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Thread: Do Raptors have an identity?

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Default Do Raptors have an identity?

    I was posting in the Miami vs Toronto game thread. Trying to think of an advantage we would have tonight. I actually came up of one. Rebounding! We are #1 in rebounding by a huge margin. This team under coach Casey plays D and controls the glass. Personally I don't think their anything more important in basketball than controlling the glass. I know it's only three games but if you look at our roster it's very sustainable. If you think of the teams that play the same way(Indiana and Chicago) they've had a lot of success. Hopefully this becomes something we can count on every game. If it does? Watch out!
    @Chr1st1anL

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    I agree, here's the stats to back it up.

    http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...sitive-outlook

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    Raptors Republic All-Star JawsGT's Avatar
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    Rebounding is great, and it's nice to see that the Raps finally have a very good rebounding team. Unfortunately, our D still isn't that great IMO. WE need to have that Chicago and Indiana type defensive intensity through 48 minutes if we are to compete with the big boys.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    I was posting in the Miami vs Toronto game thread. Trying to think of an advantage we would have tonight. I actually came up of one. Rebounding! We are #1 in rebounding by a huge margin. This team under coach Casey plays D and controls the glass. Personally I don't think their anything more important in basketball than controlling the glass. I know it's only three games but if you look at our roster it's very sustainable. If you think of the teams that play the same way(Indiana and Chicago) they've had a lot of success. Hopefully this becomes something we can count on every game. If it does? Watch out!
    Ask around the league, ask fans, coaches, and players.... Raps identity = Soft, low skill, easy game.

    Is it true? Sometimes, more often than not actually.
    Can it change? Yep. Gotta build a true winner though. Gotta keep the hard workers, the bangers, and the real ballers. Out with the ego's, the "contract year guys" and the malcontents.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star tucas's Avatar
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    I think it's too early to say Rebounding is our identity. Raptors were in the bottom 10 in the league in rebounds last year. We're off to a good start. But there have been way to many threads this season with such a small sample size.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    IMO, an identity is largely determined by how the competition views you. I don't think the Heat (or any team for that matter) see Toronto on their schedule and say to themselves, "Man, we've got our work cut out tonight on the boards....".

    If the current numbers keep up, then for sure, rebounding can become our identity. But it isn't yet.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote JawsGT wrote: View Post
    Rebounding is great, and it's nice to see that the Raps finally have a very good rebounding team. Unfortunately, our D still isn't that great IMO. WE need to have that Chicago and Indiana type defensive intensity through 48 minutes if we are to compete with the big boys.
    We've allowed 93 point a game so far. I know it's only three games but, I'm starting to think that the numbers the starting unit put up defensively last year wasn't a fluke. You can even say we've gotten better defensively with players Tyler, Fields(healthy), Ross coming off the bench. It starting to come together that Massai actually put together a roster made for the type of ball Casey wants to play.
    @Chr1st1anL

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    IMO, an identity is largely determined by how the competition views you. I don't think the Heat (or any team for that matter) see Toronto on their schedule and say to themselves, "Man, we've got our work cut out tonight on the boards....".

    If the current numbers keep up, then for sure, rebounding can become our identity. But it isn't yet.
    I'm pretty sure Spo said that when he got the numbers and told the team. I hope the Heat do coming lackadaisical on the boards. Play to our advantage!
    @Chr1st1anL

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    I'm pretty sure Spo said that when he got the numbers and told the team. I hope the Heat do coming lackadaisical on the boards. Play to our advantage!
    I guess I was interpreting "identity" to mean "reputation". Do the Raptors have a reputation for being beasts on the glass?

    I would assume no, but I hope it continues to develop.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    We've allowed 93 point a game so far. I know it's only three games but, I'm starting to think that the numbers the starting unit put up defensively last year wasn't a fluke. You can even say we've gotten better defensively with players Tyler, Fields(healthy), Ross coming off the bench. It starting to come together that Massai actually put together a roster made for the type of ball Casey wants to play.
    Yea but I swear we are like close to the bottom in terms of fg% and 3 point%, and to me that's more important.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote GLF wrote: View Post
    Yea but I swear we are like close to the bottom in terms of fg% and 3 point%, and to me that's more important.
    Raps opponent fg% thus far is sad: 46.3% which is 23rd.

