View Poll Results: What to do with Rudy and Kyle?

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  • Trade both during the season

    11 42.31%
  • Resign both after the season

    7 26.92%
  • Trade one, but keep the other

    7 26.92%
  • Play out the season and let them walk

    1 3.85%
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Thread: Rudy and Kyle

  1. #41
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    Apart from Lowry's on court capabilities, could one of the pro Lowry (and I was one at the time of the trade) posters offer an explanation as to why he was out of shape last year when he was joining a new team and needed to establish some leadership bonafides. Now that he is in his last year he has decided (as do most especially those not in the best of condition) to drop weight and possibly add muscle & cardio to have a good season. For me this speaks to character. I am dubious as well that he would subjugate his stats for the team (new contract considerations).

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  3. #42
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Jclaw wrote: View Post
    I think this is what makes this year so fascinating. I mentioned elsewhere that the difference between blowing it up and staying the course could be very minimal if Lowry and Gay both decide to leave on their own accord at the end of the year (the difference between roster moves, not results). The league is becoming so clique based that you could see them staying or leaving together. See, as a related/unrelated note, Bill and Jalen's review of OKC which tosses out the idea of KD joining Harder and Dwight in Houston in a couple of years with Westbrook and Love reliving their UCLA days with the Lakers.....tangent ended.
    It's so tough to handicap when the ball is in Rudy's court. Sign him to a reasonable contract and you've got a top-middle tier SF to help build around. I can't wait to see what Masai does. I hope he has a better read than us
    There is one massive difference - likely anywhere from 5-15 draft spots in a draft that is likely to have multiple franchise talents. It would set the raptors back a year and could lead to lost opportunities to accumulate assets.... No matter how minimal.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  4. #43
    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    Quote Bendit wrote: View Post
    Apart from Lowry's on court capabilities, could one of the pro Lowry (and I was one at the time of the trade) posters offer an explanation as to why he was out of shape last year when he was joining a new team and needed to establish some leadership bonafides. Now that he is in his last year he has decided (as do most especially those not in the best of condition) to drop weight and possibly add muscle & cardio to have a good season. For me this speaks to character. I am dubious as well that he would subjugate his stats for the team (new contract considerations).
    10 thumbs up. Clearly Bendit is my new fav poster here. Thanks for knowing your shit.

  5. #44
    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    Quote Bendit wrote: View Post
    Apart from Lowry's on court capabilities, could one of the pro Lowry (and I was one at the time of the trade) posters offer an explanation as to why he was out of shape last year when he was joining a new team and needed to establish some leadership bonafides. Now that he is in his last year he has decided (as do most especially those not in the best of condition) to drop weight and possibly add muscle & cardio to have a good season. For me this speaks to character. I am dubious as well that he would subjugate his stats for the team (new contract considerations).
    He wasn't out of shape until he came back from injury. He started the season on absolute fire last year. Check out his first 3 games before he got injured in the 4th game. He was starting to get back to form in December before he once again got injured and he never was able to get back in shape. I don't think you should be questioning Lowry's character. By all indications he is an extremely hard worker.

  6. #45
    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    Quote Craig wrote: View Post
    Oh Please, Casey HAD to play him. The guy can't run an offence.
    Agree to disagree then. I think he's clearly shown he can run an offense. He's averaged over 6 assists per game the past 3 seasons and he's had an Ast/TO ratio approaching 3. He's also a fantastic 3pt shooter (37%) and great at getting to the line. He was also top 9 among starting PG's in Pure Point Rating last year. I'm not sure what makes you think he can't run an offence as all the evidence is to the contrary.

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  8. #46
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    He wasn't out of shape until he came back from injury. He started the season on absolute fire last year. Check out his first 3 games before he got injured in the 4th game. He was starting to get back to form in December before he once again got injured and he never was able to get back in shape. I don't think you should be questioning Lowry's character. By all indications he is an extremely hard worker.
    My recollection is that he looked like a bit of a porker out of the gate and then hurt his shoulder in a fall. That said the shoulder injury really should not have precluded him staying in shape (cardio and abs and diet). To his credit he actually does a mea culpa here:

    http://www.thestar.com/sports/raptor...n_toronto.html

  9. #47
    Raptors Republic Starter Dino4life's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Both times Lowry lost his starting gig it was due to injury. He lost it to Jose due to injury and he lost it to Dragic due to injury. Get your facts straight people. Lowry is a quality starting PG and he will prove that yet again this season.
    What facts ?
    he got injured, the guy on the bench got a chance. That's not loosing your starting job, that's being injured.
    You heal come back and are able to play, but when you were away the team had a better flow so they prefer to continue with the other guy. That's loosing your starting job.
    Top 10 PG's don't loose their starting jobs to injury, Rose, Westbrook, Rondo are going to start this season, whenever Parker and chris Paul ,Rubio, Wall, Irving, Deron Williams, Curry came back from their injuries last year they came back as starters. There's still still Ty lawson, Jrue holliday, Damian Lillard who didn't struggle with injuries. We're past 10.

