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If JV in untouchable, why not run plays for him?

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  • #46
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    That is kind of my point.

    Right now JV is getting those 6 shots - except he is getting them on the offensive glass and post up to start game.

    Chandler is not JV; JV is not Chandler. The 2012-13 Raptors are not the 2010-11 Mavericks.

    It was my opinion Casey is using him/treating him like Chandler when he is not that dominant defensive presence at this time and he can contribute so much more on the offensive end.

    Again JV is nowhere near the defensive impact Chandler is currently... nor was Chandler the defensive impact he is now in his 2nd year either.

    JV has to adapt, learn, and grow but I think Casey should be doing the same thing to maximize JV in game situations.
    JV is a few games into his 2nd year. If he's the player we all think he can/will be, his time will come. SO FAR (outside of summer league) he's done nothing to suggest he should be be getting special treatment. He needs to WORK HARD for his minutes and i think he will.

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    • #47
      special1 wrote: View Post
      Kobe was actually drafted by the charlotte hornets and traded to the Lakers
      And Rondo was drafted by the Suns.
      -"You can’t run from me. I mean, my heart don’t bleed Kool-Aid."
      -"“I ain’t no diva! I don’t have no blond hair, red hair. I’m Reggie Evans.”

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      • #48
        special1 wrote: View Post
        +1 (the bold) - JV and Ross are not ready for the minutes that posters are expecting them to play. Please be patient with JV as he will take a bit longer than most posters on here expect. I fear that many posters are unrealistic and expecting too much from him. JV WILL get abused by more experienced centers. Its just the way things go....he will get better year after year. Geez - for someone just starting his second year, we are putting him on some high pedestal. He hasn't done ANYTHING so far in the NBA to warrant this pedestal. He's VERY young and has A LOT of potential.....Just relax and be patient.

        He WILL eventually EARN his minutes if he's who we think he could be.
        If this franchise is to go anywhere it is due to JVs growth.

        I call b.s. On being patient. For all those who were oohing and ahhhing about the end of season last year where Rudy and dd went ham and Raptors went 8-1, JV was a huge part of that going for 15/8 on about 60% shooting over last 15-20 games.

        Benching him is going to accomplish nothing except frustration and killing of confidence.

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        • #49
          psrs1 wrote: View Post
          Is the goal to win or trade and tank?
          Nobody knows. That's the thing.
          Twitter - @thekid_it

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          • #50
            special1 wrote: View Post
            JV is a few games into his 2nd year. If he's the player we all think he can/will be, his time will come. SO FAR (outside of summer league) he's done nothing to suggest he should be be getting special treatment. He needs to WORK HARD for his minutes and i think he will.
            That is the attitude to have when you draft a project like DD.

            When have you ever seen JV not work hard?

            I hate to tell you, it isn't special treatment, it is called developing talent... Just like they did for years with DeRozan. The difference of course is JV talent is off the charts and dd was always a project.

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            • #51
              SitnonDfence wrote: View Post
              How quickly we forget what coddling a 7 foot tall lottery pick gets you.

              Frankly, JV isnt playing well and is most likely being held accountable. In three games where he should have been able to dominate inside, he was getting pushed off his spots much too easily by undersized MORE EXPERIENCED bigs. And this is before we take into consideration the matchup issues he provided on the other end of the floor. Considering he is supposed to be a mobile athletic big his close outs were pretty lax.

              If a big man wants touches in the post, hes got to earn them, carve out a spot on the low block, seal off your man and then if the wings look you off, you talk to coach who has probably already noticed whats going on.
              Bingo! I was thinking the same thing going over this thread.......JV has to earn his minutes. This means he has to do whatever the coach asks him to do. NO MORE spoiling/Coddling our young players. I truly believe that JV is simply not ready for this and coach is bringing him on slowly. WE ALL believe that JV will get where we need him to be (even coach Casey).

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              • #52
                golden wrote: View Post
                LOL. Directly or indirectly through the draft? Talk about broadening the scope. Save for very few cases, ALL players enter the NBA through the draft, so obviously every transaction will be directly or indirectly connected to the draft, no?
                That is some serious weasel language there. Lawyer or politician grade. LOL.
                I was thinking the exact same thing.... LMAO

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                • #53
                  special1 wrote: View Post
                  JV is a few games into his 2nd year. If he's the player we all think he can/will be, his time will come. SO FAR (outside of summer league) he's done nothing to suggest he should be be getting special treatment.
                  "Stop eating your sushi."
                  "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
                  "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
                  - Jack Armstrong

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                  • #54
                    special1 wrote: View Post
                    Kobe was actually drafted by the charlotte hornets and traded to the Lakers
                    "Stop eating your sushi."
                    "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
                    "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
                    - Jack Armstrong

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                    • #55
                      Matt52 wrote: View Post
                      If this franchise is to go anywhere it is due to JVs growth.

