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ESPN 5-on-5: Rudy Gay most Overrated Small Forward.

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  • #76
    Matt52 wrote: View Post

    I did not bring DD in to this thread. Just my opinion but I think you once again look like a scorned school girl attempting to undermine and discredit as usual.
    What does calling people childish names look like?

    Beyond that, you discredit yourself way too much for me to have much effect, nor give a damn. I stated a fact about your multitude of DD rants. Whether 1 person whispered his name in this one or not, congrats for jumping on the opportunity.
    Last edited by p00ka; Tue Aug 6, 2013, 10:05 PM.

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    • #77
      p00ka wrote: View Post
      What does calling people childish names look like?

      Beyond that, you discredit yourself way too much for me to have much effect, nor give a damn. I stated a fact about your multitude of DD rants. Whether 1 person whispered his name in this one or not, congrats for jumping on the opportunity.
      *Pssst*

      This is old.

      Comment


      • #78
        I think Rudy Gay has become somewhat of an enigma when it comes to his true value; definitely not worth a max contract, but a very good player worth a long-term, large sum deal.

        Rudy Gay is overpaid, not overrated. He is one of those players that is quite difficult to rank, is he a top 5 small forward today in the league? You can certainly argue that:

        LeBron James
        Kevin Durant
        Carmelo Anthony
        Paul George
        Rudy Gay/Luol Deng/Andre Iguodala/Paul Pierce.

        This season will be a main factor in whether Rudy Gay is a player a team can use in heading towards winning, or a player that collects recognition on an unsuccessful team.

        Rudy Gay definitely does somethings at an elite level, or maybe HAS at an elite level - his ability to win games in the crunch time of games, definitely an explosive athlete. Otherwise, he's only above average on everything else, I'm not sure he has a terrible part of his game, other than shooting - which could be part of a different topic in him being overrated, etc.
        Twitter: @ReubenJRD • NBA, Raptors writer for Daily Hive Vancouver, Toronto.

        Comment


        • #79
          akashsingh wrote: View Post
          I know Rudy Gay is overrated. But I don't like hearing it from espn ******.
          I found this statement to be HORRIBLY offensive, and entirely unnecessary. Whatever you think about ESPN or their analysts/writers/"experts" it doesn't justify using the word you did. RR has been in my opinion, very gay friendly, and I'd like to keep it that way. I'm sure it wasn't your intent to offend anyone (other than espn, and people who like them), but I would appreciate if you used a different word in the future to convey your extreme distaste. Thank you.


          Xixak wrote: View Post
          I'm not "ripping" Paul George. He's a top 5 SF in the NBA. I'm saying he's overrated. Look at how many people were declaring him a superstar during the playoffs. He might be a defensive star but offensively he has a long way to go. He's not a very efficient scorer despite having lower volume than the REAL superstars in the league, he's not good at getting to the FT Line and he turns it over at quite a high rate (3 turnovers to just 4 assists).

          There's nothing about him that makes him a superstar. That's why he's overrated. If people were calling Gay a superstar I'd say he's overrated as well, but they don't.
          I agree, Paul George is NOT a superstar in my opinion, he played at an allstar level for the first 5 games in the conference finals, but he didn't do a great job in games 6 and 7 (I only watched the conference finals though, not round 1 or 2) to justify the SUPERSTAR talk. However, I would trade DD for George straight up in a HEARTBEAT. I would also trade Gay for George Straight up as well. But I don't think he is and not sure he will ever be a superstar. Perennial All-star? Good chance. Superstar? I'm not sold.


          p00ka wrote: View Post
          Just my opinion why Matt gets "labelled" as a "basher".
          The problem with labeling people as "basher's" (outside of the fact that it implies that people on this site actually want the raptors or their players to underperform, which is just crazy, given the amount of time and emotion regular posters (like Matt52), devote to the team, and the forums), is that unfortunately, the "basher's" have done a MUCH better historical track record of being right, compared to whatever you want to call the people who expect a "reasonable amount of growth" or the "if player can just fix X about their game then they/the raps will be good" contingent.

          In the four and a half year's i've been posting here I've seen my share of people rally against the "basher's" (frequently also called haters). In fact many of the posters who could be labelled bashers (in the sense that they DON'T expect players to be able to do something new every off season) would have, in previous off-seasons, argued quite passionately against said "bashers" in fact Matt52 was very pro about a certain former raptor (bargnani, of all players!) back in the day. Unfortunately, history has told us that most often than not raptor players (and players in general) don't make sweeping changes to their game. Sure they are better in certain years, but then regress in others back to their mean, a mean which usually shows itself by the time said player has logged 10,000 minutes.

