View Poll Results: What changes do you want to make to this team?

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39. You may not vote on this poll
  • Firesale, Total Rebuild - trade anyone and everyone and rebuild the entire roster

    2 5.13%
  • Whoa big fella - firesale minus JV

    13 33.33%
  • Coaching change - get us a new bench leader

    17 43.59%
  • Trade Rudy - Moving Rudy alone will make this team better and free cap space

    21 53.85%
  • Trade Lowry - we need a new PG to lead this team

    18 46.15%
  • Trade Demar - our best scorer just isn't good enough to take this team over the hump

    6 15.38%
  • Put Rudy on the bench - minimize his role and let him fire away from the bench

    3 7.69%
  • Start Amir again - bring him back to the starting lineup and all will be well

    4 10.26%
  • Cash in on other assets - trade guys like Amir, Tyler, Novak, Ross for assets that help the core

    9 23.08%
  • Stand pat - do nothing, internal organic growth will make this team better

    1 2.56%
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Thread: D-DAY 12-15-13 - TRADE DEADLINE RUMOR THREAD - The Because There Will Be Many Edition

  1. #61
    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    How about Jimmer to Miami, Gray to Sacramento and picks to Toronto? 2nd round picks are welcome.
    I'd love to see this happen, but I think when Miami's talking SG help, they need a bit more than a 5 mpg garbage time guy.
    Twitter - @thekid_it

  2. #62
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    Interesting that Sacramento just assigned Senegalese center Hamady NDiaye to their d-league affiliate. He's been getting 3-5 minutes a night most nights. So... here's a couple conspiracy theories:
    1) Gray's arrival in Sac-town is imminent and this move frees up his minutes.
    2) Ujiri's got an interest in NDiaye, who can't be moved until the 15th. So Sacramento shipped NDiaye to the d-league to allow him to play bigger minutes.

    More likely theory: it means nothing.

  3. #63
    Raptors Republic Veteran Bendit's Avatar
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    It's more of a possibility than the Jimmer story. If MU is going for a team breakup and collecting assets that would be a more likely deal. FYI...Pete D the Sac gm was MU's right hand man in Denver so there is some "connection" there.

  4. #64
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    Jimmer serves neither what tankers or anti-tankers have in mind. Why would anybody think he's worth anything the kings would take from us?

  5. #65
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Jimmer serves neither what tankers or anti-tankers have in mind. Why would anybody think he's worth anything the kings would take from us?
    Well the rumour involved Aaron Gray. Is he currently serving the team in any useful way? Not really. He's a depth C who really should only get minutes in emergency situations. Losing him certainly doesn't negatively impact the team in any way.

    I mean, what is Aaron Gray worth? I would think nothing until this rumour. At best he could be filler in another trade.

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  7. #66
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Well the rumour involved Aaron Gray. Is he currently serving the team in any useful way? Not really. He's a depth C who really should only get minutes in emergency situations. Losing him certainly doesn't negatively impact the team in any way.

    I mean, what is Aaron Gray worth? I would think nothing until this rumour. At best he could be filler in another trade.
    So trading an end of bench big (that we're short of) for an end of bench undersized SG (that we have plenty of) does what for either side of the tank debate? 1 near useless scrub for an even more useless scrub. Don't get it. At least Gray provides a big body for JV to work against in practice. Jimmer? Nothing for anybody.
    Last edited by p00ka; Fri Dec 6th, 2013 at 06:43 PM.

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  9. #67
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    So trading an end of bench big (that we're short of) for an end of bench undersized SG (that we have plenty of) does what for either side of the tank debate? 1 near useless scrub for an even more useless scrub. Don't get it. At least Gray provides a big body for JV to work against in practice. Jimmer? Nothing for anybody.
    It has nothing to do with the tank debate. It's seeing if a youngish guard who's at least supposedly got one skill (shooting) will fit better than a limited big who is not going to improve at all anymore and isn't getting minutes. Being a big practice body is not that important. For instance I bet Jonas gets infinitely more practicing against Tyler and Amir than he does going against Gray, the immovable (immobile?) object.