                      I call b.s. On being patient. For all those who were oohing and ahhhing about the end of season last year where Rudy and dd went ham and Raptors went 8-1, JV was a huge part of that going for 15/8 on about 60% shooting over last 15-20 games.

                      Benching him is going to accomplish nothing except frustration and killing of confidence.
                      Geez - Talk about putting it all on one kid. I don't see superstar anywhere (YET) when i look at JV. I see very good player, maybe even all-star, but so is Chandler/Noah/Lopez. To be honest, if we can fleece a team who thinks he's going to be some superstar, I would trade JV right now. I know that's blasphemy around these parts...lol BUT i still said it!

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                      • #56
                        Matt52 wrote: View Post
                        That is the attitude to have when you draft a project like DD.

                        When have you ever seen JV not work hard?

                        I hate to tell you, it isn't special treatment, it is called developing talent... Just like they did for years with DeRozan. The difference of course is JV talent is off the charts and dd was always a project.
                        There you go again..... JV is getting the same treatment as Demar did!.....Or were you not around at those times? Demar would start but rarely finish games. Also, I fail to see this talent on display in the NBA? I don't see very many offensive moves from JV. I barely see an outside jumper every once in a while. Truthfully, I dont really see all that much at all. However, I love his motor and he seems to genuinely want to be a great player. In fact, I see a lot of similarities between JV and Demar.

                        Not really sure what you mean when you say his talent is "off the charts"......I get nervous when i hear things like this because you used to say this about another 7 foot european.....*worried*

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                        • #57
                          JimiCliff wrote: View Post
                          HAhahaha.....so your gonna quote a stat that i used to show why we should be patient with this team and not blow it up?? You shit on Derozan but he's also in the line up. Dude be consistent....

                          p.s.

                          You still havent proven why he should be getting special treatment after few games into his second year in the NBA.

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                          • #58
                            special1................PREACH son
                            What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
                            The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
                            No Where Near the South Side #WeTheNorth

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                            • #59
                              special1 wrote: View Post
                              There you go again..... JV is getting the same treatment as Demar did!.....Or were you not around at those times? Demar would start but rarely finish games. Also, I fail to see this talent on display in the NBA? I don't see very many offensive moves from JV. I barely see an outside jumper every once in a while. Truthfully, I dont really see all that much at all. However, I love his motor and he seems to genuinely want to be a great player. In fact, I see a lot of similarities between JV and Demar.

                              Not really sure what you mean when you say his talent is "off the charts"......I get nervous when i hear things like this because you used to say this about another 7 foot european.....*worried*
                              Hardly. In DD's second year he was the 2nd option and his minutes went up 14 per game; JV is down 3 minutes per game. JV is in his second year on the bench for more than half the game. How did DD fair in summer league his second season? Did he win MVP?

                              Last 20 games of the season JV averaged nearly 15/8 per game. He was a part of one of the top 5 man line ups of last season. He was the starting C as the team went on a winning streak down the stretch playing big minutes. I always thought those things mattered for those, like yourself, who advocate keeping this core together. The Raptors best ball of last season was played with JV on the floor.

                              Your comments only further solidify my belief that Raptor fans have no idea how to develop true NBA talent. Years of having DD, ED, Sonny Weems, etc. hyped as real players have left you blind.

                              Any comparison to Bargnani shows you're not more than a troll on this topic. He is European? So what. He is talented? Hell yeah. How many bigs shoot 80% from free throw line? People, myself included, were still waiting for Bargnani at 26 years of age; JV is 21. Bargnani was on life support, shied from contact floating on the perimeter, and was a zombie; JV has a motor, bangs, and is not emotionally detached from the game. JV as a rookie was .2 rebounds shy of Bargnani's career best in about 30% fewer minutes per game.

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                              • #60
                                golden wrote: View Post
                                LOL. Directly or indirectly through the draft? Talk about broadening the scope. Save for very few cases, ALL players enter the NBA through the draft, so obviously every transaction will be directly or indirectly connected to the draft, no?

                                That is some serious weasel language there. Lawyer or politician grade. LOL.
                                Fair enough.

                                However the foundation of every single trade for an all-NBA player is draft picks and prospects.

                                25% of All-NBA players are acquired via trade.

                                65% of all-NBA players are drafted by their team.

                                Broadening the scope was exactly the point. The original poster decided to make a point using top 3 picks from 1985 which was hardly revealing of the true situation when it comes to acquiring all-NBA talent that lead championship teams.

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