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Thread: What If We Don't Retain Lowry This Summer?

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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Default What If We Don't Retain Lowry This Summer?

    I guess losing to the Celtics last night has taken a little of the wind from behind our sails this morning seeing how things are unusually quiet. Anyhow, this isn't a discussion about Lowry (we already have a handful of threads about him at the moment), but more about what our back-up plan will be if we aren't able to bring him back next season. Just curious to know what members opinions are about moving forward sans Kyle Lowry.

    Thoughts?

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Fully's Avatar
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    The first options that jump to mind would be:

    A) Target a point guard in the draft, hope that they can step in and be serviceable right off the bat and supplement the position with either a re-signed Vasquez, one of Buycks/Stone, or a stop-gap type of guy you get this summer like a Hinrich or Livingston.

    B) Grab one of the aforementioned stop-gap free agents (Hinrich, Livingston,Harris) and patch together enough minutes at the position with Vasquez/Buycks/Stone to hopefully keep the team's head above water.

    C) Explore a trade for a point guard.

    The first scenario would be my preferred option but has the highest amount of variance; will there be a non-point guard left on the board that Ujiri will feel he 'has' to pick? what point guards will be left when it's our time to draft? what type of quality minutes can you give a non-lottery PG in their first year?

    It's a pretty sobering proposition when you think about it. As great as the recent run has been, the wheels could come off again pretty quickly this summer based on only one or two things. I think that's why some people still question whether this success is sustainable.

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    Quote Fully wrote: View Post
    The first options that jump to mind would be:

    A) Target a point guard in the draft, hope that they can step in and be serviceable right off the bat and supplement the position with either a re-signed Vasquez, one of Buycks/Stone, or a stop-gap type of guy you get this summer like a Hinrich or Livingston.

    B) Grab one of the aforementioned stop-gap free agents (Hinrich, Livingston,Harris) and patch together enough minutes at the position with Vasquez/Buycks/Stone to hopefully keep the team's head above water.

    C) Explore a trade for a point guard.

    The first scenario would be my preferred option but has the highest amount of variance; will there be a non-point guard left on the board that Ujiri will feel he 'has' to pick? what point guards will be left when it's our time to draft? what type of quality minutes can you give a non-lottery PG in their first year?

    It's a pretty sobering proposition when you think about it. As great as the recent run has been, the wheels could come off again pretty quickly this summer based on only one or two things. I think that's why some people still question whether this success is sustainable.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star Axel's Avatar
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    Since I'm not even sold on bringing him back long term, drafting a talented PG this year is #1 priority.
    F*ck Brooklyn

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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Quote Fully wrote: View Post
    A) Target a point guard in the draft, hope that they can step in and be serviceable right off the bat and supplement the position with either a re-signed Vasquez, one of Buycks/Stone, or a stop-gap type of guy you get this summer like a Hinrich or Livingston.
    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    Since I'm not even sold on bringing him back long term, drafting a talented PG this year is #1 priority.
    Assuming we're out of the lottery and have a mid to late 1st round selection, who do people like as that possible PG that we draft? Outside of the obvious upcoming talents in this summer's draft, I really haven't paid attention to college this year.

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    Quote Dr. James Naismith wrote: View Post
    Assuming we're out of the lottery and have a mid to late 1st round selection, who do people like as that possible PG that we draft? Outside of the obvious upcoming talents in this summer's draft, I really haven't paid attention to college this year.
    I'd start by reading the 2014 draft thread

    Zach Lavine is currently projected to go anywhere from 10th to 20th (17th on SI's big board today) and projects similar to Russell Westbrook (super athletic attacking PG).

    Shabazz Napier from UConn could be there at 20 and a good option.
    F*ck Brooklyn

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    There's quite a few good PG prospects supposed to come out in the draft.

    If they actually do is another story.