    Gray isn't quick, isn't long, isn't a shot blocker, and while his gravitational field alone pulls rebounds toward him, he's not a "get after it" rebounder. What does Jonas gain from practicing against him that he wouldn't get from using a 7 foot pylon?

    Does Jimmer really do anything for the team? No, but he's probably a better asset than Gray, even just to be flipped later on. Also as a shooting specialist (regardless of position) he's cheaper than Novak, which could make him easier to use as filler, or also a replacement situational player if Novak is shipped out.

    It basically all comes down to what's a better asset: a 29 year old overweight 3rd string C with low mobility, no athleticism and no offensive game to speak of? Or a 24 year old undersized backup shooting guard (or PG with bad passing ability) with at least one tangible skill (shooting)? I'd say just on age alone Fredette wins. Gray isn't going to give a team anything they can't get by signing a random unemployed veteran like Jason Collins.

  10. #68
    Raptors Republic All-Star OldSkoolCool's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    So trading an end of bench big (that we're short of) for an end of bench undersized SG (that we have plenty of) does what for either side of the tank debate? 1 near useless scrub for an even more useless scrub. Don't get it. At least Gray provides a big body for JV to work against in practice. Jimmer? Nothing for anybody.
    Another conspiracy theory

    But if we move DD, we will have no SG off the bench...so it makes sense to take a flier on Gray, especially when Gray doesn't play anyways.

  11. #69
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    Umm if you can trade Aaron Gray for Jimmer Fredette, you do it 10 times out of 10.

    There's always the possibility that Jimmer could be a bit of a late bloomer in the NBA like Redick was.

  12. #70
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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    It has nothing to do with the tank debate. It's seeing if a youngish guard who's at least supposedly got one skill (shooting) will fit better than a limited big who is not going to improve at all anymore and isn't getting minutes. Being a big practice body is not that important. For instance I bet Jonas gets infinitely more practicing against Tyler and Amir than he does going against Gray, the immovable (immobile?) object.

    Gray isn't quick, isn't long, isn't a shot blocker, and while his gravitational field alone pulls rebounds toward him, he's not a "get after it" rebounder. What does Jonas gain from practicing against him that he wouldn't get from using a 7 foot pylon?

    Does Jimmer really do anything for the team? No, but he's probably a better asset than Gray, even just to be flipped later on. Also as a shooting specialist (regardless of position) he's cheaper than Novak, which could make him easier to use as filler, or also a replacement situational player if Novak is shipped out.

    It basically all comes down to what's a better asset: a 29 year old overweight 3rd string C with low mobility, no athleticism and no offensive game to speak of? Or a 24 year old undersized backup shooting guard (or PG with bad passing ability) with at least one tangible skill (shooting)? I'd say just on age alone Fredette wins. Gray isn't going to give a team anything they can't get by signing a random unemployed veteran like Jason Collins.
    I'm near speechless, but my original point stated "for anyone the kings would want". If Gray is as bad as you say, and Jimmer holds any actual NBA potential, why the fuck do they take Gray?

  13. #71
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    I'm near speechless, but my original point stated "for anyone the kings would want". If Gray is as bad as you say, and Jimmer holds any actual NBA potential, why the fuck do they take Gray?
    Because they're one of the most poorly managed franchises ever.

  14. #72
    Super Moderator CalgaryRapsFan's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    I'm near speechless, but my original point stated "for anyone the kings would want". If Gray is as bad as you say, and Jimmer holds any actual NBA potential, why the fuck do they take Gray?
    That's what the rumor was, so people are just commenting on it, regardless of its legitimacy.

    As many people have said, a Gray for Fredette trade is a no brainer, IMO.

  15. #73
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    That's what the rumor was, so people are just commenting on it, regardless of its legitimacy.

