Debate settled......

[Masai Ujiri]

Here we have #tankforWiggins and then not trading Demar. They're both SG's (if we do land him, we can move DD .

I'm pretty sure Wiggins is a 3.

[qb5PHILA@hotmail.com]

Here we have #tankforWiggins and then not trading Demar. They're both SG's (if we do land him, we can move DD .

Andrew wiggins is most certainly not a sg

[OldSkoolCool]

And I will side with that argument not making any damn sense.

It's a team sport, and DeRozan isn't a #1 option on a title contender, I don't think anyone on this whole forum would disagree with that. What he IS, is a very capable secondary or tertiary scorer that is among the best players in the league at his position. If you get blown away in an offer and it helps the team? Sure trade him. But you don't look to ship him out just because he's playing better than normal, he's not some trash that we have to get rid of to move forward.

Kyrie Irving and John Wall have pretty bad won-loss records as well, so does a guy like Cousins. Guess their teams should start trying to ship them out the second they have a string of good games right?

You don't like my arguments when I:

Describe in detail with evidence that he actually isn't good enough to be a major piece on a championship team

or

Describe that he doesn't work with the future goals of this team, from what we should want from our wings

or

State that during two of those 4 seasons the Raptors have been in win now mode, and yet DD has never been a part of a +.500 team, as a major or minor piece, so yes I'd say he isn't great at producing wins (which is backed up statistically)

or

Anything that doesn't hold DD in the highest light

..........


Really all I'm trying to say is that it really is best for the future of this franchise to trade him

/end

[Chr1s1anL]

Debate settled......

What kind of team did Masai build in Denver? He built a deep team with no superstar. This team just got deeper. Vasquez, Ross, Novak, Hansbro and Patterson coming off the bench. That line up can run with any other back up line up. I really hope Masai gives this group a chance. If this team plays D and moves the ball on offence, they will be a lot of fun to watch. Could be a lot more successful than the team prior the trade.

Lowry/Vasquez
Dd/Ross
Landry/Novak
Amir/Hansbrough
JV/Patterson

Still lost on the direction. I said earlier Ujiri just made a better fitting roster. A more flexible cap for the future. Still hoping for the playoffs.

1-0 since the trade lol

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[LBF]

LOL. You people think this trade means they're tanking???

I dont know what Ujiri's plan is but this trade has actually made the Raptors a better team. They now have depth and they now have a LEGIT backup PG who's more than capable of being a starter in Vazquez.

Raptors aren’t done. Will continue to try to get very bad in hunt for @22wiggins or the other top guys.

— Ryan Wolstat (@WolstatSun) December 9, 2013

[Mr.Z]

Fuuuuuuck I'm so conflicted. I have no idea how to feel when watching their games. I love watching them win but I reallllllly don't want them to win any games.

I want this guy

[Chr1s1anL]

Raptors aren’t done. Will continue to try to get very bad in hunt for @22wiggins or the other top guys.

— Ryan Wolstat (@WolstatSun) December 9, 2013

That's just an opinion. Watch him contradict himself when Patterson and Vasquez contribute off the bench.

Raptors traded from position of strength(Wing scoring) but They also got better at areas of weakness. Assist, with Rudy gone more ball movement and they picked up a player that average 9 assist last year(Vasquez). Bench scoring and spacing. Vasquez and Patterson will be ideal in pick and pop scenario off the bench. Which will help with the PnR. Which will leave more open shots for Ross and Novak on perimeter. Patterson is also a good corner three shooter for a big.

Masai you sly fix you.


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[iblastoff]

Debate settled......

Basically every thread involving both TO and SAC fans end up like this:

"Toronto got smoked in the deal. RUDYY GAY! We got rid of all our trash and get the best player in the trade" -SAC fan

"Have you seen rudy play this season?" - Toronto response

And vice versa

"MU is god! How did he ever convince a team to take rudy? And we get a great PG and some other decent players back all with expiring contracts! All our PG issues are now solved!" - Toronto fan

"Have you seen Vasquez/Patterson/etc play this season????" - SAC fan response

The main win here is dumping gays salary for expiring contracts. You have to be REALLY reaching to think these garbage players coming back in the trade make Toronto a noticeably better team.

[The Great One]

Raptors aren’t done. Will continue to try to get very bad in hunt for @22wiggins or the other top guys.

— Ryan Wolstat (@WolstatSun) December 9, 2013

That's just an opinion man.

Anyway, not sure why people here are acting they now know what direction Masai is going because like i said. This trade made the Raptors a better team.

[Chr1s1anL]

Debate settled......

Basically every thread involving both TO and SAC fans end up like this:

"Toronto got smoked in the deal. RUDYY GAY! We got rid of all our trash and get the best player in the trade" -SAC fan

"Have you seen rudy play this season?" - Toronto response

And vice versa

"MU is god! How did he ever convince a team to take rudy? And we get a great PG and some other decent players back all with expiring contracts! All our PG issues are now solved!" - Toronto fan

"Have you seen Vasquez/Patterson/etc play this season????" - SAC fan response

The main win here is dumping gays salary for expiring contracts. You have to be REALLY reaching to think these garbage players coming back in the trade make Toronto a noticeably better team.

You get two players that have had success as starters in this league and make them reserves. To a bench that's been exposed all season long.
I don't like Salmons he seem like his that vet Casey been waiting for to take minutes away from Ross.

http://youtu.be/752pe1XdahI

http://youtu.be/RbW5DpftRqE


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[isaacthompson]

Fuuuuuuck I'm so conflicted. I have no idea how to feel when watching their games. I love watching them win but I reallllllly don't want them to win any games.

I want this guy

Me exactly.

[Craiger]

LOL. You people think this trade means they're tanking???

I dont know what Ujiri's plan is but this trade has actually made the Raptors a better team. They now have depth and they now have a LEGIT backup PG who's more than capable of being a starter in Vazquez.

I actually agree with this. While these contracts predominantly end this year, the Raps did get a starter quality PG aswell as some serviceable players, while giving up the best prospect in Acy (well I think anyways). This return is similar to the Augustine/Hansborough signings... not a clear tank indication or a win now indication. Another 'wait and see' (what else happens) move if anything.

[Fully]

Rudy was so bad this year that the team will probably improve just by removing him from the lineup. But outside of Vasquez I don't think we are getting much back from Sacramento outside of cap flexibility. Hayes is on his last legs as a pro, and Salmons/PP were both mediocre reserves on a lousy team. For all the talk about Rudy's poor shooting, Salmons/Patterson are shooting 35% and 41% from the field respectively.

The tank is on gentlemen. I'd expect Lowry and at least one of Amir/DD to be gone by Christmas Day. Novak or Hansbrough are also in play.

[Superjudge]

How many game did toronto lose by 5pts or less?

cuz thats what I think Rudy's efficiency issue cost toronto.

toronto has a some decent players, with Gay gone, if they are given meaningful roles they will likely play well, well enough to keep this team out of the top 5 picks.

[Nilanka]

I really can't see how anyone could say the Raptors are a better team now. We got junk in exchange for junk (let's all stop drooling over Vasquez please).

The Raptors will continue to lose a lot more games than they win. If that's not tanking, I'm not sure what is.