    I'd package both our second rounders and first to move up and grab Ennis. Hometown kid yadda yadda yadda but the fact is dude can ball. He's one of the most intriguing point guard prospects i've seen in a while.
    @jerboat

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    Blow it up. Lowry's the engine that drives this thing. Even if the team is as good as it seems of late (with the obvious exception of last night), without Lowry it all falls apart. So if he moves on, trade DD, trade Amir, trade Salmons for a bad contract and a pick, same for Hansbrough, draft BPA with our middling pick and **** hard for next year. A late start, but necessary at that point. With a couple good picks in 2015, hopefully the team looks promising enough (our high pick plus a couple middling-to-late first rounders or prospects from the trades, hopefully solid player from this year's pick, Ross and JV) to lure a max money guy or two to make that jump to the playoffs in time for the 2016 all star game. Or if that's not a concern (I'd bet it is), use 2015 cap space to take a couple shots at RFA's, take another year near the bottom, and blow the real cap room in 2016 on Durant to play with our top picks, prospects, RFA signing, and a mature JV and Ross.

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    Good article on Tyler Ennis here: http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/po...n-is-unmatched
    He looks like someone we could get based on draft position and non-lottery picks are cheap, which will be a huge bonus when JV and Ross finish their rookie contracts. And I love the idea of Canadians on the team from a marketing perspective.

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    There are a lot of options as have been outlined by posters before me, so I would just speculate about what will happen instead.

    As has been reported, the Raptors have taken Lowry off the trade block, so going forward the only option is to sign him over the summer. As this thread is about what happens if he does not sign with us you would have to assume that not trading him means MU only has an intent to compete and not blow it up or to not look for a PG in the draft, as a rookie PG rarely steps in and is NBA ready. That leaves free agent signings and trades as the only possibilities, but since there aren't any upgrades at PG in free agency it really only leaves trades.

    There are 3 injured PG's, out there that would improve our team when healthy and are 2 are on teams that have blown it up or may do so. Rondo, Rose, and Westbrook. Rondo seems like the one that would be most attainable, as Celtics really aren't bashful about ****ing and Rondo hurts that. He's also known to create issues when he's not happy, so how long will he be happy with losing. Rose is coming off two season ending injuries, so Chicago which seems like a really cheap organization for being in a big market may decide to blow it up. They've already sent Deng on his way and anyone they draft will not have the same impact as Deng for a few years (if they do at all). Other than Rose being the home town kid, it makes sense for Chicago to trade him and blow it up. Lastly, Westbrook too has suffered a second injury, and OKC's window to win a championship is closing because of it, though not completely closed like Chicago's. How long does OKC, a small market team wait for Westbrook to get healthy, or do they do the prudent thing and sell off Westbrook and his near max contract for players that could help them make a title run?

    Those are my picks. I think Raptors are nearly in the mode to go big or go home.

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    I'm big on Ennis as well, but we should look to draft him regardless of whether or not we re-sign Lowry, because we'll have to draft him before Lowry becomes available to re-sign anyway. Besides, Greivis isn't so impressive as a backup PG that we shouldn't look to the future.

    If we can't re-sign Lowry, free agency is not the way to go because there simply aren't any decent starter-level free agent PGs next year other than Kyle; that's his biggest advantage in 2014 free agency, really, he's the best PG there is and he has no serious competition on that front. We'd have to explore trades. Viable trade targets for a starter-quality PG could include Jeremy Lin (Houston will want to shed his poison pill contract since they don't want to pay him $15m even for only an $8m cap hit) and Rajon Rondo (Boston will consider trading him, but it'll be pricey).

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    Quote magoon wrote: View Post
    I'm big on Ennis as well, but we should look to draft him regardless of whether or not we re-sign Lowry, because we'll have to draft him before Lowry becomes available to re-sign anyway. Besides, Greivis isn't so impressive as a backup PG that we shouldn't look to the future.
    yep. PG is definitely a need, regardless.
    @jerboat

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    Quote Fully wrote: View Post
    The first options that jump to mind would be:

    A) Target a point guard in the draft, hope that they can step in and be serviceable right off the bat and supplement the position with either a re-signed Vasquez, one of Buycks/Stone, or a stop-gap type of guy you get this summer like a Hinrich or Livingston.

    B) Grab one of the aforementioned stop-gap free agents (Hinrich, Livingston,Harris) and patch together enough minutes at the position with Vasquez/Buycks/Stone to hopefully keep the team's head above water.

    C) Explore a trade for a point guard.

    The first scenario would be my preferred option but has the highest amount of variance; will there be a non-point guard left on the board that Ujiri will feel he 'has' to pick? what point guards will be left when it's our time to draft? what type of quality minutes can you give a non-lottery PG in their first year?

    It's a pretty sobering proposition when you think about it. As great as the recent run has been, the wheels could come off again pretty quickly this summer based on only one or two things. I think that's why some people still question whether this success is sustainable.
    i HIGHLY doubt we're gonna find a serviceable point guard that high in the draft that will act as a starter that could even remotely replicate lowrys play as of late. altogether with the horrible backup pg situation we're still in, i'm not seeing the light on this one. i mean, who do we have to mentor him? vasquez? stone?? fuck no.

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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    There are a lot of options as have been outlined by posters before me, so I would just speculate about what will happen instead.

    As has been reported, the Raptors have taken Lowry off the trade block, so going forward the only option is to sign him over the summer. As this thread is about what happens if he does not sign with us you would have to assume that not trading him means MU only has an intent to compete and not blow it up or to not look for a PG in the draft, as a rookie PG rarely steps in and is NBA ready. That leaves free agent signings and trades as the only possibilities, but since there aren't any upgrades at PG in free agency it really only leaves trades.

    There are 3 injured PG's, out there that would improve our team when healthy and are 2 are on teams that have blown it up or may do so. Rondo, Rose, and Westbrook. Rondo seems like the one that would be most attainable, as Celtics really aren't bashful about ****ing and Rondo hurts that. He's also known to create issues when he's not happy, so how long will he be happy with losing. Rose is coming off two season ending injuries, so Chicago which seems like a really cheap organization for being in a big market may decide to blow it up. They've already sent Deng on his way and anyone they draft will not have the same impact as Deng for a few years (if they do at all). Other than Rose being the home town kid, it makes sense for Chicago to trade him and blow it up. Lastly, Westbrook too has suffered a second injury, and OKC's window to win a championship is closing because of it, though not completely closed like Chicago's. How long does OKC, a small market team wait for Westbrook to get healthy, or do they do the prudent thing and sell off Westbrook and his near max contract for players that could help them make a title run?

    Those are my picks. I think Raptors are nearly in the mode to go big or go home.
    Bold 1: history tells otherwise: Stoudamire, Iverson, Rose, Lillard... only to name a few. Yeah, these ones exploded right from the start, but in general - a good PG is good right from the get-go.

    Bold 2: I'd say Bledsoe is an upgrade. It's unlikely the Suns don't match, but it's a totally different discussion

    Bold 3: Ainge wants picks and he'd want several 1st rounders for a healthy Rondo. Not happening with MU values of picks, and rightfully so!

    Bold 4: bunch of BS. Chicago is not trading Rose.

    Another bunch of BS. OKC is not trading Westbrook or Durant. Thinking otherwise is silly at this point. More than likely Westbrook will come back as explosive as he was.

    As for the general topic, my two cents: if Lowry walks... this means MU did not do a good job. Period. If MU has the slightest fear of Lowry walking for nothing... he should trade him right now, even if the price is slightly below his raised value as of late. Otherwise, it is a waste of 1st rounder we paid to get him (even if it wasn't MU himself). So, he either re-signs him (hopefully to something short and reasonable), or he trades Lowry within the next month.

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    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    I'd start by reading the 2014 draft thread

    Zach Lavine is currently projected to go anywhere from 10th to 20th (17th on SI's big board today) and projects similar to Russell Westbrook (super athletic attacking PG).

    Shabazz Napier from UConn could be there at 20 and a good option.

    There is no chance that LaVine falls to 15-20 and you wouldn't want him running your point last year as he doesn't even start for UCLA. Like his game, but he would be learning to run the point on the fly in the NBA. That's tough.

    If Raps were to draft Napier with their first round pick, that would be a waste of a first rounder. Napier can run the point but he projects more as a servicable backup pg in the league.

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    Big on Ennis as well.

    He might not come out this year however.

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    Quote Mediumcore wrote: View Post
    There are a lot of options as have been outlined by posters before me, so I would just speculate about what will happen instead.

    As has been reported, the Raptors have taken Lowry off the trade block, so going forward the only option is to sign him over the summer. As this thread is about what happens if he does not sign with us you would have to assume that not trading him means MU only has an intent to compete and not blow it up or to not look for a PG in the draft, as a rookie PG rarely steps in and is NBA ready. That leaves free agent signings and trades as the only possibilities, but since there aren't any upgrades at PG in free agency it really only leaves trades.

    There are 3 injured PG's, out there that would improve our team when healthy and are 2 are on teams that have blown it up or may do so. Rondo, Rose, and Westbrook. Rondo seems like the one that would be most attainable, as Celtics really aren't bashful about ****ing and Rondo hurts that. He's also known to create issues when he's not happy, so how long will he be happy with losing. Rose is coming off two season ending injuries, so Chicago which seems like a really cheap organization for being in a big market may decide to blow it up. They've already sent Deng on his way and anyone they draft will not have the same impact as Deng for a few years (if they do at all). Other than Rose being the home town kid, it makes sense for Chicago to trade him and blow it up. Lastly, Westbrook too has suffered a second injury, and OKC's window to win a championship is closing because of it, though not completely closed like Chicago's. How long does OKC, a small market team wait for Westbrook to get healthy, or do they do the prudent thing and sell off Westbrook and his near max contract for players that could help them make a title run?

    Those are my picks. I think Raptors are nearly in the mode to go big or go home.
    I don't see Rose or Westbrook being realistic options. I don't think either team would be willing to trade their all-star guards, despite their injuries or the immediate intentions of the franchises. Realistically, the Bulls could **** this season while Rose is still on the shelf, and have a high draft pick to pair with him next season. Unfortunately for them, Thibs and Noah are having none of it and they have rallied after the Deng trade. But it would be hard to believe that they continue to play at this level without a decent consistent scorer, given that they had to do the same thing last year with an arguably better lineup. I'm not sure if Boozer has any value, but if they moved him this season instead of amnestying him in the offseason, then that may help the **** now. Or they could try and move Noah, but he is a nice piece to keep for a partially rebuilding Bulls team that has a nice opportunity to mimic the Robinson/Duncan rebuild of the Spurs.

    As for Westbrook, I don't see him being traded at all. OKC is in a pretty good position going forward and could have a really good team for years to come if Westbrook gets and stays healthy and , of course, Durant is retained. I just don't see them giving up on him now for the chance of replacing him to contend this season. They are still a pretty dangerous team without him. And isn't he supposed to be back before the playoffs?

    Rondo is, of course, an intriguing possibility. I think we have pieces that could land us Rondo. But I am unsure how he would fit with this team. We don't have the experienced and savvy vets in KG, PP, and RA that he is used to playing with and deferring to. Would this be like the Rudy Gay situation? Plus, if we were to nab him, then we would need a serious upgrade offensively, as Rondo is unlikely to produce the same scoring punch that Lowry is currently providing. I like Rondo as a player, but I have serious reservations about acquiring him.

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    Quote iblastoff wrote: View Post
    i HIGHLY doubt we're gonna find a serviceable point guard that high in the draft that will act as a starter that could even remotely replicate lowrys play as of late. altogether with the horrible backup pg situation we're still in, i'm not seeing the light on this one. i mean, who do we have to mentor him? vasquez? stone?? fuck no.
    I agree with this for the most part, hence my final paragraph. Lost in all the recent rah-rah'ing and pseudo contender talk, is that we're staring a pretty big step backwards in the face if Lowry a) doesn't end up back here next season or even b) he DOES end up back here and reverts back to something closer to his first seven seasons.

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    Quote vino wrote: View Post
    Bold 1: history tells otherwise: Stoudamire, Iverson, Rose, Lillard... only to name a few. Yeah, these ones exploded right from the start, but in general - a good PG is good right from the get-go.
    sure. if only we had a lottery pick.

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  27. #20
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    I think if we don't retain Lowry, then the **** begins next year.

    Anyone we get will be a downgrade and its already doubtful whether this team can continue its success next year. If we lose Lowry and replace him with a rookie or any of the UFAs available, we are the definition of an 8th seed.

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