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Thread: Amir was #1 in Personal Fouls called?

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Default Amir was #1 in Personal Fouls called?

    For some reason I thought he'd sort of figured out his foul prone ways .. and it really wasn't that evident last year that he was super foul prone .. I guess with the increase PT he was bound to reach this at some point. Lol

    http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/pl...uls/sort/fouls
    He had 301 fouls called on him last year; vs 291 for Dwight; 279 for Hibbert; 269 for Cousins; and 257 for Scola.

    Can Amir really ever be that Starting 4 if he never actually figures out how to not foul?
    Or does being in the same catergory as Dwight and Hibbert make it just part of his job?

    (Per 36mins, Amir is 4.7 and Jonas is at 4.6.)
    Last edited by Joey; Sat Aug 17th, 2013 at 11:39 AM.
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    Raptors Republic Starter phez's Avatar
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    This was pretty obvious just by watching raptors games.

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    Super Moderator Joey's Avatar
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    Quote phez wrote: View Post
    This was pretty obvious just by watching raptors games.
    Really? See I didn't get that. I felt that in seasons past for sure, but this season I felt that Jonas was even far more foul prone than Amir was.
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    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    Really? See I didn't get that. I felt that in seasons past for sure, but this season I felt that Jonas was even far more foul prone than Amir was.
    Yeah, the "eye test" so to speak says he has gotten much better. In fact if you look at his per36 numbers, his fouls have been on a steady decline for the past 3 years, and are much lower than they were prior to that.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mediumcore's Avatar
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    Amir is like Jose when it comes to being a starting PF. Can hold his own for short periods but shouldn't be long term on a good team.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    I think people have to still chill out about the "Amir is a starter" argument. He is a utility big, whether he starts or comes off the bench. He is not an anchor, and will probably never be a guy who can average around 35 mpg, which is what you want from a "starter", aka someone who anchors a position for you, and you basically can't run your team/system without.

    Amir is a great player who plays his role as well as can be hoped, and has kept making marginal improvements, but he's still just a utility big. If they lost him, it would hurt, and he's definitely become one of the better utility bigs in the league, but it wouldn't be impossible to keep being successful without him.

    It wouldn't be like the Pacers losing West, Atlanta losing Millsap, or Miami losing Bosh. It's more like SAS losing Splitter. He's important, and impacts the win column and on-court strategies, but it's far from impossible to adjust your team/system without him. Splitter starts, but really he's a utlitiy big for them. It makes it harder to play the way you want to play, which is what you think (as a coach) nets you the most wins, but if you still have your "anchors", you can still succeed, just with a much smaller margin for error. Of course...Toronto is nowhere near the team/program SAS is. So for Toronto it would be far more damaging to lose him compared to SAS losing Splitter. And yes, I realize losing Splitter was huge for them in the playoffs...but again, that's not because he's a "starter" as much as he is critical to how they can run their most successful system. And generally not being fully healthy in the playoffs, whether you're missing Tim Duncan or Tiago Splitter, will be a huge problem.

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    Amir's foul problems makes Psycho T look like a skilled finesse type player.
    [How do we do sarcasm]

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    Raptors Republic All-Star wallz's Avatar
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    He just isn`t quick enough to play solid defense without fouling often. Being super clumsy doesn't help either. I remember him tripping into guys and fouling them like that

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    Quote Raptor_11 wrote: View Post
    He just isn`t quick enough to play solid defense without fouling often. Being super clumsy doesn't help either. I remember him tripping into guys and fouling them like that
    The problem isn't that he isn't quick enough, it's that he overcommits when he leaves to help, and then is too out of position to recover. At least that's how I saw it a lot of the time.

    The clumsiness has gotten better. You're right about it, but it was a way he'd especially pick up offensive fouls. He worked hard, or the coaching staff worked him, to learn that stop, pivot and drop hook move to try and cut those fouls out of his game.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star wallz's Avatar
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    The clumsiness has gotten better. You're right about it, but it was a way he'd especially pick up offensive fouls. He worked hard, or the coaching staff worked him, to learn that stop, pivot and drop hook move to try and cut those fouls out of his game.
    This just reminded me of how amazingly efficient he was with those types of moves. I always cringe when he tries to make a post move but he scores them alllll the time

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    Not that surprising really.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Mhm maybe Tyler will be the starting PF.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Amir may be a utility big on any other team, but he's earned the starting role on this team.

    Funny how everyone's talking about his flaws, and yet he was no question our best player last year. Pretty telling if you ask me.

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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Mhm maybe Tyler will be the starting PF.
    I would expect Johnson to start at the beginning of the season. He averaged just under 29 minutes per game last season, and less than that the two years prior. Valanciunas averaged nearly 24 minutes per game last season. That leaves 43 minutes per game for backup players, perhaps 40 if Valanciunas improves his stamina. In any case, that is a lot of minutes for Hansbrough to take advantage of.

    The question is whether the Raptors will win more if Amir Johnson or Tyler Hansbrough starts? I expect we will find out by January. I have a feeling that Johnson will be more effective in the backup role than Hansbrough, in part due to temperament and in part due to his ability to back up both the 4 and the 5 spots.
    Last edited by caccia; Sat Aug 17th, 2013 at 10:44 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote isaacthompson wrote: View Post
    Amir may be a utility big on any other team, but he's earned the starting role on this team.

    Funny how everyone's talking about his flaws, and yet he was no question our best player last year. Pretty telling if you ask me.
    The dirty work is never appreciated.
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    The dirty work is never appreciated.
    This!

    Rasheed Wallace leads the NBA in Techs and his toughness and dirty work was crucial to the Detroit Pistons success.

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    Quote isaacthompson wrote: View Post
    Amir may be a utility big on any other team, but he's earned the starting role on this team.

    Funny how everyone's talking about his flaws, and yet he was no question our best player last year. Pretty telling if you ask me.
    Indeed it is telling. When your best player is a utility big, it's no wonder the team didn't make the playoffs. Amir is a difference maker, but he's not a "horse" the team can ride anywhere significant. This isn't a knock on him, it's a knock on the other talent and the guy who assembled it. Amir would be much more appreciated if we had a horse or two and racked up some wins, because then it would be evident how much he helps hold things together....but there's isn't much to hold together the last couple of seasons, with the supremely flawed rosters BC threw out there.

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    Amir is a Boss. Before anyone says anything negative about him or his limitations they should bang their head against a wall - of Amir's choosing.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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    Quote caccia wrote: View Post
    I would expect Johnson to start at the beginning of the season. He averaged just under 29 minutes per game last season, and less than that the two years prior. Valanciunas averaged nearly 24 minutes per game last season. That leaves 43 minutes per game for backup players, perhaps 40 if Valanciunas improves his stamina. In any case, that is a lot of minutes for Hansbrough to take advantage of.

    The question is whether the Raptors will win more if Amir Johnson or Tyler Hansbrough starts? I expect we will find out by January. I have a feeling that Johnson will be more effective in the backup role than Hansbrough, in part due to temperament and in part due to his ability to back up both the 4 and the 5 spots.
    If Valanciunas is only playing 27 mins per game this year, something has gone seriously wrong.....

    As for the topic at hand, there is no serious argument for Hansbrough to start. Amir was team's best player last year and is a terrific compliment to the rest of the starting 5. Unless he's injured, he'd better be starting. Of course, Casey is the coach, so, I guess all bets are off.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Axel's Avatar
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    Bigs are going to collect fouls, it goes with the territory. This is especially true for bigs playing behind poor defensive guards that allow for increased traffic at the rim. Amir had a lot last year, but his fouls, from what I saw, were more about him covering too much ground rather than being out of position. In his early years, he would be in the wrong position and overcompensate and thus foul. Last year he had much better defensive positioning, but the team defence wasn't very good, so he had to cover too much ground and would often be 'late' because of it. Not worried about it for this season.

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