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  • #31
    I think with Gay on the team, it revealed Casey's achille's heel — the inability to manage big ego's or players with a star mentality.

    If we make some trades and somehow upgrade the roster during the off-season, you have to consider bringing in a big-time coach. But I think we'll likely be in development or ****ing mode for at least three more seasons, and there's no harm in extending him at a reasonable price.

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    • #32
      See whos available, and go from there.

      He has gone from complete cluster **** to ah...he's alright.


      Regardless of how far we get in the playoffs(well...if we get to the finals...) he's earned the right to be considered but not to be out right a go ahead. That said the Casey/Nurse combo has done a good job post Gay.

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      • #33
        JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
        - It took the Rudy Gay trade to spark a fire in T Ross.
        Nope, it took the coach showing some faith and giving him a chance with consistent playing time. Hard to show nice play when you play 5 mins one night, 20 the next than 7 the next. Many young players are inconsistent, the talent was rather obvious to see though as far as I'm concerned.
        Last edited by BigCamB; Sat Jan 18, 2014, 07:20 AM.

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        • #34
          There is lots of season left to evaluate Casey, but I have to give him credit for the defense he has this team playing. Ultimately, that's whats winning us ball games. We held the #2 offense last night to under 90 points. This is very significant to me, and that type of defense is what will also give the team a chance to win some playoff games. Our defense is up there with Indy and CHI so I just can't dismiss Casey despite what was going on with Gay and in previous seasons. I have to support him for that, but this is still an offseason decision so we'll see how it goes.

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          • #35
            I too have been driven mad by coach Case. Here's the thing though, the players have been molded with his philosophy for almost 3 years. Having a new coach means a new system and for the sake of continuity, it would be best he stays for another 2 years. I have my other factors (much like Mr. Apollo):

            1. Who else is out there? I could only think of one and that's Nate McMillan (Vogel's right hand man). Given he is coming from Indy is definitely a good thing.

            2. Is his relationship with Kyle sound? Repaired?

            3. How well does he coach in the playoffs. I'm assuming this is his bread and butter. If he's successful (even with a 2nd round exit), I'd say that's pretty darn good.

            I voted yes btw (no problem w/ a 2 year extension).
            “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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            • #36
              bryan colangelo wrote: View Post
              I think with Gay on the team, it revealed Casey's achille's heel — the inability to manage big ego's or players with a star mentality.

              If we make some trades and somehow upgrade the roster during the off-season, you have to consider bringing in a big-time coach. But I think we'll likely be in development or ****ing mode for at least three more seasons, and there's no harm in extending him at a reasonable price.
              I don't know about this. Big time coaches have been fired / not renewed as well. I'm convinced that without Wade and co. LeBron would eat Spo (remember their 1st year together)?
              “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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              • #37
                Balls of Steel wrote: View Post
                I don't know about this. Big time coaches have been fired / not renewed as well. I'm convinced that without Wade and co. LeBron would eat Spo (remember their 1st year together)?
                I don't even know why we should assume Gay was evidence that Casey can't manage egos.

                Masai clearly wanted to trade Gay.... WTF are you gonna do with a 18 mil contract, not play that person? Not have them shoot and shoot alot? Basically admit that you think he's better in a smaller role... a role whose equivalent replacement is worth alot less then 18 mil?

                Cutting Gay's usage and/or minutes may have been best for the team to win more games, better for Rudy's stats - doesn't mean it was better on the trade market, and Gay HAD to be traded.

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                • #38
                  No, we need someone like Phil Jackson or JVG.

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                  • #39
                    There were a lot of comments in another thread about folks on this forum being confident in the Raps ability to win anywhere from 44 - 52 games this season. Casey doesn't get dumped if that happens.

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                    • #40
                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -Jose was the clear starter over Lowry last year even after they fought for the starting job.
                      - Jose looked better than Lowry because Casey wanted Lowry to play like Jose. That is a DISASTER in terms of coaching. Now, after a year and some terrible losing streaks, Casey is letting Lowry play his game, and we are winning.


                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -I don't see how Bayless or Augustin have been underutilized? They are good backups on mid-calibre teams
                      Augustine looked like he barely could make a college team in TO.
                      I though Bayless never got a chance to step up to the plate. The guy was putting up very good numbers and was a better 2 way player than Jose.

                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -Ross never showed the talent he had before the gay trade offense or defense
                      I loved Ross in his first year. What he is doing is not a surprise. He did this when he played for the Huskies.

                      Casey destroyed his confidence through random benchings and inconsistent tutelage. I have not seen Casey take Ross off the floor and explain to him what he needs to do better. I have not seen it with any player. Another sign of a bad coach.

                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -Val is not good on the PnR as he is best utilized in the low post. I will agree there were times where the minutes were very unusual and unhelpful.
                      O_o

                      Val's strength coming into the league was the PnR. He was very good at catching the lob at the rim for the alley oop or catch and finish on the ground due to his quickness.

                      Val's biggest strength last season was the PnR.

                      Val's confidence in the PnR has been destroyed and it shows with his new found inability to catch the ball in the PnR.

                      The PnR is not run often enough for Val or Amir.

                      There are no lobs to the rim for our athletic big men to catch and dunk.

                      This is due to our offense relying on inefficient mid ranged jump shots from pin down screens

                      This is bad offensive coaching.

                      This is poor player evaluation from you, thinking Val is bad in the PnR.

                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -Lowry is not a good PnR player and has probably used 1/100 screens set for him by Amir. Amir has played well with Jose and Vasquez PnR
                      Lowry is very good in the PnR, when he came to the Raps from Houston he got more shots for his teammates from the PnR than Jose did.

                      But again, Casey castrated him and wanted him to play a game that isn't his.

                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      -Can't believe AA and Ed made this list. AA is a wasteful chucker and Ed is the low post reverse zoolander (can't go right)
                      Bad coaching rotations, trusted that AA was a "vet" and let him shoot shitty shots all game. Bad coaching. Bad decision making. Bad control over his players.

                      Ed was very good. Took him the better part of a year and a half before Casey trusted him. Again like to play the "vets" over the young guys, even though the young guys were better.

                      JRedmond14 wrote: View Post
                      Sometimes it is hard a coach to always maximize potential and find the so called "diamond in the ruff" players. For example, is Mike D'Antoni a bad coach for not figuring out Jeremy Lin was such a good player earlier on in the knicks season? It took the Rudy Gay trade to spark a fire in T Ross.

                      That being said, he should be extended. He has got these guys playing unbelievable defense and I think has actually maximized the talent of some of these players. Masai should look for an upgrade in the offensive assistant coach.
                      Coaching should always be about using players to their strengths. This is hard, yet simple, and something that Casey has NEVER done yet as a head coach for the Raps. That is a poor track record. Move on from him.

                      Ross always had the ability, there were games pre-trade where he had the fire and intense D...but he still got benched in favor of Mr. Gay because Gay was a "vet"

                      Nick Nurse is an incredible mind on offense. I don't think we will be able to upgrade much from him.

                      Casey is a bad head coach and should not be resigned.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        bryan colangelo wrote: View Post
                        I think with Gay on the team, it revealed Casey's achille's heel — the inability to manage big ego's or players with a star mentality.

                        If we make some trades and somehow upgrade the roster during the off-season, you have to consider bringing in a big-time coach. But I think we'll likely be in development or ****ing mode for at least three more seasons, and there's no harm in extending him at a reasonable price.
                        I don't think this is true. Mostly cause Gay doesn't have that attitude and also because he led the T Wolves to a .500 record when The Big Ticket was the Star of the team

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                        • #42
                          stooley wrote: View Post
                          I would look for another coach, and given the options, decide then. So I didn't answer the poll.
                          This^

                          Apollo wrote: View Post
                          I like what Casey is about for the most part but I think it should come down to:

                          A.) Who's available?
                          B.) Who's interested?
                          C.) Of those, who's the best fit in terms of x's & o's and basketball culture?

                          There is more at play than Casey's performance.
                          And this^

                          My position on Casey hasn't changed from what it was when people were calling for his head. Who are we replacing him with? If you can find a better coach then go out and and get that coach. The players seem to have bought in and if he can sustain that buy-in and make some noise in the playoffs then there's nothing wrong with bringing him back. Mostly though, I feel like we SHOULD be able to get a better coach.
                          "They're going to have to rename the whole conference after us: Toronto Raptors 2014-2015 Northern Conference Champions" ~ ezzbee Dec. 2014

                          "I guess I got a little carried away there" ~ ezzbee Apr. 2015

                          "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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                          • #43
                            OldSkoolCool wrote: View Post
                            - Jose looked better than Lowry because Casey wanted Lowry to play like Jose. That is a DISASTER in terms of coaching. Now, after a year and some terrible losing streaks, Casey is letting Lowry play his game, and we are winning.




                            Augustine looked like he barely could make a college team in TO.
                            I though Bayless never got a chance to step up to the plate. The guy was putting up very good numbers and was a better 2 way player than Jose.



                            I loved Ross in his first year. What he is doing is not a surprise. He did this when he played for the Huskies.

                            Casey destroyed his confidence through random benchings and inconsistent tutelage. I have not seen Casey take Ross off the floor and explain to him what he needs to do better. I have not seen it with any player. Another sign of a bad coach.



                            O_o

                            Val's strength coming into the league was the PnR. He was very good at catching the lob at the rim for the alley oop or catch and finish on the ground due to his quickness.

                            Val's biggest strength last season was the PnR.

                            Val's confidence in the PnR has been destroyed and it shows with his new found inability to catch the ball in the PnR.

                            The PnR is not run often enough for Val or Amir.

                            There are no lobs to the rim for our athletic big men to catch and dunk.

                            This is due to our offense relying on inefficient mid ranged jump shots from pin down screens

                            This is bad offensive coaching.

                            This is poor player evaluation from you, thinking Val is bad in the PnR.



                            Lowry is very good in the PnR, when he came to the Raps from Houston he got more shots for his teammates from the PnR than Jose did.

                            But again, Casey castrated him and wanted him to play a game that isn't his.



                            Bad coaching rotations, trusted that AA was a "vet" and let him shoot shitty shots all game. Bad coaching. Bad decision making. Bad control over his players.

                            Ed was very good. Took him the better part of a year and a half before Casey trusted him. Again like to play the "vets" over the young guys, even though the young guys were better.



                            Coaching should always be about using players to their strengths. This is hard, yet simple, and something that Casey has NEVER done yet as a head coach for the Raps. That is a poor track record. Move on from him.

                            Ross always had the ability, there were games pre-trade where he had the fire and intense D...but he still got benched in favor of Mr. Gay because Gay was a "vet"

                            Nick Nurse is an incredible mind on offense. I don't think we will be able to upgrade much from him.

                            Casey is a bad head coach and should not be resigned.
                            ezz_bee wrote: View Post
                            This^



                            And this^

                            My position on Casey hasn't changed from what it was when people were calling for his head. Who are we replacing him with? If you can find a better coach then go out and and get that coach. The players seem to have bought in and if he can sustain that buy-in and make some noise in the playoffs then there's nothing wrong with bringing him back. Mostly though, I feel like we SHOULD be able to get a better coach.
                            Defense wins championships. Everyone knows that. Yet here we are, we got a coach who has the team buying in and he's not good enough. Frank Vogel, Tom Thibodeau are amazing, winning coaches because they preach defense. Oh, over at Indy where scoring comes harder, no one seems to be complaining about their 32 wins and counting. Maybe people should look at all the 30 coaches, pick all the defensive minded ones and calculate their win percentage versus the rest. Just a suggestion.
                            “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              OldSkoolCool wrote: View Post
                              - Jose looked better than Lowry because Casey wanted Lowry to play like Jose. That is a DISASTER in terms of coaching. Now, after a year and some terrible losing streaks, Casey is letting Lowry play his game, and we are winning.




                              Augustine looked like he barely could make a college team in TO.
                              I though Bayless never got a chance to step up to the plate. The guy was putting up very good numbers and was a better 2 way player than Jose.



                              I loved Ross in his first year. What he is doing is not a surprise. He did this when he played for the Huskies.

                              Casey destroyed his confidence through random benchings and inconsistent tutelage. I have not seen Casey take Ross off the floor and explain to him what he needs to do better. I have not seen it with any player. Another sign of a bad coach.



                              O_o

                              Val's strength coming into the league was the PnR. He was very good at catching the lob at the rim for the alley oop or catch and finish on the ground due to his quickness.

                              Val's biggest strength last season was the PnR.

                              Val's confidence in the PnR has been destroyed and it shows with his new found inability to catch the ball in the PnR.

                              The PnR is not run often enough for Val or Amir.

                              There are no lobs to the rim for our athletic big men to catch and dunk.

                              This is due to our offense relying on inefficient mid ranged jump shots from pin down screens

                              This is bad offensive coaching.

                              This is poor player evaluation from you, thinking Val is bad in the PnR.



                              Lowry is very good in the PnR, when he came to the Raps from Houston he got more shots for his teammates from the PnR than Jose did.

                              But again, Casey castrated him and wanted him to play a game that isn't his.



                              Bad coaching rotations, trusted that AA was a "vet" and let him shoot shitty shots all game. Bad coaching. Bad decision making. Bad control over his players.

                              Ed was very good. Took him the better part of a year and a half before Casey trusted him. Again like to play the "vets" over the young guys, even though the young guys were better.



                              Coaching should always be about using players to their strengths. This is hard, yet simple, and something that Casey has NEVER done yet as a head coach for the Raps. That is a poor track record. Move on from him.

                              Ross always had the ability, there were games pre-trade where he had the fire and intense D...but he still got benched in favor of Mr. Gay because Gay was a "vet"

                              Nick Nurse is an incredible mind on offense. I don't think we will be able to upgrade much from him.

                              Casey is a bad head coach and should not be resigned.
                              Couldnt have said it better myself. He gets some credit for helping turn things around - although its almost as if his hand was forced and then and only then did he make calls he should have made long, long ago (Ross minutes, JV minutes, Kyle leading the team, Ross finishing games (remember when people were defending him ending games with Salmons!!).

                              Way too many mistakes over the years in terms of personnel, time outs, inbounds plays, stagnant offense, etc.

                              Nice guy, but not a good NBA coach. He has to go

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                He's a good motivator & excellent defensive coach. He's well respected by his peers which says a lot about his character (since it can't be his track record). He has established a standard for compete level and toughness in his 3 year tenure here. We rarely get blown out on the road which means he has his teams prepared mentally.

                                That said, we need a coach with a playbook. He cannot handle big egos & if we're seriously looking to add a star FA in the future, I see Casey faltering. His offensive sets lack variety & creativity.

                                I respect him. He's a real pro. I just don't see him taking us to that next level (contention).
                                “I don’t create controversies. They’re there long before I open my mouth. I just bring them to your attention.”

                                -- Charles Barkley

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