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Thread: Is There a Light at the End of the Tunnel?

  1. #1
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    Default Is There a Light at the End of the Tunnel?

    - We're stuck with Hedo for at least another 2 years.
    - We're stuck with Triano until at least Mitchell's contract comes off the books. Realistically though, we're stuck with him forever because he's the local boy and MLSEs little pet.
    - Our second option is an emotionless, heartless waste of potential.
    - Our coaching staff overall is atrocious, clueless and simply oblivious.
    - Our PG off the bench makes 8 million a year and nobody would ever take him on as a starter because he's not starter material at all.

    I've been asking myself these past few days why would Bosh want to stay? This team has nothing going for it for the next 2-4 years. The only light at the end of the tunnel is DeMar, but he's at least 3 years away from being an impact player. Does Bosh want to waste more of his life playing the waiting game, hoping that this team will make a turn towards competence?

    The worst part about all this is that Colangelo seems to be shuffling up the team every year hoping for something that works. It's like he totally lacks any long-term vision when it comes to building this team. The signing of Hedo seems to have been motivated by desperation and ego, not logic. The only good thing that came out of that is that we acquired some very useful pieces along with him.

    So I ask: where is this team heading down the line? We've got 19 games left in the season. A quick first round exit all but guaranteed. And we're stuck with this same squad for a few more years. Where's the incentive for Bosh to stay when he's got teams out there better suited for him? Who NEED him to be successful teams, not for a month, but for a whole season and especially in the playoffs.

    Unless Colangelo has some miracle planned for the off-season I don't see CB sticking around waiting any longer for this organization to get it right. I don't see why the man would waste his prime years on a big what if.

    Maybe I'm being overly cynical. But I've been burned by MLSE's teams too often in the past to hold out blind hope that "next year will be better"

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Veteran LBF's Avatar
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    okay, there swami i guess you know all. wait to freakin over analyze everything but the kitchen sink!

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    Raptors Republic Rookie MattyG-Ray's Avatar
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    First of all, Calderon can be a starting PG in this league, but it needs to be in the right situation, somewhere he is surrounded by strong defenders. Toronto is the wrong situation because he is surrounded by horrible defenders. But there were several reports in late December early January that The Lakers were interested in acquiring Calderon. He would be just fine on LA because he would be surrounded by 4 great defenders in the starting lineup. If Colangelo decides to trade Calderon this off season, he will have no problem moving him. He isn't going to get back young prospects, but expiring contracts is likely.

    Second, this team has not yet seen the best of Hedo. I know he has been awful this year, but he is a brutal fit next to Calderon, and if Jose goes that will help. Hedo is still a very good player in this league, and in the right situation he can be successful.

    Third, look at all the quality young players this team has, who are just scratching the surface of their potential. Jack is 26, Marco is 23, Weems is 23, Bargs is 24, Amir is 22, Derozan is 20. Not exactly a team that has seen its best days. Oh, and Bosh is only 25, big guys don't usually decline till around 32.

    Finally, I really don't think this team is that far off, it is mostly just a bad mix of talented players. Colangelo has put together a group of guys who are all great offensive players, and limited defensively. At some point, you need guys who can guard the position well. Weems and Demar have the ability to become good defenders at their position and so does Amir, but right now they are below average defenders. Jack is an average defender at his position, as is Bosh, they are unlikely to become better individual defenders, but improving their team and help defense is entirely possible. If you add a defensive minded backup point guard this off season, and a coach that is willing to hold his players accountable defensively, then you can become a better defensive team.

    The team looks bad now, and it is. But its not like it needs to be blown up. Colangelo has put some nice pieces in place, and if he can make some minor tweaks this off season, then this team can improve quickly. Oh, and this is Mitchell's last year on his contract, and Jay Triano is likely amongst the lowest paid head coaches in the league, so MLSE shouldn't have a problem swallowing the rest of his deal.
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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    okay, there swami i guess you know all. wait to freakin over analyze everything but the kitchen sink!
    just calling it like it is.

    this team is in a downward spiral with barely any hope.

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    Quote MattyG-Ray wrote: View Post
    First of all, Calderon can be a starting PG in this league, but it needs to be in the right situation, somewhere he is surrounded by strong defenders. Toronto is the wrong situation because he is surrounded by horrible defenders. But there were several reports in late December early January that The Lakers were interested in acquiring Calderon. He would be just fine on LA because he would be surrounded by 4 great defenders in the starting lineup. If Colangelo decides to trade Calderon this off season, he will have no problem moving him. He isn't going to get back young prospects, but expiring contracts is likely.
    ok so that's 1 out of 30-something teams where he can start. And it just so happens to be the defending champs. Personally I'd love to see this trade happen just so we can see how much the other 4 guys could make up Calderon's deficiencies on the D.

    Second, this team has not yet seen the best of Hedo. I know he has been awful this year, but he is a brutal fit next to Calderon, and if Jose goes that will help. Hedo is still a very good player in this league, and in the right situation he can be successful.
    Again, "right situation". Isn't the job of the GM to bring in guys that fit the situation at hand? Also, ya he's brutal beside Calderon but he mostly plays beside Jack and still doesn't do s***. Now take into account the type of money he's making and these excuses become weaker and weaker. Also he's not getting any younger...

    Third, look at all the quality young players this team has, who are just scratching the surface of their potential. Jack is 26, Marco is 23, Weems is 23, Bargs is 24, Amir is 22, Derozan is 20. Not exactly a team that has seen its best days. Oh, and Bosh is only 25, big guys don't usually decline till around 32.
    Yea, Bosh is 25. Looking at the mess this team is in, and has been ever since he got here, why would he want to waste his prime here? Just playing devil's advocate here.

    No argument on the quality youth though.

    Finally, I really don't think this team is that far off, it is mostly just a bad mix of talented players. Colangelo has put together a group of guys who are all great offensive players, and limited defensively. At some point, you need guys who can guard the position well. Weems and Demar have the ability to become good defenders at their position and so does Amir, but right now they are below average defenders. Jack is an average defender at his position, as is Bosh, they are unlikely to become better individual defenders, but improving their team and help defense is entirely possible. If you add a defensive minded backup point guard this off season, and a coach that is willing to hold his players accountable defensively, then you can become a better defensive team.
    The talent is definitely there but the GM has done a horrible job of putting the pieces together and the coaching staff is better suited for high school basketball. It doesn't help that none of those guys are defensive-minded coaches. Iavaroni was brought in to set up the defense for crying out loud. Memphis was the worst defensive team in the league the year he coached them, and now he's in charge of our defense. Doesn't take a genius to figure out that he doesn't know what he's doing.

    The team looks bad now, and it is. But its not like it needs to be blown up. Colangelo has put some nice pieces in place, and if he can make some minor tweaks this off season, then this team can improve quickly. Oh, and this is Mitchell's last year on his contract, and Jay Triano is likely amongst the lowest paid head coaches in the league, so MLSE shouldn't have a problem swallowing the rest of his deal.
    Last thing this team needs is to be blown up for the 4th time in 5 years. Some pieces need to be moved though. And a real coach and staff need to be brought in. How fitting that in our franchise players final year we decide to experiment with a rookie coach? Colangelo has come in and, excluding his first year, created 1 clusterfuck after another.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie MattyG-Ray's Avatar
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    Quote nubreed000 wrote: View Post
    ok so that's 1 out of 30-something teams where he can start. And it just so happens to be the defending champs. Personally I'd love to see this trade happen just so we can see how much the other 4 guys could make up Calderon's deficiencies on the D.
    I used the Lakers mostly because they showed an interest in acquiring Calderon this year. It doesn't have to be LA though. Any team with a solid shot blocking center and good rotations would be a fine fit for Jose. But it doesn't really matter where Jose ends up and how he plays there. What does matter is that there are definitely teams willing to take him on.

    Again, "right situation". Isn't the job of the GM to bring in guys that fit the situation at hand? Also, ya he's brutal beside Calderon but he mostly plays beside Jack and still doesn't do s***. Now take into account the type of money he's making and these excuses become weaker and weaker. Also he's not getting any younger...
    Turks minutes are split pretty evenly between playing alongside Jack or Jose, and he has been bad with either one, but worse with Jose. Turk is a laid back guy and he just isn't comfortable right now. His role is different from Orlando and he is having trouble adjusting. I haven't lost hope though, because Toronto hasn't put Turk in the best position to be successful. I wish Turk would of adjusted better, but he hasn't yet. Either way we haven't seen what Turk can bring to this team yet.

    Yes, it is definitely the job of the GM to bring in guys that fit with the team, and BC has been horrible at that this year. But he has brought in a lot of nice talent to. Amir, Demar, Jack, Weems, Marco, those are all great additions. I think the smart move would be to not panic, fire BC and start trying to make wholesale changes, but rather determine the areas in which this team is weak. Then make minor moves to help address those areas.



    Yea, Bosh is 25. Looking at the mess this team is in, and has been ever since he got here, why would he want to waste his prime here? Just playing devil's advocate here.

    No argument on the quality youth though.
    I don't know why he would. It will be up to BC to make a couple of moves in an effort to sell CB4 on staying, and if Bosh leaves, the BC has to get the best value he can in a sign and trade. I still don't think all is lost though, CB4 isn't the kind of guy who is gonna make a rash decision. He will take his time and evaluate.



    The talent is definitely there but the GM has done a horrible job of putting the pieces together and the coaching staff is better suited for high school basketball. It doesn't help that none of those guys are defensive-minded coaches. Iavaroni was brought in to set up the defense for crying out loud. Memphis was the worst defensive team in the league the year he coached them, and now he's in charge of our defense. Doesn't take a genius to figure out that he doesn't know what he's doing.

    Last thing this team needs is to be blown up for the 4th time in 5 years. Some pieces need to be moved though. And a real coach and staff need to be brought in. How fitting that in our franchise players final year we decide to experiment with a rookie coach? Colangelo has come in and, excluding his first year, created 1 clusterfuck after another.
    Definitely don't want to blow up, so what if BC does this in the off-season:

    -fire Triano, hire a proven head coach, maybe Avery Johnson or Jeff Van Gundy, someone who is a bit of a hard nosed guy, who will rip into his players if they deserve it, and hold people accountable
    -trade away Jose for expiring contracts, shouldn't be tough as long as you don't care what you get in return, so long as they expire at the end of next season
    -sign Kyle Lowry (RFA) to be the backup PG, he is great on defense, he is tough as nails, and he plays the game with a passion
    -try and acquire a defensive stopper. This won't be easy, because the teams who have proven guys are unlikely to give them up (Battier, Sefolosha, Affalo). Maybe Matt Barnes (player option), he isn't as good a defender as the guys mentioned, but he relishes the chance to go head to head with the best players, and he doesn't back down form anybody.

    I think the addition of those two players, as well as a good coach would make Toronto an average defensive team. I would actually argue for bringing Turk off the bench, this way we can get a little more defense in the starting unit with Barnes and Derozan, and Turk can help run the second unit, taking some of the pressure off Lowry. I would still have Turk playing 30 minutes a night and finishing games though. If Bosh were to resign, then I like that team, I think that with good development from Demar and Bargs, then that team could make it out of the first round next year.
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