Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 82

Thread: Chisholm: Raps Wings Not Longterm Solution with JV

  1. #41
    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    2,680
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Depends on how much Jv can handle between the ears. Sometimes a less is more approach is best (as pooka seems to suggest) but sometimes a player can absorb it all. Don't think we know enough to say which is the best case for JV


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

  2. Like Puffer liked this post
  3. #42
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    2,654
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    Depends on how much Jv can handle between the ears. Sometimes a less is more approach is best (as pooka seems to suggest) but sometimes a player can absorb it all. Don't think we know enough to say which is the best case for JV...
    I'm going to assume that Casey has a clue, and also has competent assistants who aren't afraid to voice an opinion on this topic. who hired the assistants this year, Casey or Masai. It's important to the dynamics.

  4. Like Axel liked this post
  5. #43
    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Oakville
    Posts
    3,559
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'll tell you who would fit better..

    Twitter - @thekid_it

  6. Like Axel liked this post
  7. #44
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,063
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Chandler Parson is the best current white basketball player, huge fan of his game.

  8. #45
    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    1,189
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote isaacthompson wrote: View Post
    I'll tell you who would fit better..

    It will be a cold day in hell before the Rockets deal Parsons. He is on the best value contract in the NBA by FAR! 2 more years at under $1M. He was an unbelievable second round steal. I'm a UF fan and even I didn't think his game would translate so well to the NBA, to the point he is a better NBA player than he was an NCAA player. That doesn't happen with many, if any, 4 year college players.

  9. #46
    Raptors Republic Superstar TheGloveinRapsUniform's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Markham, Ontario
    Posts
    2,830
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    But like I said above, why does anyone need to be traded in order to get JV more shots? Its the coach that draws up the plays, not the players. If coach wants more shots for JV, then JV will get more shots.

    If its a matter of spacing and shooting, then fine. But I don't buy into the whole notion that you need to trade players in order to free up shots. With Demar and Rudy shooting less often, its likely they'll be getting better, more efficient shots anyway.
    Exactly. Indiana last season had very good shot distribution . Hill avg 10 FGA, hibbert 11, West 13 and George 15. I dont see why the raptors cant do the same. some may say that gay and derozan are ball stoppers, well, Casey can design plays so that they dont have to have the ball all the time.

  10. Like Joey liked this post
  11. #47
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,801
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
    Chandler Parson is the best current white basketball player, huge fan of his game.
    That's a huge exaggeration. You tellin me you wouldn't take Kevin Love over Chandler Parsons?
    He's a second round steal for sure but he's not that good, he's simply a very good role player.

  12. #48
    Raptors Republic Veteran rocwell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    5,819
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    That's a huge exaggeration. You tellin me you wouldn't take Kevin Love over Chandler Parsons?
    He's a second round steal for sure but he's not that good, he's simply a very good role player.
    Blake Griffin is white too.

  13. #49
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,801
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote rocwell wrote: View Post
    Blake Griffin is white too.
    Isn't he half African american? and so what? I'd take K Love over Blake Griffin 10 times out of 10.

  14. #50
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    448
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If the team is trying to win right now, giving Jonas touches makes little sense. He's turnover-prone on offence and if you took away his putbacks/gimmes, I doubt his field goal percentage would be over 35/40. And that's the problem: much like his Lithuanian national team, Casey can't afford to let Jonas go through growing pains with his post game. If you want to really develop the kid, you need to let him get 30+ touches on the block per night, and let him face every kind of situation you could possibly throw at him. Obviously that's not going to jive with the team's current direction, for better or worse.

  15. Like Craiger liked this post
  16. #51
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    New poster here, just registered - long time poster over at RealGM but can't stand that place anymore.

    Anyways, people who think Jonas will take a 15 & 10 step this year are nuts. He will have those types of games on occassion yes but having to share the ball with DD, Gay in the starting unit - he will not get the touches he needs (especially with Gays tunnel vision). I just hope he doesn't get frustrated with the lack of touches. He seems to have his head on his shoulders but theres been a couple times this preseason where he's been looked off in the post and you could see that he was upset/frustrated.

  17. Like planetmars liked this post
  18. #52
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,393
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote DudyDeGay wrote: View Post
    New poster here, just registered - long time poster over at RealGM but can't stand that place anymore.

