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Thread: Rudy Gay says no to tanking

  1. #41
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
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    I'm a proponent of tanking because there is no flexibility to improve nor do we have a lot of organic growth (other than JV and possibly Ross) to hope for. To me 'tanking' is asset acquisition and at this time the Raptors need to shed payroll and get rookie scale contracts. To get good players (non rookies) on cheap contracts is hard when they are not contenders.

    But in my opinion the hype for the 2014 draft is over blown. Wiggins is probably a sure thing.. but to compare others in that draft to the guys out of the 2003 draft is a bit much. Exum looks like he'll be a good PG, but is he even going to declare? Parker has slid, and looks like he'll be a tweener (which I hate because they can have a D. Williams career). I like watching Randle's youtube videos however could he end up like T-Rob (a journey man after only playing in the league for 2 years)? And a good PF is nice to have but they don't automatically turn a team into a contender. Smart wasn't even going to be a top pick in the weak 2013 draft - plus I think PG's are difficult to rate. Looking at some of the elite PG's in the league a lot of them were drafted later in the draft and not necessarily even in the lottery.

    The 2014 draft just has way too much value to it and I think it will be disappointing. I think MU should buy low and get an additional 2015 or 2016 pick instead. Lowry for example should get a high 2015 pick but a very low 2014 pick. I'd rather have the high 2015 pick.

  2. #42
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Let's see how many tanking threads we can start before the trade deadline. We can make a game of it. We see how many we create in 1 month, and then next month, try and beat that record. It'll be fun!
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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  4. #43
    Raptors Republic Starter Fully's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Let's see how many tanking threads we can start before the trade deadline. We can make a game of it. We see how many we create in 1 month, and then next month, try and beat that record. It'll be fun!
    Haha. Every thread seems to spiral into a debate about tanking/rebuilding within the first dozen replies, no matter what the original topic is.

  5. #44
    Raptors Republic Starter Fully's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I'm a proponent of tanking because there is no flexibility to improve nor do we have a lot of organic growth (other than JV and possibly Ross) to hope for. To me 'tanking' is asset acquisition and at this time the Raptors need to shed payroll and get rookie scale contracts. To get good players (non rookies) on cheap contracts is hard when they are not contenders.

    But in my opinion the hype for the 2014 draft is over blown. Wiggins is probably a sure thing.. but to compare others in that draft to the guys out of the 2003 draft is a bit much. Exum looks like he'll be a good PG, but is he even going to declare? Parker has slid, and looks like he'll be a tweener (which I hate because they can have a D. Williams career). I like watching Randle's youtube videos however could he end up like T-Rob (a journey man after only playing in the league for 2 years)? And a good PF is nice to have but they don't automatically turn a team into a contender. Smart wasn't even going to be a top pick in the weak 2013 draft - plus I think PG's are difficult to rate. Looking at some of the elite PG's in the league a lot of them were drafted later in the draft and not necessarily even in the lottery.

    The 2014 draft just has way too much value to it and I think it will be disappointing. I think MU should buy low and get an additional 2015 or 2016 pick instead. Lowry for example should get a high 2015 pick but a very low 2014 pick. I'd rather have the high 2015 pick.
    Agree with your first paragraph 100%. Your thoughts about the draft could turn out to be accurate. I think we'll have to wait and see how a lot of these guys perform in college this year before we know the true strength of the 2014 draft.

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  7. #45
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Let's see how many tanking threads we can start before the trade deadline. We can make a game of it. We see how many we create in 1 month, and then next month, try and beat that record. It'll be fun!
    that's such a terrible idea that it'll probably happen
    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

  8. #46
    Raptors Republic Rookie hotfuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Mundy wrote: View Post
    Completely understand this perspective, but just to make it a bit more realistic.... how much of that awesome talent is still on the same team that drafted it in 2003?
    If you can't trust management to hold on to an elite player, how can you trust them to transform a fringe playoff team into a contender.

    Tanking is a strategy to acquire talent, nothing more, nothing less. Anything that happens afterwards has nothing to do with tanking.
    "Duh! Winning"
    - Charlie Sheen

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  10. #47
    Raptors Republic Starter S.R.'s Avatar
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    Quote hotfuzz wrote: View Post
    If you can't trust management to hold on to an elite player, how can you trust them to transform a fringe playoff team into a contender.

