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At this point, what would trading Derozan do to the Locker room?

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  • #31
    If we get a real superstar in here you can't have just role players around him, even Lebron couldn't win with that. You at least need one consistent secondary scorer, that is derozan.

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    • #32
      Nosike wrote: View Post
      If we get a real superstar in here you can't have just role players around him, even Lebron couldn't win with that. You at least need one consistent secondary scorer, that is derozan.
      exactly derozan would be a great 2nd option on a contender, we just now how to find that real 1st option
      "Both teams played hard my man" - Sheed

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      • #33
        I feel bad for Demar. Despite the teams success many still want to get rid of him. I'd rather not take the chance on moving him for a player that may be a little more efficient but probably wouldn't want to be here any more than Rudy did. I think moving Demar would be bad for the locker room.

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        • #34
          Matt52 wrote: View Post
          Not sure how you can say this, to be honest.

          DeRozan takes the 8th most FGA per game in the league (17.8).

          That is more than LeBron, George, Harden, Griffin, Lillard, Dirk, Randolph, Lee, Parker.

          He is tied for 15th in PPG.

          He scores 1.18 points per shot which is tied for 83rd.

          If you could add an elite player who can get in the top 15 in PPS (currently 1.38 and higher), this team is really going to make noise.... like really.

          You add .2 point to DeRozan's 18 shots and that is 3.6 extra points per game..... which might seem small but it is huge.


          I think you only disrupt the locker room if you add an elite player who takes a lot of shots and keep DeRozan who continues to take a lot of shots.

          I agree Ross is a better fit with another elite player. He doesn't need the ball to have an impact and is a danger in catch and shoot situations.
          whats with all these fancy magical "stats"??? true fans of the team don't believe in such things!! try watching an actual game, poindexter!*

          *sarcasm intended

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          • #35
            Letter N wrote: View Post
            If we could switch DD for an equivalent level small-forward it would be great because then Ross could slide into his natural position. Almost like a Carmelo, but only the Carmelo that showed up for a 10 game run last year where he shot efficiently and didn't require the ball at all times...................so Lebron. Basically we just need to trade Derozan for Lebron and our problems are solved.
            Or on draft night, assuming there are some SF's in the top-15 that TL & MU may have some interest in...


            In all honesty, if MU decides to play the hand that's been given and shoot for the #3 seed this season, I could see him keeping Lowry & DeRozan into the offseason. DeRozan, Lowry (S&T), Salmons ($1M guaranteed next season), Hansborough ($1M guaranteed next season), Vazquez (S&T) and Patterson (S&T) are all assets that could be used at/after the draft, should MU still want to pursue any sort of rebuild/retool that the 'pro-tankers' have been pushing for.

            It goes to show that the 'pro-tanker' strategy can still be implemented without "tanking" at all this season (win-win). See, there is common ground between the two camps!

            A core of Valanciunas (C), Johnson (PF) and Ross (SG) is young, talented, high-upside and currently quite cheap to build around.
            Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Thu Jan 2, 2014, 01:53 PM.

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            • #36
              It will take ross and Lowry to land us Wiggins....

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              • #37
                Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
                It will take ross and Lowry to land us Wiggins....
                I don't see any team trading out of the top 3, maybe even top 5 for anything (short of obviously Lebron, Durant, etc.).

                I really do not see Wiggins/Parker being acquired on a draft day trade.

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                • #38
                  Nosike wrote: View Post
                  If we get a real superstar in here you can't have just role players around him, even Lebron couldn't win with that. You at least need one consistent secondary scorer, that is derozan.
                  If MU were to move DeRozan and Lowry, keeping a young core of Valanciunas (C), Johnson (PF) and Ross (SG) to build around, I don't think secondary scoring would be a concern (assuming the replacement starting SF and/or PG becomes the #1 scoring option).

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                  • #39
                    CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
                    Or on draft night, assuming there are some SF's in the top-15 that TL & MU may have some interest in...


                    In all honesty, if MU decides to play the hand that's been given and shoot for the #3 seed this season, I could see him keeping Lowry & DeRozan into the offseason. DeRozan, Lowry (S&T), Salmons ($1M guaranteed next season), Hansborough ($1M guaranteed next season), Vazquez (S&T) and Patterson (S&T) are all assets that could be used at/after the draft, should MU still want to pursue any sort of rebuild/retool that the 'pro-tankers' have been pushing for.

                    It goes to show that the 'pro-tanker' strategy can still be implemented without "tanking" at all this season (win-win).


                    A core of Valanciunas (C), Johnson (PF) and Ross (SG) is young, talented, high-upside and currently quite cheap to build around.
                    I said something like this in another thread.

                    Basically pro-tankers seem to be way too caught up in the strength of this draft and forget this team was in a terrible position to tank going into last summer. MU could decide to try and keep fielding a competitive team given how they're playing, but also, as you point out, it would be really A LOT easier to aim for the lottery next year if that does turn out to be his plan.

                    It's just standard fan mentality. A lack of patience. You're also seeing that for "anti-tankers", as this hot streak has made a lot more "lets go all in for a ring!" type ridiculous posts pop up, with absurd trade ideas.

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                    • #40
                      Mediumcore wrote: View Post
                      Is that including the games when Rudy was a part of the team and forcing DeMar to not pass the ball or after the Rudy trade...or a combination of both. If it's post Rudy trade then I retract that portion of my statement, but post Rudy trade it seems like DeMar has taken fewer shots and played more within himself.

                      If not and the bolded stat is a combination of when Rudy was here and forcing DeMar to not pass the ball then I stand by my words.

                      I guess you could bring in a non-elite player, but one whom is more efficeint a scorer and equal to or better defender than DeMar and the team would improve. But I think you have to also think about the advantage of Demar's post game against smaller SG's. It's a nice advantage to have over say an Affalo or Henderson whom possibly are more efficent scorers, but don't drive or post as much. I dunno, there are a lot of variables when accounting for the advantages/disadvantages that DD gives you. He has also been rebounding really well as of late and the assists are up. Damn it, why can't that kid just have better handles, and be a better 3 point shooter or create for others..you know be elite. Would solve a lot of the problems.
                      The stats I provided are for the whole season.

                      But since the gay trade he is taking 0.1 more shots per game and scoring 0.6 less points per game.

                      So while a really small difference it is still worse.

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                      • #41
                        I think the problem with demar is being the no. 1 option. If he is a no. 2 or even better 3 then this team would be rolling.

                        Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

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                        • #42
                          rapfan10 wrote: View Post
                          I think the problem with demar is being the no. 1 option. If he is a no. 2 or even better 3 then this team would be rolling.

                          Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
                          DD is not scoring 20 a game without 18 shots.

                          We already experienced what that does with Rudy.

                          You can only have one ball dominant wing unless you are talking about Jordan and Pippen or LeBron and Wade. But even those guys fit in to a system and played within it.

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                          • #43
                            Matt52 wrote: View Post
                            DD is not scoring 20 a game without 18 shots.

                            We already experienced what that does with Rudy.

                            You can only have one ball dominant wing unless you are talking about Jordan and Pippen or LeBron and Wade. But even those guys fit in to a system and played within it.
                            Yeah, Afflalo would probably be more suited to that role than DeMar.

                            Some of the back-and-forth is moot, though - I think you move DeMar if there's a transaction available that makes the team better. It's that simple. His contract's not so onerous that he has to be moved, and he is still developing.

                            If you moved forward with this core and started drafting mid to late first round from here on out, at some point you'd like to package a couple players/prospects for a higher calibre guy (ex. Houston acquiring Harden) - unless Ujiri magically acquires a franchise guy through FA (something the Raptors have never done before). DeMar's a reasonable enough asset to be a key part of a trade package for a bigger piece.
                            "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                            • #44
                              Good lord! This team playing like they are, with DeMar a VERY integral part of it, and trading DeMar is still the topic of discussion? I just don't have words to describe what I think of this,,,,,,, and not get banned.

                              First, there's stuff going on in these games that a lot of amateur stat "analysts" and video game players are obviously not seeing, or refuse to. DeMar is a huge part of this success we're seeing. No, I can't be bothered to jump on yet another merry-go-round discussion to support this opinion. At this point you either get it or you don't. If you don't, sucks to be you.

                              Locker room? Locker room, or anywhere else, Amir AND DeMar are the heart and soul of this team, with Kyle making a very good case to be part of that. Does anyone seriously think that the leaps we're beginning to see from JV and Ross are not being seriously influenced by the dedication and hard work of Amir AND DeMar? It seems so, because the focus is on individual stats, that barely paint 1/2 the picture. Shit, it's like an obsession, turning desperate.

                              Thank god Masai is not a RR GM. Anything short of Wiggins, MU is not trading DeMar any time soon. Get used to it.

                              As for thoughts of "upgrading" to shoot for the moon this year. Yet more of this black/white, only 2 paths mentality is blasting it's way back into discussion. If MU doesn't go into tank mode, it doesn't mean he has his sights set on trying to be a contender THIS YEAR. Christ, all he's done so far is make great moves, yet some people expect that if he doesn't tank, he's going to turn into BC and chase quick fixes? Huh?

                              Here's how I see this playing out:

                              Unless Lowry and his agent are giving indications he wants out, which I highly doubt, Lowry is staying here this year, short of some incredible offer happening. I see a lot of people working the "contract year" chant, but I'm seeing passion and team commitment that goes way beyond contract year hustle. This guy looks very much like he wants to be part of this build, and this team. Those charges he's taking aren't about contract year, and that's only the beginning. Open your eyes, lads!

                              If this recent upsurge isn't an aberration, and I don't think it is, MU will let this team role, they'll get valuable playoff experience, likely playing in the 2nd round for the 2nd time in team history. He might make minor tweaks, with no long term contract commitments, around the trade deadline, but basically go into the playoffs with this team. MU will try and make moves on draft day, and through the summer, but it's very possible this starting 5 is the starting 5 going into next season as well. Get used to it.

                              Geeeeez, the foolishness that goes on here, even from some articulate (doesn't always mean intelligent, but usually), seeming knowledgeable (beginning to wonder though) people. God damn, if you're a fan of the Raptors, I can't fathom how you can't put down the damn knives, embrace this team and simply enjoy some great basketball, because that's what this team is providing, win or lose.

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                              • #45
                                I would consider a Thaddeous Young / DeMar swap. Young is only one year older, and puts up numbers comparable to DD. He publicly stated that he didn't want to rebuild and wanted out of Philly. So may not have to give up much to get him.

                                Don't know what that does to the team's morale though. Would him leaving upset the balance of what has made them successful the last 10 games? Not sure, but from a fan I would think Young would do as good a job as DeMar and gets paid the same amount but with one less year on his contract (although he can opt out in that final year).

                                DD gets to the line better and is producing more assists this year.. but Young is a better rebounder / 3pt shooter and is more efficient over all. And I personally value those kinds of traits for the type of team the Raptors have right now.

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