    No one looses their starting job to injuries, they loose it because the guy on the bench is playing better.
    So we're suppose to bank on Lowry never getting injured again for him to remain the starter ?

  10. #48
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Agree to disagree then. I think he's clearly shown he can run an offense. He's averaged over 6 assists per game the past 3 seasons and he's had an Ast/TO ratio approaching 3. He's also a fantastic 3pt shooter (37%) and great at getting to the line. He was also top 9 among starting PG's in Pure Point Rating last year. I'm not sure what makes you think he can't run an offence as all the evidence is to the contrary.
    Well I agree i disagree because I know I'm right. there are good assists and bad ones, he gets his in less than productive ways. I dont think he's terrible, I just don't think he is a PG who can lead an average team, let alone a championship contender. He is a back up on a decent team. He was a bad decision that was made under pressure. Calderon was better, and if he was a defender, he'd still be in Toronto because Toronto's front court is so soft, was then and kinda still is, that nothing less than a pit bull at the point was required. Lowry was SUPPOSED to be that, but he is not.

  11. #49
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    Quote Dino4life wrote: View Post
    What facts ?
    he got injured, the guy on the bench got a chance. That's not loosing your starting job, that's being injured.
    You heal come back and are able to play, but when you were away the team had a better flow so they prefer to continue with the other guy. That's loosing your starting job.
    Top 10 PG's don't loose their starting jobs to injury, Rose, Westbrook, Rondo are going to start this season, whenever Parker and chris Paul ,Rubio, Wall, Irving, Deron Williams, Curry came back from their injuries last year they came back as starters. There's still still Ty lawson, Jrue holliday, Damian Lillard who didn't struggle with injuries. We're past 10.

    No one looses their starting job to injuries, they loose it because the guy on the bench is playing better.
    So we're suppose to bank on Lowry never getting injured again for him to remain the starter ?
    Are you insinuating that Toronto was a beter team on the floor with Lowry over JC? I disagree completely. Lowry is a bandaid.

  12. #50
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote Craig wrote: View Post
    Are you insinuating that Toronto was a beter team on the floor with Lowry over JC? I disagree completely. Lowry is a bandaid.
    Forget which team was better with Lowry on the floor or Jose.

    Which team was good?

    Neither.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  13. #51
    Raptors Republic Starter Dino4life's Avatar
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    Quote Craig wrote: View Post
    Are you insinuating that Toronto was a beter team on the floor with Lowry over JC? I disagree completely. Lowry is a bandaid.
    i dont see how you got that from what i wrote.

  14. #52
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    I still think Lowry can be a good PG.. I just think he has a bad coach. If Lowry played his game the way he did in Houston then I think he'd be a top 15 PG. Casey neutered him, and he accepted that so that he doesn't have another situation like he did with McHale.

    Saying that.. long term I don't think he fits. But I still think he needs to be resigned to a decent contract (I trust MU with that decision) and then looked to be moved next season when his new contract becomes more valuable to other teams. There are a lot of teams that will have cap space.. I don't think Lowry will net anything valuable during the season. He might give you a larger contract or a late 2nd rounder but I'd be shocked if a team traded away a first round pick for him.

    There is a danger that he walks in free agency but I would take that gamble. Worst case we lose an asset for nothing but I don't think we'd get much from him anyways.

  15. #53
    Raptors Republic Rookie MoscowRussia's Avatar
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    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=m3cdjn8

    I want this. We can add our next year 1st round draft pick or this year second roun pick.
    We can take Lee's contract from Boston but we will have to trade Fields then.

    Why:
    Phoenix: get worse (especialy if KL got injured), get money of the books (in Dragic), get prospect in T.Ross + they don't have a shooting guard on there team.

    Boston: get worse, get healty point guard, may get rid of Lee

    Toronto: Get Rondo.
    Last edited by MoscowRussia; Mon Oct 28th, 2013 at 07:42 AM.
    No new friends (c)

  16. #54
    Raptors Republic Rookie MoscowRussia's Avatar
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    On Dragic for Lowry
    It will be shame to loose job to the same white guy 2 straight times
    No new friends (c)

  17. #55
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I still think Lowry can be a good PG.. I just think he has a bad coach. Casey neutered him, and he accepted that so that he doesn't have another situation like he did with McHale.
    This is a difficult viewpoint for me to swallow. It's simply sad when people think that GM's or coach's that ask players to play the game properly, stop sulking and learn to become a team player that they are somehow "neutering" a player. Thats the biggest load of shit I have ever heard. Playing balls out, with blinders on and getting yours, putting up stats is NOT helping your team win games, not the way KL does it. Not even close.

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