    As many people have said, a Gray for Fredette trade is a no brainer, IMO.
    There was no rumour. It's some writer's wild speculation of a possibility. The kind one can buy for a dime a hundred, but like most on-line writers writing about the NBA, he knows damn well the way to get hits is to write some wild ass bs surrounding the Raptors.

    IMO, it's a no brainer the opposite direction. In any case, folks, done talking about such silliness (imo). Have fun with this though.

  16. #74
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    There was no rumour. It's some writer's wild speculation of a possibility. The kind one can buy for a dime a hundred, but like most on-line writers writing about the NBA, he knows damn well the way to get hits is to write some wild ass bs surrounding the Raptors.

    IMO, it's a no brainer the opposite direction. In any case, folks, done talking about such silliness (imo). Have fun with this though.
    There was a rumour. A rumour is a rumour. It doesn't matter if it's fabricated and baseless. If I say Jimmer Fredette is being considered for the MVP award, and it spreads across the media, it's a rumour, even if it makes no sense, and is such until (easily) proven false. It is unverified information being spread and discussed until it's proven to be totally false and made up.

    rumour: a currently circulating story or report of uncertain or doubtful truth.

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  18. #75
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Fields for Anthony & Jones & 2nd round pick

    Raps save $0.95M this season (pro-rated) and $2.45M next season (assuming Anthony picks-up his $3.8M player option). Anthony wouldn't be a bad 3rd string C on an expiring contract.
    Miami amnestied Mike Miller to save $$$ with luxury/repeater tax implications.

    Don't see them taking Fields.

    Don't forget Chalmers is due for a new contract too.... and if not Chalmers they need PG help.
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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  20. #76
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    Quote Blacklash2k4 wrote: View Post
    Still it's not a horrible trade if we trade Gray for him. Gray sits on the bench most of the time. Worst case scenario is that he's a bench warmer which is what Gray was anyways...
    Fair enough.

  21. #77
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    Toronto has nothing that would match Heat's need. Also, the 3 team trades that are suggested here are too complex and too unrealistic to ever happen.

  22. #78
    Raptors Republic All-Star JawsGT's Avatar
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    Default Moves to be made going forward

    Whether or in favour of tanking or not, it is clear that this team just isn't good enough to compete as is. With a new GM and a record that gets poorer by the game, something has got to give. What do you feel are the priorities going forward in order to build a competitive team, either for this season or future seasons?

    Multiple choices can be made in the poll.
    Last edited by JawsGT; Sat Dec 7th, 2013 at 07:35 AM.

  23. #79
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Quote JawsGT wrote: View Post
    it is clear that this team just isn't good enough to compete as is.
    Not sure everyone will agree with that statement. "Compete" is subjective to a degree, and is relative to what is being competed for. Can the Raps compete for a championship? No. Can they compete in the first round? uhhh, maybe? Can they compete for the division title? Yes. Can they compete for a playoff spot? Yes.

    Although I don't count myself among them, I still believe their are posters who think that the raps can compete for the playoffs, division title, and a win in the first round, and are happy to finally see some raps playoffs again.

    But I don't think they can compete for a conference finals, which is what my arbitrary criteria is.

    So what moves need to be made

    1) Move out bad fit players/players on bad contracts for players of equal talent on shorter bad contracts or on players with better contracts but less talent. The idea is to have contracts that have good production (or good estimated future production) relative to their dollar amount.

    2) Understanding the want of good talent/cash ratio, focus on trades that ship out older players for younger players or future younger players (aka draft picks)

    3) This one is a bit nutty, so feel free to dismiss, but try trading with a competitive team for a draft pick far in the future when you think that there's a good chance they'll be crappy again. For instance in a deal with OKC try to get a first rounder a season or two after Durant hits free agency, in the hopes that he signs elsewhere and they miss the playoffs.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  24. #80
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Miami amnestied Mike Miller to save $$$ with luxury/repeater tax implications.

    Don't see them taking Fields.

    Don't forget Chalmers is due for a new contract too.... and if not Chalmers they need PG help.
    Lowry would be perfect for them.

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