    Tanking is a strategy to acquire talent, nothing more, nothing less. Anything that happens afterwards has nothing to do with tanking.
    Also, Lebron/Wade/Bosh/Melo all re-signed and gave their drafting teams 7+ years. More than enough time.

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  12. #48
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote S.R. wrote: View Post
    Also, Lebron/Wade/Bosh/Melo all re-signed and gave their drafting teams 7+ years. More than enough time.
    This is a great point.

    It is simplistic overall because you have the behind the scenes collusion while leaving the team that paid them around $80M over those 7 years out to dry. It is certainly a great case study of morals or values.

    But it is a valid point nonetheless and raises another issue/question:

    What does a player actually owe his team?


    In the case of Bosh/LeBron, they technically did nothing wrong. They honoured their contract and opted out when contractual opportunity came around.

    It is hardly black and white.

    I think with Bosh we can safely say nothing less than a championship was likely to keep him from leaving given LBJ's circumstances.


    I know one thing: I'm tired of failing to achieve mediocrity and limiting my hopes to it.

    It is absolutely insane the realization the Raptors are 8 losses shy of being the WORST team in the last 11 years. That is f*cking mind blowing. Let that sink it. The Raptors are 8 losses shy of being the WORST team of the last 11 years. Wow.

    All these discussions over the years where I was talking about Colangelo swinging for the fences were BULLSH!T. He wasn't swinging for the fences, he was looking at strikes trying to get a walk. I know it is en vogue to sh!t on BC right now but lets call a spade a spade here.

    I want to see MU/Toronto really swing for the fences. For MU with JV on board it is like coming up to bat already up 1-0 in the count. Having a 5 year contract and the support of the CEO to tear it down if so desired makes the count 2-0. You've got three huge cuts before you're out.

    Blow it up already, Masai!
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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  14. #49
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    This is a great point.

    It is simplistic overall because you have the behind the scenes collusion while leaving the team that paid them around $80M over those 7 years out to dry. It is certainly a great case study of morals or values.

    But it is a valid point nonetheless and raises another issue/question:

    What does a player actually owe his team?


    In the case of Bosh/LeBron, they technically did nothing wrong. They honoured their contract and opted out when contractual opportunity came around.

    It is hardly black and white.

    I think with Bosh we can safely say nothing less than a championship was likely to keep him from leaving given LBJ's circumstances.


    I know one thing: I'm tired of failing to achieve mediocrity and limiting my hopes to it.

    It is absolutely insane the realization the Raptors are 8 losses shy of being the WORST team in the last 11 years. That is f*cking mind blowing. Let that sink it. The Raptors are 8 losses shy of being the WORST team of the last 11 years. Wow.

    All these discussions over the years where I was talking about Colangelo swinging for the fences were BULLSH!T. He wasn't swinging for the fences, he was looking at strikes trying to get a walk. I know it is en vogue to sh!t on BC right now but lets call a spade a spade here.

    I want to see MU/Toronto really swing for the fences. For MU with JV on board it is like coming up to bat already up 1-0 in the count. Having a 5 year contract and the support of the CEO to tear it down if so desired makes the count 2-0. You've got three huge cuts before you're out.

    Blow it up already, Masai!
    You've got to share these feelings more often. Let it out man!

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  16. #50
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    You've got to share these feelings more often. Let it out man!
    Consider it done!
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  17. #51
    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Anybody else notice that Rudy's instagram account is "husky4lyfe22"? Love it!
    ... Oh its cuz he went UConn... of course ...
    "I have self-doubt. I have insecurity. I have fear of failure. We all have self-doubt. You don't deny it, but you also don't capitulate to it. You embrace it. You rise above it." -Kobe Bryant

  18. #52
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Anybody else notice that Rudy's instagram account is "husky4lyfe22"? Love it!
    ... Oh its cuz he went UConn... of course ...
    hmm do you think he'd take half the annual salary he's currently making, if we promise to change the team name to that of his alma mater? lol

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