    Pace is also 23rd

    Def Rtg is good though: 8th

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    Raptors Republic Rookie GoldenBaller's Avatar
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    It's obviously offence. They've got good passing, ball handling and shooting.

    Code:
    I'm kidding. They SUCK offensively.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star brothersteve's Avatar
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    It’s only three games into the regular season, but it is already obvious Raptors Head Coach Dwane Casey’s defense is back. Number 7 in the NBA for points allowed per 100 possessions at 96.1 and number 1 in rebounding and in keeping opponents off the offensive glass, this time Casey’s defense might even be better than in the lockout shortened 2011-2012 season. Plus, after playing three of last season’s Eastern Conference playoff teams in row, it can’t be said the early indications were the result of soft schedule. Raptors Coach Casey’s Defense Is Back

    This team's identity is defense & rebounding - that is what the changes made to the roster in the summer were all about.

    By the way - getting the ball back by rebounding better trumps a few points on the FG% every time - of course its better to do both well.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
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    Quote brothersteve wrote: View Post

    By the way - getting the ball back by rebounding better trumps a few points on the FG% every time - of course its better to do both well.
    This seems, specious. What are you basing this on?

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    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote brothersteve wrote: View Post
    It’s only three games into the regular season, but it is already obvious Raptors Head Coach Dwane Casey’s defense is back. Number 7 in the NBA for points allowed per 100 possessions at 96.1 and number 1 in rebounding and in keeping opponents off the offensive glass, this time Casey’s defense might even be better than in the lockout shortened 2011-2012 season. Plus, after playing three of last season’s Eastern Conference playoff teams in row, it can’t be said the early indications were the result of soft schedule. Raptors Coach Casey’s Defense Is Back

    This team's identity is defense & rebounding - that is what the changes made to the roster in the summer were all about.

    By the way - getting the ball back by rebounding better trumps a few points on the FG% every time - of course its better to do both well.
    I don't want to be a party-pooper, but the Raptors have played 1 decent team (Atlanta) and 2 awful teams (Boston and Milwaukee with its best players glued to the bench), so I hardly think the defensive stats are accurate at this early stage in the season. Those 3 teams might have been playoff teams last season, but none of their rosters even remotely resemble their teams from a year ago! There's a good chance that at least 2 of them aren't in the playoffs this season, with a possibility that all three wind up on the outside looking in.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Fully's Avatar
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    Quote tucas wrote: View Post
    I think it's too early to say Rebounding is our identity. Raptors were in the bottom 10 in the league in rebounds last year. We're off to a good start. But there have been way to many threads this season with such a small sample size.
    I came in to say something similar. An identity is crafted over a season, or in some cases, a number of them. Not after three games. Let's wait until the 15-20 game mark and some tougher competition before we start calling this team the second coming of the Bulls.

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    Quote brothersteve wrote: View Post
    It’s only three games into the regular season, but it is already obvious Raptors Head Coach Dwane Casey’s defense is back. Number 7 in the NBA for points allowed per 100 possessions at 96.1 and number 1 in rebounding and in keeping opponents off the offensive glass, this time Casey’s defense might even be better than in the lockout shortened 2011-2012 season. Plus, after playing three of last season’s Eastern Conference playoff teams in row, it can’t be said the early indications were the result of soft schedule. Raptors Coach Casey’s Defense Is Back

    This team's identity is defense & rebounding - that is what the changes made to the roster in the summer were all about.

    By the way - getting the ball back by rebounding better trumps a few points on the FG% every time - of course its better to do both well.
    Wait a minute. I was at that Boston game and I feel confident saying the Celtics may actually be the worst team in the NBA until Rondo gets back on the floor. Still, the Raptors had their hands full. The Bucks are a middle of the pack squad. The Hawks are somewhere in the same realm and they smacked the Raptors around for most of the night.

