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  • #16
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Holiday was an All-Star. I think there is way too much value placed on DD here - and that is not my well not criticisms speaking.

    If Lowry is gone at the end of this season and Butler and Udoh are just filler, ask yourself:
    Would you give up the Raptors 2014 (top 5 protected) pick and JV for DeRozan?

    I'd do Butler, Udoh, 'Po for DD and Lowry in a heart beat.
    Which is exactly why Milwaukee wouldn't do it.
    "Stop eating your sushi."
    "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
    "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
    - Jack Armstrong

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    • #17
      magoon wrote: View Post
      Look, the reason everybody wants Milwaukee's 2014 pick is because it is going to be a lottery pick, and probably a very good one, because Milwaukee is not making playoffs this year. Sanders is out. Delfino is out. Pachulia is out. They're trying to win games by giving the ball to Brandon Knight, John Henson and Gary Neal because there is basically nobody else left.

      I am so tired of trade scenarios where people think they can pry away the most precious assets Milwaukee has with our players. Trading Jonas probably wouldn't get us that pick or Giannis at this point, because Milwaukee may want to always compete but they're also not stupid. This season is already over for them.
      And despite all that they are just 5 games out of the playoffs with 62 games left to play with Sanders due back soon.

      2014 pick is not coming Milwaukee without protections in any trade.

      However if you give them a chance at the playoffs by sending them 3 starters (or at very least 2 starters and solid big off bench in Amir), do they give up 'Po?

      Breaking it down even further: do you give up 'Po for DeRozan?

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      • #18
        Matt52 wrote: View Post
        And despite all that they are just 5 games out of the playoffs with 62 games left to play with Sanders due back soon.

        2014 pick is not coming Milwaukee without protections in any trade.

        However if you give them a chance at the playoffs by sending them 3 starters (or at very least 2 starters and solid big off bench in Amir), do they give up 'Po?

        Breaking it down even further: do you give up 'Po for DeRozan?
        Given that the owner's made it clear that he wants to win now, I could see that 'Po may not be as untouchable as many think.

        But, I think Toronto is a bad trading partner. Mil just added new players at the 1 and 2; our most attractive trade chips are at the 1 and 2. They already have a long list of slightly-above-average bigs; Amir would be a redundant add to that.

        Hammond's play is to parlay 'Po into a significant upgrade at the 3 or 4.
        Last edited by JimiCliff; Tue Dec 10, 2013, 11:41 AM.
        "Stop eating your sushi."
        "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
        "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
        - Jack Armstrong

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        • #19
          Matt52 wrote: View Post
          Breaking it down even further: do you give up 'Po for DeRozan?
          No, because DeRozan is only a very slight upgrade over O.J. Mayo right now and Mayo is cheaper.

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          • #20
            Toronto, and any bottom tier eastern team is a good trading partner because the worse we get the easier it becomes for Milwaukee to make the playoffs.
            Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
            Because its 2015

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            • #21
              Matt52 wrote: View Post
              Holiday was an All-Star. I think there is way too much value placed on DD here - and that is not my well not criticisms speaking.

              If Lowry is gone at the end of this season and Butler and Udoh are just filler, ask yourself:
              Would you give up the Raptors 2014 (top 5 protected) pick and JV for DeRozan?

              I'd do Butler, Udoh, 'Po for DD and Lowry in a heart beat.
              When I threw this trade up I was thinking the same thing... but you might be able to convince another GM that DeRozan is almost as good as Holiday. Yes Holiday was an all-star, but people think DD could be an all-star this year.

              From all the discussions we have on this forum I'm sure similar discussions could be had between GM's. DD is a nice guy, he likes playing in the North, he's on a long term contract at a decent value, he is getting better, blah, blah.

              2014 (top 5 protected) + Noel (6th pick) is better than 2014 (top 5 protected) + Po (15th pick). Holiday is better than DD.. but by how far? And can MU convince a GM that its not that far?
              Last edited by planetmars; Tue Dec 10, 2013, 06:41 PM.

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              • #22
                planetmars wrote: View Post
                Holiday is better than DD.. but by how far?
                DeMar had a good offensive month and it might even be fair to compare it to how Holiday played offensively at the start of last year. Well, Holiday was better, but it's not an outrageous comparison. However, half of Holiday's value was in defense, plus he was only 22 years old, which makes GMs go crazy.

                2014 (top 5) + Po (15th pick) is better than 2014 (top 5) + Noel (6th pick).
                It doesn't matter anymore that Giannis was the 15th pick. That was then and this is now. Paul George was the 10th pick in 2010 and Ekpe Udoh was the 6th pick in that same draft; irrelevant.

                Right now Giannis looks like an awesome prospect, and on top of it we have to consider the recent medical data (i.e. his medical age is closer to 16 and he'll probably reach 7 ft). Giannis would go top 5 if they allowed to re-do the draft.

                Being picked 15th only adds value now, since his salary is so low for his talent.
                Last edited by BobLoblaw; Tue Dec 10, 2013, 07:17 PM.

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