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Thread: Another way to get wiggins (P Jones)

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic All-Star JawsGT's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    The best thing that can happen is Wiggins pulling a Steve Francis and pouting like a little bitch about being drafted by anyone other than the Raptors.....forcing his team to trade him
    That would make me smile...forever.

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  3. #22
    Raptors Republic Starter KeonClark's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    To the average person, yeah. To a professional athlete, there's nothing stopping Wiggins from spending his off-seasons in Toronto, thus giving him the best of both worlds.

    All I'm saying that if our plan is to dangle "O' Canada" in front of Wiggins in 5 years, it's a pretty weak plan.
    Exactly. Sure, Wiggins would prefer Toronto RIGHT NOW, but after 8 years in the NBA he's going to be a completely different person and the whimsical 17 year old from T.O will be long gone.
    Dwane Casey says: Pound the Gay!!

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    The best thing that can happen is Wiggins pulling a Steve Francis and pouting like a little bitch about being drafted by anyone other than the Raptors.....forcing his team to trade him
    Im hoping for this. I dont want to play in milwaukee my family is too far away I dont know anyone there I want to go to Toronto trade me now. that Steve Francis story was so great lol.

    JV for the rights to Wiggins on draft night book it.

  5. #24
    Raptors Republic All-Star JawsGT's Avatar
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    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    The least amount of time it could be is 5 years: 4 years rookie deal plus one year qualifying offer to become unrestricted.

    That is for any player coming off a rookie deal.

    Why you don't see players typically do this is because they rarely give up the guaranteed money.

    Someone else mentioned it earlier but only guy I can remember is Ben Gordon.
    So, qualifying offer is a player option? If they pick it up they can become UFA the following offseason? If they don't pick it up they go to RFA?

  6. #25
    Raptors Republic Superstar Rapstor4Life's Avatar
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    So for anyone who doesn't know.... wiggins would be pulling the ultimate patriotic move by doing a Steve Francis on draft night.

  7. #26
    Raptors Republic Superstar isaacthompson's Avatar
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    Quote Jclaw wrote: View Post
    I'm stealing this one from the morning coffee on the main page. Feel free to merge it if needed. I can't link the article but it's in the basketball section on sportsnet.ca. Ok, that's enough excuses. The general concept is that rather than tank for wiggins now, why not try to slowly build while wiggins goes through his learning curve elsewhere and then sign him as a free agent. It's not a new concept but I think it has some growing validity with the way the tank standings are going. As of now, who is most likely to get him? Utah? Milwaukee? Philadelphia? Orlando? Sacramento? These aren't free agent destinations. They're where free agents leave. Might that happen? Do all prized rookies sign extensions? Is four years too soon an expectation? Interesting idea.
    Draft Exum/Smart in this draft and then sign Wiggins in 4 years. Oh god.
    Writer for RaptorsWatch.com

    Twitter - @thekid_it

  8. #27
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    Quote JawsGT wrote: View Post
    So, qualifying offer is a player option? If they pick it up they can become UFA the following offseason? If they don't pick it up they go to RFA?
    When a player comes off their rookie contract, the team extends a qualifying offer (a one year contract for a set amount, 30% above their previous year's salary, usually far below what the player is worth). While that offer is on the table, if the player signs an offer sheet with another team, the original team is able to match and retain the player (this is restricted free agency). The player can choose instead to sign the qualifying offer, meaning he plays one more season for his original team then is an unrestricted free agent. This pretty much never happens, but that's the hope of the dreamers who want Wiggins to bolt and sign here after 5 years.

    Here's the thing everyone ignores when discussing this situation. Assuming Wiggins is a max contract level player, that's not true. A team has two options when extending a qualifying offer - they can extend the usual one-year qualifying offer at a low contract value as described above. Or they can extend a maximum qualifying offer. This is exactly the same as the qualifying offer above (it allows the team to match any offer to the free agent), except for 3 things.

    1) Any offer made to the player must now be 3 years in length. With a regular QO, offers must be at least 2 years in length.
    2) The value of the qualifying offer is the player's maximum salary (after a rookie deal this is about 14 million per year) instead of the reduced amount in a regular QO (for the first overall pick about 8.2 million).

    And most importantly:

    3) The maximum qualifying offer is a contract 5 years in length. Signing the QO in this case would lock the player into a 5 year maximum contract with his original team. The player would be free to leave earlier if he signed a 4 year offer from another team.

    So when I and others say that (assuming Wiggins is worth all the fuss, and therefore worth a max contract) the first chance to get him in free agency will be after 8 or 9 years, that's where the certainty comes from. It's not an assumption that he won't bolt when he gets the chance - it is the reality that he won't get the chance until then.
    Last edited by DanH; Fri Dec 20th, 2013 at 09:15 AM. Reason: Update for error - 2 and 3 years in new CBA, not 3 and 4

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  10. #28
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    So do I but it's gonna be hard. The ideal scenario would be making the playoffs and still netting wiggins. Maybe try getting one of Phoenix's picks and then packaging it with ours plus like t Ross for wiggins
    Especially if wiggins not keen to go to a particular team.

  11. #29
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    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    When a player comes off their rookie contract, the team extends a qualifying offer (a one year contract for a set amount, 30% above their previous year's salary, usually far below what the player is worth). While that offer is on the table, if the player signs an offer sheet with another team, the original team is able to match and retain the player (this is restricted free agency). The player can choose instead to sign the qualifying offer, meaning he plays one more season for his original team then is an unrestricted free agent. This pretty much never happens, but that's the hope of the dreamers who want Wiggins to bolt and sign here after 5 years.

    Here's the thing everyone ignores when discussing this situation. Assuming Wiggins is a max contract level player, that's not true. A team has two options when extending a qualifying offer - they can extend the usual one-year qualifying offer at a low contract value as described above. Or they can extend a maximum qualifying offer. This is exactly the same as the qualifying offer above (it allows the team to match any offer to the free agent), except for 3 things.

    1) Any offer made to the player must now be 4 years in length. With a regular QO, offers must be at least 3 years in length.
    2) The value of the qualifying offer is the player's maximum salary (after a rookie deal this is about 14 million per year) instead of the reduced amount in a regular QO (for the first overall pick about 8.2 million).

    And most importantly:

    3) The maximum qualifying offer is a contract 5 years in length. Signing the QO in this case would lock the player into a 5 year maximum contract with his original team. The player would be free to leave earlier if he signed a 4 year offer from another team.

    So when I and others say that (assuming Wiggins is worth all the fuss, and therefore worth a max contract) the first chance to get him in free agency will be after 8 or 9 years, that's where the certainty comes from. It's not an assumption that he won't bolt when he gets the chance - it is the reality that he won't get the chance until then.
    But if a player doesn't want to play in a certain city it becomes more likely they do not draft him or trade him. If MU could provide significant assets to said team it might work.

  12. #30
    Raptors Republic Starter Pill's Avatar
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    Maybe we can send him a Wayne Gretzky video in 5 years so he can go to LA.

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  14. #31
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    This has been my position ever since Wiggins announced that the Raptors were the NBA team he wanted to play for. Given he close Wiggins played his cards to his chest prior to his decision to go to Kansas, it is quite significant (and nonetheless unsurprising) that he wants to head to TO. The other option the Raptors have is to look at a trade at some point during Wiggins' rookie contract when his team realizes they aren't going to be able to sign him to a second deal. Wiggins' team will not have a lot of leverage if there is only one team he'll take a sign and trade to

  15. #32
    Administrator Arsenalist's Avatar
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    I had mentioned this a while back in a piece here. I do like the strategy and it even has a good probability of working out given that Wiggins is attached to Toronto and has said he wants to come. To play devil's advocate though, here are some of the negatives:

    • It would take 5-6 years before it happens, assuming his RFA offer is matched or he's extended.
    • In that time frame he may become attached to the city he's in and not want to change.
    • His Bird rights would belong to his current team and they could offer him the most money.

  16. #33
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    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    When a player comes off their rookie contract, the team extends a qualifying offer (a one year contract for a set amount, 30% above their previous year's salary, usually far below what the player is worth). While that offer is on the table, if the player signs an offer sheet with another team, the original team is able to match and retain the player (this is restricted free agency). The player can choose instead to sign the qualifying offer, meaning he plays one more season for his original team then is an unrestricted free agent. This pretty much never happens, but that's the hope of the dreamers who want Wiggins to bolt and sign here after 5 years.

    Here's the thing everyone ignores when discussing this situation. Assuming Wiggins is a max contract level player, that's not true. A team has two options when extending a qualifying offer - they can extend the usual one-year qualifying offer at a low contract value as described above. Or they can extend a maximum qualifying offer. This is exactly the same as the qualifying offer above (it allows the team to match any offer to the free agent), except for 3 things.

    1) Any offer made to the player must now be 4 years in length. With a regular QO, offers must be at least 3 years in length.
    2) The value of the qualifying offer is the player's maximum salary (after a rookie deal this is about 14 million per year) instead of the reduced amount in a regular QO (for the first overall pick about 8.2 million).

    And most importantly:

    3) The maximum qualifying offer is a contract 5 years in length. Signing the QO in this case would lock the player into a 5 year maximum contract with his original team. The player would be free to leave earlier if he signed a 4 year offer from another team.

    So when I and others say that (assuming Wiggins is worth all the fuss, and therefore worth a max contract) the first chance to get him in free agency will be after 8 or 9 years, that's where the certainty comes from. It's not an assumption that he won't bolt when he gets the chance - it is the reality that he won't get the chance until then.
    Technically yes. BUT, after signing 5 year extension, player can pull "VC" ie bitch about not being happy, refusing to dunk, etc -basically forcing a team to trade "unhappy player".

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    Quote Mapko wrote: View Post
    Technically yes. BUT, after signing 5 year extension, player can pull "VC" ie bitch about not being happy, refusing to dunk, etc -basically forcing a team to trade "unhappy player".
    Sure, but from what I've seen, Wiggins is not that type of person.

  18. #35
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    And would we even want that type of person (regardless of his birth certificate)?
    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

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  20. #36
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    Default Raptors should go for the playoffs, and go for Wiggins...

    It seems to me there's no point in tanking. The Raptors are clearly the best team in their division, and even without the division title and 4th seed, there's no way we'll be worse than Phili, Orlando, Utah, etc. Like it or not, as long as we have a starting line up with JV, Amir, DD, and Lowry, we are too good to tank. That being said, I see no sense in trading proven talent to be bad and wind up with an unproven 5th pick

    This is what I propose:

    Try and keep Lowry
    - He's proven to be a solid pg, better than anyone else who's gonna be available. It's hard to bring players to Toronto, but no one has ever left without praising the city. For the right amount of money, I think he'd stay. We've got cap space that has to be used on someone, why not him?

    Try to get over 500, and win the Atlantic
    -Yeah, the Atlantic is bad, but the Raptors don't have to be. I think if they keep playing this kind of ball, they can finish with a respectable record and create a winning culture. With this team and the way things are going, I have hopes for a playoff run- not a first round exit.

    In 3-4 years, make a play for Wiggins
    -For the first time ever, there's a player who WANTS to play for the Raptors! It makes no sense to build a shit team in order to get him, when instead the Raptors could be built into an above average East team, let some other team ease Wiggins into the NBA, then snatch him up with max money (assuming he'll deserve it) and the chance to come home.

    I think in the next 4 years, if the Raptors can become a good team and get the city more behind them than they already are, and Wiggins is a bonafide Canadian star, the Raptors would be given the green light on throwing max money at him, regardless of their cap situation.

  21. #37
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Matt52's Avatar
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    Hi. Welcome to the forums.

    This topic has been brought up numerous times before.

    Problem is whatever team drafts him will have him on a rookie contract for 4 years.

    The Raptors could offer him a contract but his drafting team will have right to match. If he is what he is suppose to be, that contract is either going to be matched or he will have already signed an extension before he ever hits free agency. This is likely to take him to his 8th or 9th NBA season.

    The other possibility, and one that I can only remember happening with Ben Gordon, is he signs his qualifying offer and becomes an UFA after 5th year.

    So either way you are looking at an unlikely possibility of landing him after year 5 or as an unrestricted free agent in 8-9 years.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
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    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  22. #38
    Raptors Republic Superstar Mack North's Avatar
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    My goodness, there's going to be a lot of sadness in Raptorland when the team (more than likely) doesn't acquire Wiggins. I see no point in putting so much hope in getting one player. What if he doesn't even pan out?

  23. #39
    Raptors Republic All-Star RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Wiggins, Wiggins, Wiggins (puke)








    Wiggins, Wiggins, Wiggins
    ,Wiggins, Wiggins, Wiggins,Wiggins, Wiggins, Wiggins.................
    #FREE

  24. #40
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    We will not get him. With this rate, we will get a pick above 10 in this draft. Who needs Wiggins and Parker when we have Amir and Lowry !!!

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