          What happens to the people who fight the good fight against the "bashers"? They usually make ridiculous guarantees about the performance of a player for an upcoming season and by extension about the team in general (think anyone who has ever predicted any raptor would be first team all nba*, that anyone other than Carter, Antonio Davis, or Bosh** would be an all star or that the raps would win 50 games in a single season***), and when said player doesn't fulfill their prophecy, they make a new guarantee for the upcoming season.

          Eventually though, only one of two things happens. They disappear entirely, out of some mixture of shame, depression, and/or lack of interest, or they become a "basher". I have seen all kinds of former raptors being hailed as being a future all-star (fred jones!) or taking huge leaps in an off season (jamario moon will get a jump shot!). I have yet to see ONE player who has actually silenced any haters (except maybe Amir, but no one really hated on him that much except for Barg's fan boys, so maybe he counts? But in that argument, it was the anti-bargnani people who were the haters, so probably not).

          So call Matt, myself, or anyone else who's skeptical that any one particular player is likely to be unique, a basher. When said player performs at levels above and beyond what I've predicted I'll (happily) admit I was wrong (And it IS bound to happen, eventually someone will be an anomaly), heck I'll even apologize to that specific player (not that they give a crap about anything I have to say). But there's more positively-skewed predictions for the raps that haven't happened that could fill a new york phone book, and other than Amir, there haven't really been any over achievers since the first two year's of Vince Carter (Antonio Davis probably also over achieved). Who knows what the future holds, but if the last 18 seasons has taught raptors fans anything, it is that the smart money is on low expectations.

          If that sounds sh!tty, that's because it is really really really really really really super sh!tty. Hopefully the future is better, emphasis on hope.


          *No raptor has ever been first team all nba.
          **Vince Carter, Antonio Davis, and Chris Bosh are the only raps to make an all-star game.
          ***We've never won 50 games in a single season.
          "They're going to have to rename the whole conference after us: Toronto Raptors 2014-2015 Northern Conference Champions" ~ ezzbee Dec. 2014

          "I guess I got a little carried away there" ~ ezzbee Apr. 2015

          "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

          Comment


          • #80
            ezz_bee wrote: View Post
            I found this statement to be HORRIBLY offensive, and entirely unnecessary. Whatever you think about ESPN or their analysts/writers/"experts" it doesn't justify using the word you did. RR has been in my opinion, very gay friendly, and I'd like to keep it that way. I'm sure it wasn't your intent to offend anyone (other than espn, and people who like them), but I would appreciate if you used a different word in the future to convey your extreme distaste. Thank you.




            I agree, Paul George is NOT a superstar in my opinion, he played at an allstar level for the first 5 games in the conference finals, but he didn't do a great job in games 6 and 7 (I only watched the conference finals though, not round 1 or 2) to justify the SUPERSTAR talk. However, I would trade DD for George straight up in a HEARTBEAT. I would also trade Gay for George Straight up as well. But I don't think he is and not sure he will ever be a superstar. Perennial All-star? Good chance. Superstar? I'm not sold.




            The problem with labeling people as "basher's" (outside of the fact that it implies that people on this site actually want the raptors or their players to underperform, which is just crazy, given the amount of time and emotion regular posters (like Matt52), devote to the team, and the forums), is that unfortunately, the "basher's" have done a MUCH better historical track record of being right, compared to whatever you want to call the people who expect a "reasonable amount of growth" or the "if player can just fix X about their game then they/the raps will be good" contingent.

            In the four and a half year's i've been posting here I've seen my share of people rally against the "basher's" (frequently also called haters). In fact many of the posters who could be labelled bashers (in the sense that they DON'T expect players to be able to do something new every off season) would have, in previous off-seasons, argued quite passionately against said "bashers" in fact Matt52 was very pro about a certain former raptor (bargnani, of all players!) back in the day. Unfortunately, history has told us that most often than not raptor players (and players in general) don't make sweeping changes to their game. Sure they are better in certain years, but then regress in others back to their mean, a mean which usually shows itself by the time said player has logged 10,000 minutes.

            What happens to the people who fight the good fight against the "bashers"? They usually make ridiculous guarantees about the performance of a player for an upcoming season and by extension about the team in general (think anyone who has ever predicted any raptor would be first team all nba*, that anyone other than Carter, Antonio Davis, or Bosh** would be an all star or that the raps would win 50 games in a single season***), and when said player doesn't fulfill their prophecy, they make a new guarantee for the upcoming season.

            Eventually though, only one of two things happens. They disappear entirely, out of some mixture of shame, depression, and/or lack of interest, or they become a "basher". I have seen all kinds of former raptors being hailed as being a future all-star (fred jones!) or taking huge leaps in an off season (jamario moon will get a jump shot!). I have yet to see ONE player who has actually silenced any haters (except maybe Amir, but no one really hated on him that much except for Barg's fan boys, so maybe he counts? But in that argument, it was the anti-bargnani people who were the haters, so probably not).

            So call Matt, myself, or anyone else who's skeptical that any one particular player is likely to be unique, a basher. When said player performs at levels above and beyond what I've predicted I'll (happily) admit I was wrong (And it IS bound to happen, eventually someone will be an anomaly), heck I'll even apologize to that specific player (not that they give a crap about anything I have to say). But there's more positively-skewed predictions for the raps that haven't happened that could fill a new york phone book, and other than Amir, there haven't really been any over achievers since the first two year's of Vince Carter (Antonio Davis probably also over achieved). Who knows what the future holds, but if the last 18 seasons has taught raptors fans anything, it is that the smart money is on low expectations.

            If that sounds sh!tty, that's because it is really really really really really really super sh!tty. Hopefully the future is better, emphasis on hope.


            *No raptor has ever been first team all nba.
            **Vince Carter, Antonio Davis, and Chris Bosh are the only raps to make an all-star game.
            ***We've never won 50 games in a single season.
            just wanted to confirm that wasn't my intention. I use that word as slang, and in no way does it relate to what I think about the gay community.

            Comment


            • #81
              akashsingh wrote: View Post
              just wanted to confirm that wasn't my intention. I use that word as slang, and in no way does it relate to what I think about the gay community.
              Awesome. Then we're cool.
              "They're going to have to rename the whole conference after us: Toronto Raptors 2014-2015 Northern Conference Champions" ~ ezzbee Dec. 2014

              "I guess I got a little carried away there" ~ ezzbee Apr. 2015

              "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

              Comment


              • #82
                Jesus Christ people I am not saying DeRozan is as good as Paul George.

                All I said is DeRozan scores with almost identical volume and efficiency, yet people call him inefficient... so that would make PG inefficient as well would it not?

                That being said PG is infinitely better than DeRozan at basically every other aspect of the game. I'm not saying they're comparable players, I'm using Paul George's non-stellar offensive game to point out that he's not a superstar. All the real superstars score more efficiently than him on higher volume.

                Comment


                • #83
                  akashsingh wrote: View Post
                  just wanted to confirm that wasn't my intention. I use that word as slang, and in no way does it relate to what I think about the gay community.
                  That's like saying when black people use the n-word, it's okay. Because its not.
                  Twitter - @thekid_it

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    isaacthompson wrote: View Post
                    That's like saying when black people use the n-word, it's okay. Because its not.
                    Actually it is ok for black people to say the n-word, it's just ignorant.

                    It is not ok for white people to say it on the other hand, but that's a debate for another thread.

                    Anyone has the right to say any word they want though, you just have to make sure you're responsible for the consequences of using that word. Freedom of speech =/= freedom from consequence.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Xixak wrote: View Post
                      Actually it is ok for black people to say the n-word, it's just ignorant.

                      It is not ok for white people to say it on the other hand, but that's a debate for another thread.

                      Anyone has the right to say any word they want though, you just have to make sure you're responsible for the consequences of using that word. Freedom of speech =/= freedom from consequence.
                      That's racist. :P

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        [
                        Last edited by LBF; Tue Aug 6, 2013, 11:55 PM.
                        If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                        Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Xixak wrote: View Post
                          Actually it is ok for black people to say the n-word, it's just ignorant.

                          It is not ok for white people to say it on the other hand, but that's a debate for another thread.

                          Anyone has the right to say any word they want though, you just have to make sure you're responsible for the consequences of using that word. Freedom of speech =/= freedom from consequence.
                          Yes. Its ok for black people to say the N word and white people to not because Xixak says so and he knows all...
                          I love how you make your point and then go "that's a debate for another thread"

                          Just like when you announced "you cant be bothered with this anymore" with the Wall thing.

                          If you "cant be bothered".If its "a debate for another thread".Leave it the hell alone! Why are you bringing it up?
                          Last edited by LBF; Tue Aug 6, 2013, 11:56 PM.
                          If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                          Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            LBF wrote: View Post
                            Yes. Its ok for black people to say the N word and white people to not because Xixak says so and he knows all...
                            I love how you make your point and then go "that's a debate for another thread"

                            Just like when you announced "you cant be bothered with this anymore" with the Wall thing.

                            If you "cant be bothered".If its "a debate for another thread".Leave it the hell alone! Why are you bringing it up?
                            Yay another dumb debate!

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              I'm not gonna be responsible for another debate! It stops here. Lol
                              Twitter - @thekid_it

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                I don't believe that these five independently arrived at Rudy Gay. To me, Rudy Gay is not overrated because overrated implies that people think highly of him when in fact he shouldn't be highly thought off. The problem with Gay is that he's simply overpaid. By a lot. Nobody has an inflated opinion of Rudy Gay (well, BC did) therefore you can't say that he's overrated.

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