    I don't think anything is obvious about this team after only three games. Defense, rebounding, the overall quality of the team... you name it. I'm not saying that they can't sustain them necessarily but it's waaaaay too early to be extrapolating those things over a full 82 game season. Tonight against the Heat will be a great measuring stick.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote brothersteve wrote: View Post
    It’s only three games into the regular season, but it is already obvious Raptors Head Coach Dwane Casey’s defense is back. Number 7 in the NBA for points allowed per 100 possessions at 96.1 and number 1 in rebounding and in keeping opponents off the offensive glass, this time Casey’s defense might even be better than in the lockout shortened 2011-2012 season. Plus, after playing three of last season’s Eastern Conference playoff teams in row, it can’t be said the early indications were the result of soft schedule. Raptors Coach Casey’s Defense Is Back

    This team's identity is defense & rebounding - that is what the changes made to the roster in the summer were all about.

    By the way - getting the ball back by rebounding better trumps a few points on the FG% every time - of course its better to do both well.
    I disagree it is back but I've been wrong before and look forward again. I am looking forward to December 15th to see where this team really is beyond a 3 game sample.

    You are basing this defensive prowess off two wins versus Milwaukee and Boston? I hate to say it but those teams SUCK - Boston missing best player and Milwaukee starting a 2nd round rookie as their starter with starter and back up out due to injury (Knight and Ridnour). Neither of those wins were convincing either. Atlanta is the only decent team they have played and they lost giving up 102 points.

    Small sample size yada yada yada works both ways - good and bad.

    That opponent field goal percent is extremely important. In 2011-12, the only team that wasn't in the playoffs in the top 10 of opponent fg% was Toronto. Last season the only team in the top 10 not in the playoffs was Washington. Even one of your articles from 2011-12 featured it a quote from Casey trumping the importance of it:

    Evidence of a culture change can be found in hard statistics everywhere one looks. The Raptors have languished near the bottom in defensive efficiency, points allowed and opponents’ field goal percentage seemingly forever, but that is no longer the case.

    “We are fifteenth in defensive efficiency and we were about 25 (last season) and I didn’t think we would make that big of a jump in year one,” Casey said. “All I can go back to is in Dallas where we started very low and we got to the middle of the pack in year two, so we have really exceeded expectations to get to fifteenth and be consistently in the top 10 in field goal percentage (against).”

    http://www.hoopsworld.com/toronto-ra...n-accomplished
    That culture change didn't last too long.

    Also in the 6 reasons why Raptors make 2012-13 playoffs, one of the reasons you trumpeted was defense included the opponent field goal percentage of 2011-12:

    1. Defense

    In 2010-11, Toronto gave up 105.4 points per game and was the second-easiest team to score on in the NBA. The Raptors couldn’t stop anyone. Since last summer, Coach Casey has changed the team’s culture and in a lockout shortened season, the Raptors surrendered the ninth-fewest points allowed at 94, while holding teams to the league’s eighth-lowest field goal percentage. With a full training camp and preseason schedule, there is a realistic expectation the Raptors’ defense would have been even better this time without any roster upgrades, but this roster is better.

    http://www.hoopsworld.com/six-reason...s-the-playoffs
    If the Raptors don't get that opponent field goal percentage down these first two wins of the season will only emphasize how bad Boston and Milwaukee are/were at that time due to missing players. Raptors play a solid defensive team and suddenly their 18th fg% is not going to squeak out a when when they are giving up the 23rd worst opponent fg%.
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    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
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    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote brothersteve wrote: View Post
    This team's identity is defense & rebounding - that is what the changes made to the roster in the summer were all about.
    Just reiterating what everyone else has said, but it's only been 3 games man. I would certainly like it to be our identity though. Tonight will be the ultimate test.
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