    Anyways, people who think Jonas will take a 15 & 10 step this year are nuts. He will have those types of games on occassion yes but having to share the ball with DD, Gay in the starting unit - he will not get the touches he needs (especially with Gays tunnel vision). I just hope he doesn't get frustrated with the lack of touches. He seems to have his head on his shoulders but theres been a couple times this preseason where he's been looked off in the post and you could see that he was upset/frustrated.
    I'm hoping for 13 and 8.5 on 55+% and 80+% but you raise some good points on the touches.

    You're right on the frustration. I've seen and shared it too.

    The Raptors treat JV like the Bulls in the early '90's use to treat Bill Cartwright. They'd give him 4-5 touches to start the game and maybe 2-3 to start the 2nd half and then, "Get out of the way, Bill!"
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  19. Like planetmars liked this post
  20. #53
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    3,395
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    JV is being treated like Kanter was in Utah. The excuse there though was that there were other bigs in the rotation taking all the minutes away from him (Millsap and AJ). The Raptors don't have that excuse.

    I really don't like Casey as a coach for this team.

  21. Like mcHAPPY liked this post
  22. #54
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Richmond Hill, ON
    Posts
    1,970
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    This is where I think Ross' development is key along with JV's. I think Demar's development (into near all-star status) could give the team a good haul. Elite 3's are harder to come by than scoring 2's (IMO). Besides, who's after Gay on this roster? Ross this season (with more confidence) could step in Demar's shoes if he's traded.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  23. #55
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,016
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Some people seem to want to force way too much weight onto JV's shoulders, with way too much EARLY expectations. Where's all that DEFENSE FIRST chatter that's been going on for years. How many of the "defense first" people are now demanding more touches for JV? Shit, he's a kid, still adapting to a very different style of game, playing against stronger MEN than him, and he needs a lot of work on his defense if he's ever going to be the defensive anchor that the team needs at the 5, no matter what side of the tank fence you stand. You want that defense first ingrained in him, or make that secondary to get him touches? Sheeeesh.

    Give the kid some time for shit sake. Yeah, he has the potential to one day be both a defensive anchor and one of the primary scoring options, but at his age, and level of experience, expecting rapid development at both ends, or even pushing it, is pure silliness.

    I should add, the "get JV more touches" refrain is often used to support the "get rid of the scorers and tank" side as well, actually thinking it would accelerate his development. NO, it wouldn't. The first thing I have to say about that is that such a concept is very far away from how JV grew up playing the TEAM game. He's not a wing, a la Lebron/KD/Kobe/Wade, all of whom spent their entire basketball lives being THE primary scorers, within a 1-on-1 iso-centric style of bball. Take others off the team that often demand double teams (Gay, DD), and every time JV touches the ball, he'll be doubled, and forced to get the ball out to scrubs every time. How's he develop like that? Take West and George away from the Pacers, how well do you think Hibbert develops offensively?

    At the end of the day, do the kid a favour: don't put to many early expectations on the kid, don't demand that the coach makes him the focal point at both ends, when he's barely 21 and barely getting his feet wet in this league. Damn, some fans, and some writers, seem to want to put him in the position of being the next boo-bird target. Let the kid develop, at a pace NBA coaches are far more experienced at than any of us.

  24. #56
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    7,864
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Some people seem to want to force way too much weight onto JV's shoulders, with way too much EARLY expectations. Where's all that DEFENSE FIRST chatter that's been going on for years. How many of the "defense first" people are now demanding more touches for JV? Shit, he's a kid, still adapting to a very different style of game, playing against stronger MEN than him, and he needs a lot of work on his defense if he's ever going to be the defensive anchor that the team needs at the 5, no matter what side of the tank fence you stand. You want that defense first ingrained in him, or make that secondary to get him touches? Sheeeesh.

    Give the kid some time for shit sake. Yeah, he has the potential to one day be both a defensive anchor and one of the primary scoring options, but at his age, and level of experience, expecting rapid development at both ends, or even pushing it, is pure silliness.

    I should add, the "get JV more touches" refrain is often used to support the "get rid of the scorers and tank" side as well, actually thinking it would accelerate his development. NO, it wouldn't. The first thing I have to say about that is that such a concept is very far away from how JV grew up playing the TEAM game. He's not a wing, a la Lebron/KD/Kobe/Wade, all of whom spent their entire basketball lives being THE primary scorers, within a 1-on-1 iso-centric style of bball. Take others off the team that often demand double teams (Gay, DD), and every time JV touches the ball, he'll be doubled, and forced to get the ball out to scrubs every time. How's he develop like that? Take West and George away from the Pacers, how well do you think Hibbert develops offensively?

    At the end of the day, do the kid a favour: don't put to many early expectations on the kid, don't demand that the coach makes him the focal point at both ends, when he's barely 21 and barely getting his feet wet in this league. Damn, some fans, and some writers, seem to want to put him in the position of being the next boo-bird target. Let the kid develop, at a pace NBA coaches are far more experienced at than any of us.
    I don't think it's all about wanting to force-feed him touches. I think you're overreacting to a pretty simple observation from the preseason. JV is looked off way too much by the other guys on the team. This has nothing to do with wanting to force his development. For me, I just want the team to play smart, basic basketball. If Jonas has his man pinned and is something like 6-8 ft from the basket....Well, yes, I want them to try and feed it to him, because a big man (just about any big man, including many backups in the league) taking a shot from that area is one of the easiest ways to get offense in all of basketball.

  25. #57
    Raptors Republic Starter
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    212
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    JV is being treated like Kanter was in Utah. The excuse there though was that there were other bigs in the rotation taking all the minutes away from him (Millsap and AJ). The Raptors don't have that excuse.

    I really don't like Casey as a coach for this team.
    I think I don't like him for development of young players - unless forced, he's likely to classify JV as a rookie developing; not that there's a problem that might be solved

  26. #58
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    19,393
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I think some Raptors fans are so use to developing raw, inferior natural talents into marketing cornerstones that when a real talent comes along they don't understand how to make real talent flourish.

    In this case not only is it real talent it is a young man who has had the weight of his entire country on his shoulders since he was 16. A real talent who is often spoken in the same breath of one of the greatest to ever walk the planet in sabonis in his home country. I don't think raptors fans can put any pressure he has not experienced before. In fact I wonder if spending 8 months of he year in Toronto is a welcome escape?
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  27. Like Axel liked this post
  28. #59
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,016
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    I don't think it's all about wanting to force-feed him touches. I think you're overreacting to a pretty simple observation from the preseason. JV is looked off way too much by the other guys on the team. This has nothing to do with wanting to force his development. For me, I just want the team to play smart, basic basketball. If Jonas has his man pinned and is something like 6-8 ft from the basket....Well, yes, I want them to try and feed it to him, because a big man (just about any big man, including many backups in the league) taking a shot from that area is one of the easiest ways to get offense in all of basketball.
    I'm long past basketball 101 lessons, and I'm not "overreacting" to anything. I'm talking about the DEVELOPMENT of a 21 year old Lithuanian, and my opinion that all the people who've been chanting DEFENSE FIRST in one form or another should perhaps be talking of JV's defensive development needs FIRST, because he's got a ways to go to even be average in the NBA, instead of harping on him not being fed the ball enough. Where are all these defense first people? All I hear is "he needs more touches".

    I'm talking about development, which he needs, with DEFENSE being the #1 focus, and until he progresses a lot further than where he's at on that end, I would be asking him to focus on that, and I wouldn't be designing the offense around him,,,, YET. Step 1: DEFENSE.

    And Matt52, yeah, he's used to pressure. Okay, now let's talk about what you want him developing first. D or O? If you're going to try and justify BOTH, don't bother.

  29. #60
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    7,864
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    I'm long past basketball 101 lessons, and I'm not "overreacting" to anything. I'm talking about the DEVELOPMENT of a 21 year old Lithuanian, and my opinion that all the people who've been chanting DEFENSE FIRST in one form or another should perhaps be talking of JV's defensive development needs FIRST, because he's got a ways to go to even be average in the NBA, instead of harping on him not being fed the ball enough. Where are all these defense first people? All I hear is "he needs more touches".

    I'm talking about development, which he needs, with DEFENSE being the #1 focus, and until he progresses a lot further than where he's at on that end, I would be asking him to focus on that, and I wouldn't be designing the offense around him,,,, YET. Step 1: DEFENSE.

    And Matt52, yeah, he's used to pressure. Okay, now let's talk about what you want him developing first. D or O? If you're going to try and justify BOTH, don't bother.
    Ok now explain to me how throwing him the ball in the post when he very obviously has an advantage is bad for his development? This is just a crazy rant about defense. Of course it's possible to help him develop on both ends. Again, this is just pretty basic basketball to me. It is not ok to simply avoid high % situations on offense because you think he shouldn't get any touches at all until he reaches his peak defensively, or some nonsense.

  30. Like Axel, mcHAPPY liked this post
Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •