Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 139

Thread: Jack Armstrong: Gay/DD are NOT selfish players

  1. #1
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    18,986
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Jack Armstrong: Gay/DD are NOT selfish players

    5. RUDY GAY & DEMAR DEROZAN (Raptors): Let me get this right out there in the open: they are NOT selfish players. Does the offence slow down and/or come to a stop when they get the ball? At times, yes. With Gay shooting 37 percent and averaging 17.6 field goal attempts, and DeRozan shooting 39 percent and averaging 16.6 field goal attempts, there are a lot of concerns about the fluidity and flow of the Raptors offence. They are legitimate concerns that I'm sure Dwane Casey and his staff is spending a significant time on to address. Offensive continuity is a huge challenge on every team and is a tough habit to crack. You watch San Antonio destroy the Knicks Sunday and you see a team where the ball moves and there is incredible flow. You watch the Miami Heat on most nights and the ball and player movement is picturesque. The Raptors have a ways to go to get there but they can. Both Gay and DeRozan are guys that love to probe and attack the defence with the dribble which I'm cool with. The area that both need to improve upon is identifying when to dribble it, pass it or shoot it, and they need to decide a whole lot quicker before the defence gangs up on them and their four teammates become spectators. Be decisive. The idea of using four, five, six, evenseven dribbles to create a shot when the other four guys on your team stand and watch and your opponent loads up on you forcing lower percentage shots has to be a no-no. Both are very talented offensive players that can get big numbers on their own and yet more importantly can, and know how to, do it within the confines of a more structured offence. I talk every night to coaches and scouts from opposing teams and the major theme with the Raptors is that at times these two guys make their team too easy to guard with the ball-stopping habits; habits that can and have to be broken. It's easier said than done yet this is a fixable issue. Both are good guys and team guys and want to win yet their style of play sometimes causes indecision by teammates. The improvement of the player and ball movement by the Raptors will lead to a much improved team. I have no doubt that if they improve this area they'll be a tough team for any opponent to defend and that's a benefit to everyone.

    http://www.tsn.ca/nba/story/?id=436397
    What do you think?

    Are Gay/DD selfish?

    If they aren't selfish, what are they?
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Superstar iblastoff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    2,766
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I think it's just semantics really. Are they actually selfish and only want to score on their own? Probably not. Does their current playing style just make them look like selfish players? Sure.

  3. Like ReubenJRD liked this post
  4. #3
    Raptors Republic Superstar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    4,939
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I lean towards them just not having the "passing gene". The ball does seem to get stuck in their hands though. I just dont know whether the coaches have been diligent about coaching offensive sets and then been vocal about not executing them if not followed thru on. Unless in transition of course I wish DC or Nurse were active about directing the PGs on offensive plays to get some of the load off Lowry and others. This should help I think.

  5. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    983
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Gay seems to have an alpha-dog complex, trade him.

    DeRozan on the other hand I think would probably pass more if the team was better coached.

  6. #5
    Raptors Republic Superstar FoxMachine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,508
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    it sounds like jack doesn't think they are selfish but they are just stupid... I tend to think it's a little of both.. its just my opinion but I do think that gay takes dumb shots and ALOT of shots so he can try to get his stats up when its not coming easy.. I also think he just has poor bball IQ.

    I expected derozan to be a lot better this year and I don't think he is as bad as Gay in either of these areas but he does take a lot of shots to get his points and a lot of them aren't great ones. He took a ridiculous amount of hero shots and long 2's in his 31 point game and if they weren't dropping people would have been calling for his head because they were just bad decisions.

  7. #6
    Raptors Republic Starter phez's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    750
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    derozan and gay playstyles are very iso centric. you cant call that selfish anymore than you can say that for westbrook, harden, kobe, iverson, etc etc.

    obviously im not saying they are as good as those players, just talking about how they play.

    that being said, when you see gay and derozan working off each other and passing to each other, things go very well for the raptors

  8. #7
    Raptors Republic All-Star Jangles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    1,522
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If their type of play is not selfish, I'm not sure what is. If you're 2-9, why continue jacking up contested long twos? Your bigs are scoring efficiently and are on rolls yet you shake them off for a contested off balance jumper? Selfish basketball.

  9. Like OldSkoolCool, Nilanka, isaacthompson liked this post
  10. #8
    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Niagara
    Posts
    2,698
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If you arent looking to share the ball, youre selfish.

  11. #9
    Raptors Republic Veteran ceez's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    6,696
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    They're not selfish they just don't pass a lot

  12. Like gametime liked this post
  13. #10
    Raptors Republic Rookie gametime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    180
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'd say the coach dictates a fair bit with the play calls... and if he's constantly stressing the ball be in their hands, it's going to be. They're not selfish as ceez says... there's more to it.

  14. #11
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    56
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Gay and DeRozan FG%

    I have been watching the NBA for a long time and from what I remember, when a player FG% goes under 50%, he is more or less done. Now why do I mention this? Before Houston, Gay was shooting 37% and in Houston, he was even worst 11-37. Before Houston, DeRozan was shooting 38% and in Houston he was even worst 6-25. And itís not just the fact that they are in the shooting slump, but the fact that they have the green light to light it up even when they are off, as if they have to score 40 plus for us to have a chance to win the game.

    We did not stay close in Houston based on their performance because of them but despite their performance. We stayed close thanks to defense and rebounding, especially offensive rebounding. Good luck to Masai trying to trade these guys.

  15. #12
    Raptors Republic Starter Katman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Burlington
    Posts
    230
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    What do you think?

    Are Gay/DD selfish?

    If they aren't selfish, what are they?
    They're Crap!

  16. #13
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    18,986
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I don't think they are selfish. I don't think they're bad teammates or bad people.

    What I do think is if there was a basketball cognitive chart they would be plotted on functionally retarded.

    They are just low, low, low IQ players. This quote is just gold right now:

    He takes a hell of a lot of pressure off me and vice versa,’ DeRozan said of Gay. ‘A lot of people get into the analytic stuff — we don’t pay no attention to that because we know how much we can help this team. As long as we play on the defensive end, we don’t have to worry about scoring — nothing, none of that — because we can score the ball at will.’
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Tue Nov 12th, 2013 at 09:29 AM.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  17. Like Axel liked this post
  18. #14
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    5,975
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I didn't think it was possible, but Leo actually said something that I hadn't heard before. He talked about the importance of ball movement, but explained it this way (I'm paraphrasing a bit):

    "The pass let's you get a 1 second head start against the defence. Once you have that head start, you have to keep the ball moving to maintain that advantage over the defence. Keep passing the ball until you find the open man and get a good shot"

    It's common sense, but I've never heard it explained that way before. Finally a juicy nugget from Leo. All it took was 18 years.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  19. Like blackjitsu, Axel liked this post
  20. #15
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    5,975
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    As for Rudy and DeMar, whether they're innately selfish, or selfish as a result of Casey's piss-poor offensive scheming, the results are the same: Low-percentage shots, and more losses in the standings.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  21. #16
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    5,975
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Karl Marx. wrote: View Post
    We did not stay close in Houston based on their performance because of them but despite their performance. We stayed close thanks to defense and rebounding, especially offensive rebounding. Good luck to Masai trying to trade these guys.
    Couldn't agree more....and to a certain extent, you could say that about the whole season so far. We're keeping games close despite our wretched offensive, not because of it. Our offense is by no means a weapon to be feared.
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  22. #17
    Raptors Republic All-Star grindhouse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    1,319
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Coaching

  23. #18
    Raptors Republic All-Star slaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    2,098
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Whatever you call it, it's crap basketball and it's a 3-5 team. You can tell Lowry has already said *&$^ it, I'm getting mine. Only a matter of time before everyone else adopts the same mentality.

  24. #19
    Raptors Republic All-Star Fully's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    1,035
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    They play a selfish brand of basketball but I don't believe they are selfish people. They honestly believe that they are doing what's best for the team right now. Hell, they're probably just following the game plan from Casey.

  25. Like Axel liked this post
  26. #20
    Raptors Republic Superstar iblastoff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    2,766
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'm still gonna give them the benefit of the doubt that this is just a temporary slump. Maybe its just my eyes but it does seem like both are driving more to the rim, but neither seem to actually be able to finish that well.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •