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How Can We Upgrade This Offseason?

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  • #46
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    No doubt.

    However, unless they shed any combination of DeRozan/Fields/Hayes/Johnson/Novak and/or renounce Lowry (i.e. guaranteed money for 2014-15) the earliest they can make a splash is summer of 2015.
    I'm thinking in terms of a sign and trade. In that case, do we need the cap space? Guys like Derozan, Johnson and even Novak could be used to match salaries and/or sweeten the pot. Maybe I don't understand the nuances of S&T's, but I thought as long as we weren't in a tax-paying situation we could participate, in which case those types of guys might be necessary to make such a trade work.

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    • #47
      JawsGT wrote: View Post
      I'm thinking in terms of a sign and trade. In that case, do we need the cap space? Guys like Derozan, Johnson and even Novak could be used to match salaries and/or sweeten the pot. Maybe I don't understand the nuances of S&T's, but I thought as long as we weren't in a tax-paying situation we could participate, in which case those types of guys might be necessary to make such a trade work.
      I think the biggest issue with a sign and trade is a team usually is looking to rebuild. Guys like Novak, Fields, and Hayes are not pieces to entice a team. When you look at Amir he is not a piece for a rebuilding team, he is paid too much, just think about Raptors last few years with him. DeRozan might entice a team but I don't think he is the type of player to entice a team either but I fully recognize I may very well be biased on that. Draft picks, rookie deal players with lots of potential (JV, Ross) are guys teams would want. It is why I advocate so strongly asset accumulation. Rebuilding teams are selling hope and the future to their fan base. People are going to know what they are getting with DeROzan and Amir. Just my .02.

      ....and there is always an exception, for example Denver with Melo but even that was about accumulating assets.

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      • #48
        Matt52 wrote: View Post
        I think the biggest issue with a sign and trade is a team usually is looking to rebuild. Guys like Novak, Fields, and Hayes are not pieces to entice a team. When you look at Amir he is not a piece for a rebuilding team, he is paid too much, just think about Raptors last few years with him. DeRozan might entice a team but I don't think he is the type of player to entice a team either but I fully recognize I may very well be biased on that. Draft picks, rookie deal players with lots of potential (JV, Ross) are guys teams would want. It is why I advocate so strongly asset accumulation. Rebuilding teams are selling hope and the future to their fan base. People are going to know what they are getting with DeROzan and Amir. Just my .02.

        ....and there is always an exception, for example Denver with Melo but even that was about accumulating assets.
        That makes sense. So what about salary matching, how does that work in terms of trades? I'm guessing that salaries need to match when teams are over the cap, but a team with cap space can take on more salary then it sends out, as long as it does not exceed the cap (or apron maybe)? I've been trying to learn more about the CBA and these types of situations, but it isn't as straight forward as one would hope.

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        • #49
          Matt52 wrote: View Post
          No doubt.

          However, unless they shed any combination of DeRozan/Fields/Hayes/Johnson/Novak and/or renounce Lowry (i.e. guaranteed money for 2014-15) the earliest they can make a splash is summer of 2015.
          I believe that 2015 has been the plan since MU came here because it makes too much sense. However, if ownership is willing to go into the tax, then the equation is different. It's more than a little premature for this conversation in any case. Too many variables at the moment.

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          • #50
            For this year retool with guys like Ariza and Richard Jefferson, Draft solid and we should be in good shape for next season
            #BringBackUzoh

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            • #51
              Sign Carlos Boozer.

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              • #52
                Everyone in here keeps mentioning that we need a low post presence like Monroe. And here's what I have to say:

                Amir is the best help defender on our team, he really does bring a lot on both ends, I think if we take him out of our starting lineup, then a lot of our weaknesses get exposed. If we pair JV with Monroe for example, our front line will get crushed on the defensive end.

                Jonas looks like he's got the potential to be a force on the offensive end. If he really buckles down this summer and trains with a great coach, then he'll solve our low post problem on the offensive end.

                For me, PF is not a position of need. We've got 3 solid players there in Amir, Patterson and Hans, and we can throw in whichever guy's hot on a given night.
                "Bruno?
                Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                He's terrible."

                -Superjudge, 7/23

                Hope you're wrong.

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                • #53
                  Matt52 wrote: View Post
                  No doubt.

                  However, unless they shed any combination of DeRozan/Fields/Hayes/Johnson/Novak and/or renounce Lowry (i.e. guaranteed money for 2014-15) the earliest they can make a splash is summer of 2015.
                  I would think this has to be Plan A. I totally agree with the "Big Fish" take. Gordon Hayward is not taking this team over the top, and TL has already proven to dream much bigger than that.

                  This team is still very young and two key pieces - Ross and JV - are still very raw. Some great suggestions have been put forward here - bolster the back-up PG and back-up C. A first round pick this year and two next year will help, even if they're mid to late. Find a couple value contracts for next season, re-sign assets to reasonable contracts, etc. etc. Basically keep moving forward with the types of moves Ujiri's already been making.

                  This team has only had a couple of months with this identity and roster. A whole season next year would be good for growth. 2015/16 is a good timeline to pencil in "big fish." Firstly, it'll be a lot easier to attract a big ticket FA to this roster after one or two more seasons of development. Secondly, with solid assets in place a franchise player trade may become available over the next couple of seasons.

                  I don't think that big fish trade/FA signing can be entirely planned for, though. It's as much of a gamble as tanking.
                  "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                  • #54
                    JawsGT wrote: View Post
                    That makes sense. So what about salary matching, how does that work in terms of trades? I'm guessing that salaries need to match when teams are over the cap, but a team with cap space can take on more salary then it sends out, as long as it does not exceed the cap (or apron maybe)? I've been trying to learn more about the CBA and these types of situations, but it isn't as straight forward as one would hope.
                    Normal trade rules apply with a sign and trade.

                    It is way to complicated to post. This is a good start.

                    http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q90


                    Anything you want to know regarding CBA can be found at cbafaq.com

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                    • #55
                      feet85 wrote: View Post
                      For this year retool with guys like Ariza and Richard Jefferson, Draft solid and we should be in good shape for next season
                      I don't think Masai builds with those type of players.

                      I don't think you see anyone signed older than 25/26.

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                      • #56
                        Matt52 wrote: View Post
                        Normal trade rules apply with a sign and trade.

                        It is way to complicated to post. This is a good start.

                        http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q90


                        Anything you want to know regarding CBA can be found at cbafaq.com
                        yeah, that's what I have been reading, didn't get to that point yet. It seems the receiving team cannot go over the apron with a S&T.

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                        • #57
                          Let's sign Rudy Gay............................................... .......

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                          • #58
                            stooley wrote: View Post
                            Everyone in here keeps mentioning that we need a low post presence like Monroe. And here's what I have to say:

                            Amir is the best help defender on our team, he really does bring a lot on both ends, I think if we take him out of our starting lineup, then a lot of our weaknesses get exposed. If we pair JV with Monroe for example, our front line will get crushed on the defensive end.

                            Jonas looks like he's got the potential to be a force on the offensive end. If he really buckles down this summer and trains with a great coach, then he'll solve our low post problem on the offensive end.

                            For me, PF is not a position of need. We've got 3 solid players there in Amir, Patterson and Hans, and we can throw in whichever guy's hot on a given night.
                            Totally agree, I've seen Monroe pop up a number of times here and I cringe thinking about it. Would be a really terrible fit with JV. Much prefer the more mobile Amir and Patterson with him with their varied skills, I think it's a solid mix.

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                            • #59
                              Matt52 wrote: View Post
                              I don't think Masai builds with those type of players.

                              I don't think you see anyone signed older than 25/26.
                              Unless its for obvious veteran leadership; like an Andre Miller.

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                              • #60
                                Rapstor4Life wrote: View Post
                                Sign Carlos Boozer.
                                I bet if we traded some decent pieces for him (say DD+Salmons), we could pry away 2 of their first rounders because they desperately want the cap space, and yet are getting and -allstar-

                                stooley wrote: View Post
                                Everyone in here keeps mentioning that we need a low post presence like Monroe. And here's what I have to say:

                                Jonas looks like he's got the potential to be a force on the offensive end. If he really buckles down this summer and trains with a great coach, then he'll solve our low post problem on the offensive end.

                                For me, PF is not a position of need. We've got 3 solid players there in Amir, Patterson and Hans, and we can throw in whichever guy's hot on a given night.
                                From what I have seen this year...his post game is going to take years before it becomes a threat. He lacks balance, footwork, hands, dribbles, shoulder fakes, up and unders. Basically all of the post moves besides an improving drop step into a baby hook and he does have a good touch around the rim. I would much rather see Jonas' development be pushed to improving leg strength and becoming more agile so he can be a better PnR defender (and on offense too), as well as a better help defender. He is also a pretty bad passer out of the post.

                                I really think we need a power PF, someone who can play back to the basket and attract the double. Amir and Pattman are more stretch 4s, and would make a GREAT pairing on a bench unit with a balance of PnR ability/shooting/defense/mobility/rebounding.

                                BigCamB wrote: View Post
                                Totally agree, I've seen Monroe pop up a number of times here and I cringe thinking about it. Would be a really terrible fit with JV. Much prefer the more mobile Amir and Patterson with him with their varied skills, I think it's a solid mix.
                                I was on the Monroe idea in the offseason....but Monroe is basically the more offensively savvy version of Amir, so I agree he doesn't really have a fit here.

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