should have just fired BC outright, instead of offering him a different executive position. All of this would have been avoided.

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    Quote Craig wrote: View Post
    All due respect Pele, I'm pretty sure I am not missing anything here. Perhaps when a person feels like stating a guy should be "booted and pissed on" when speaking of a Managerial dismissal in pro sports may actually be missing the point more.

    Business and the politics of corporate structure, culture, and public identity are pretty complicated man, maybe you don't think they are, and thats your right, to have that opinion, I don't happen to agree.
    I think you're being a tad oversensitive. Firing a guy after leading a franchise to 7 years of failure and bringing in a new leader who is bound to talk about his vision/strategy for the team (which will be different from the old guy, otherwise why fire the old guy), is going to inevitably lead to some "disrespecting" of the old leader. BC's firing was part of a significant internal management overhaul, to create a new culture and new outlook for the team and its fans. Stating the facts and talking openly/honestly is refreshing, especially for an organization that desperately needed a change. Speaking positively about the "new" will be a slap in the face of the "old", but when the "old" was such a collosal failure, what's the big deal? I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!

    Any negatives said about BC were in reference to the results he produced, not in reference to him as a person. There were no personal attacks and BC was even given another executive position within the organization, specifically because of his success in other areas (ie: growing basketball in Canada, relations with corporate partners, relations with NBA, leading campaign to bring NBA all-star game to Canada, etc...) and the respect TL had for him as an executive. I personally saw no reason for TL to apologize to anybody.

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  18. #33
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    I think you're being a tad oversensitive. Firing a guy after leading a franchise to 7 years of failure and bringing in a new leader who is bound to talk about his vision/strategy for the team (which will be different from the old guy, otherwise why fire the old guy), is going to inevitably lead to some "disrespecting" of the old leader. BC's firing was part of a significant internal management overhaul, to create a new culture and new outlook for the team and its fans. Stating the facts and talking openly/honestly is refreshing, especially for an organization that desperately needed a change. Speaking positively about the "new" will be a slap in the face of the "old", but when the "old" was such a collosal failure, what's the big deal? I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!

    Any negatives said about BC were in reference to the results he produced, not in reference to him as a person. There were no personal attacks and BC was even given another executive position within the organization, specifically because of his success in other areas (ie: growing basketball in Canada, relations with corporate partners, relations with NBA, leading campaign to bring NBA all-star game to Canada, etc...) and the respect TL had for him as an executive. I personally saw no reason for TL to apologize to anybody.
    Yet, he himself went out of his way to do so. Perhaps there were more details of the handling of it than what was made public so far? In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!



    Whats funny, is this is exactly what I expected to happen. So TL had me from the get-go.
    No more of this pussy-footing around. If people fail to do their job, FIRE their ass.
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  20. #35
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?
    Little of Column A and a little of Column B.

    I don't think TL is anybodies 'Puppet'; he understands that there are some sensitive media types at Toronto Star (which is exactly where the apology was made) and knew that the Star is the #1 most read paper in the city.
    Regardless of whether what Doug Smith writes is accurate, its still being consumed by the ignorant and the educated alike.
    In Masai we Trust.

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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Little of Column A and a little of Column B.

    I don't think TL is anybodies 'Puppet'; he understands that there are some sensitive media types at Toronto Star (which is exactly where the apology was made) and knew that the Star is the #1 most read paper in the city.
    Regardless of whether what Doug Smith writes is accurate, its still being consumed by the ignorant and the educated alike.
    Is the concept of the virtue of treating people with dignity being lost on the youth of today, in general, or just in the world of sport? There was never any criticism of the firing. There was criticism of how it was handled, and TL was a man about it and stood up and took the hit...... *shaking my head" at the " ignorant" I'm seeing at RR.

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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Yet, he himself went out of his way to do so. Perhaps there were more details of the handling of it than what was made public so far? In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?
    Based on the Doug Smith article, my assumption is that TL was being pressed by people (ie: media) who felt he had gone too far in his assessment of the Raptors' results over the past 7 years, so he apologized for anything he said that could be perceived as "going to far". I don't believe TL is apologizing for his assessment (ie: professional criticism), but rather for anything that he said that people took as being a personal slander against BC (even if he doesn't think he ever actually crossed the line). If anything, I think it's more of a PR move, designed to smooth over any feathers that might have been inadvertently ruffled.

    Again, I personally don't think TL did go too far, nor do I think he ever personally attacked BC. TL attacked the negative results and some questionable strategic decisions that BC made as GM, while talking frankly about the franchise's history, which is mostly failure. To me, the fact that TL thought highly enough of BC as a man and an executive, to reassign him rather than fire him outright, trumps any perceived personal slights.

    As fans, we all know how dismal this franchise has been for most of its existence. I personally thought it was a breath of fresh air for mangement to speak so candidly about it, while overhauling the management team, to take the team in a new direction.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar heinz57's Avatar
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    I just came in here to say...

    Doug Smith looks like the kind of guy I could see sitting on the corner of a seedy motel room bed in a wife beater and boxer shorts eating a corned beef sandwich, while a young boy, in a similar wardrobe selection is lying on the ground in the fetal position while crying... and he yells out "Shut up!! i'll take you home to your mommy when I finish my sandwich!!" while showering the kid with spit, corned beef chunks and rye crumbs.

    I have nothing of any real value to add to this conversation.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote heinz57 wrote: View Post
    I just came in here to say...

    Doug Smith looks like the kind of guy I could see sitting on the corner of a seedy motel room bed in a wife beater and boxer shorts eating a corned beef sandwich, while a young boy, in a similar wardrobe selection is lying on the ground in the fetal position while crying... and he yells out "Shut up!! i'll take you home to your mommy when I finish my sandwich!!" while showering the kid with spit, corned beef chunks and rye crumbs.

    I have nothing of any real value to add to this conversation.
    Of what value is this conversation? Haha. It's about a lame ass apology..
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

  26. #40
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    I think Colangelo owes this fan base an apology LONG before Lieweke owes Colangelo one.

    Just saying...
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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