Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 21 to 29 of 29

Thread: Removing The Rose Coloured Glasses: An honest Masai Assessment

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Veteran
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    5,053
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote stooley wrote: View Post
    didn't his father have final say on basketball moves though.
    To be kind I would say that is a retrospective view of BC's growth as a GM

    I remember how giddy we all were when he rode into town to save the franchise from the Babcockian nightmare and such a thought was never contemplated. But then he got to work and the only cap he may have worried about was the unused one.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    6
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Toronto overrates everyone. I think it's Canadian optimism in the face of decades of overwhelming failure in Toronto sports. I guess that's a good thing considering the alternative would be casting doubt on our new arrivals. At least we wait until later in their tenure before that starts up. Seriously, who since '95 has left the team on truly good terms? Nobody (Garboja and A.Williams are remembered fondly, but that's only due to injury).
    Masai will one day leave in the same light. Brought in with too much promise and will fail to live up to it.
    All of the Raptor GMs and coaches were brought in as saviours and none could cut it.
    I'm not a bitter fan at all.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic All-Star stooley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    1,961
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote mailman wrote: View Post
    Toronto overrates everyone. I think it's Canadian optimism in the face of decades of overwhelming failure in Toronto sports. I guess that's a good thing considering the alternative would be casting doubt on our new arrivals. At least we wait until later in their tenure before that starts up. Seriously, who since '95 has left the team on truly good terms? Nobody (Garboja and A.Williams are remembered fondly, but that's only due to injury).
    Masai will one day leave in the same light. Brought in with too much promise and will fail to live up to it.
    All of the Raptor GMs and coaches were brought in as saviours and none could cut it.
    I'm not a bitter fan at all.
    over optimism is a trade mark of every fanbase - as far as positive thought on ex-players, i'd say jose definitely left well

  4. #24
    Raptors Republic Starter torch19's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Toronto, ON
    Posts
    713
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Even Masai admits it; he hasn't done anything yet & even when he left Denver, the team was not a finished product. It's the hype the media creates & people buy it. Really, if you were to lay out what makes Masai Ujiri a good GM:

    (1) His message is simple; we will work hard & we are a 'family' (team first)

    (2) He communicates with his head coach but empowers the coach to make 'coaching decisions' (I'm the GM, you're the coach)

    (3) He believes in depth, size for position & values roster spots 1 through 15

    (4) He evaluates players based on talent, character & fit

    (5) He brings in useful pieces for his head coach -- (a) ball skills for position or (b) specialist (defined NBA skill)

    The roster we have right now is tailor-made for Dwane Casey. Likewise, in Denver, the roster was tailor-made for George Karl. I think that's where a lot of GM's fail -- they find talent but the fit is terrible. Masai hasn't done anything significant, but I really do like the pieces he's brought in given that he did not have much to work with coming in.

    Re: Denver Nuggets

    Brian Shaw is a bad fit for the Denver Roster -- he would be better if the Nuggets swapped rosters with the Raptors. It's all about fit across all platforms -- from ownership to management to coaches to players. You can really only judge Masai for his work in Denver (when he was there). The roster they have now would not be the same exact roster had Masai stayed there. You really can't blame him for their troubles being that he's been gone from the organization since the off-season.

    Re: Rose-colored glasses

    This is a byproduct of media hype. He has this mystique to him because he stays away from media attention - but yet the media portrays him as the 'warlord', etc. His message has been the same since day one -- big picture, patient, work hard, team.
    “I don’t create controversies. They’re there long before I open my mouth. I just bring them to your attention.”

    -- Charles Barkley

  5. Like Axel, thead, Scraptor liked this post
  6. #25
    Raptors Republic Superstar planetmars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    3,395
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    In life you should be held innocent until proven guilty. MU gets to have the saviour mentality just like BC did when he first got the title. Until he screws up you can't judge him.

    I've questioned MU's decisions on the Nene signing and the Iggy trade before. With Iggy he could have come back if MU was there.. unfortunately MU never had the chance to work with Iggy to keep him - so you can't really judge him on that but it was a high risk move (a first rounder and good player on a good contract (Afflalo)) for a rental is a tough pill to swallow consider Iggy isn't even a super star.

    In Toronto MU has made some good decisions so far. The Bargnani trade was fantastic (I was seriously thinking amnesty but he got a first rounder back). If the AB trade was an A+ the Gay trade has to be at least an A. That player option was looming over the team's head. I like some of the free agent signings (Tyler was a solid pickup at a really good price, DJ/Daye were both bad but were minimum contracts). I was hoping for a tank and he decided to just wait and see. Maybe that's going to backfire, maybe not but we won't know for at least 2-3 years.

    This summer is his biggest test. What will he do with Lowry? If he overpays that can hamstring the organization. If he lets him go he gets maybe nothing back which also hurts the organization. What does he do with his draft pick? Does he acquire more? Is he keeping this roster in tact and building on it or is he blowing it up?

    Innocent until proven guilty. I'm keeping my rose coloured glasses on... but once a decision is made that I find questionable I'll probably add my two cents from my trusty old arm chair.

  7. #26
    Raptors Republic All-Star OldSkoolCool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,178
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    First thought: Joe Dumars cap space cologne.

    I haven't minded Masai's moves in FA here. All quality pick-ups, high reward low-risk types. I'm satisfied so far, but we'll see how it plays out
    I agree he has done a wonderful job so far. I have no quarrels with his smaller moves. It's the larger moves that have ended up problematic. However I think that has more to do with injuries and bad luck than with the contracts themselves....

    Either way I think FA is his weakest area, but that just says how strong his other areas are, and not that his FA abilities are necessarily weak...

  8. #27
    Raptors Republic Starter Uncle_Si's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    627
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    It's hilarious that anyone would try to blame Denver's team this year on Masai.

    As has already been pointed out in previous posts they have endured a ton of injuries. But I think the root of their problem comes down to ownership. They're cheap. They didn't want to spend the money to keep Masai and just let him walk away. Iggy left as a result and they fired George Karl. Ujiri built the team to suit Karl's coaching style and he's done the same around Casey (for the time being anyway with short expiring/cheap contracts. So now Shaw is coaching an injury depleted team that was built for a style of play that he doesn't coach. Brilliant. And all of this is somehow Ujiris fault?

  9. #28
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Kigali, Rwanda
    Posts
    1,678
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote OldSkoolCool wrote: View Post
    I think Masai is a draft and trade genious

    However I do question his FA ability...that has usually been where his skeletons lie
    I agree with your assessment of Ujiri. And I'm going to go a a bit of a tangent...
    I'm of the opinion that most gms lose in free agency.

    I think that unless you are signing end of the bench players or players who are worth more than the MAX, it's really difficult to win FA. This is mostly as a result of bidding. When it comes to middle of the road players-borderline all-stars to borderline starters- it only takes one asshole to up the price. Either you don't get the player because some asshole offered more, OR you are the asshole who paid too much. It's a lose-lose scenario. Although there are exceptions and there's no harm in giving a player an offer, but essentially I think you need to draft or trade for positions 3-7.

    That's my thinking anyway.

    Thoughts?

    Getting back to the thread... BC was very good at drafting, but his problem was that he loved trading his draft picks away. Hopefully Masai sticks to his strengths.

    EDIT: To actually answer the OP. Yes, I have rose coloured glasses on when it comes to Ujir (although I prefer the analogy that I'm drinking the Kool-Aid). That's mostly the result of it still be the honeymoon, and that it's too early to come up with anything concrete one way or another. He's got until trade deadline of next year to put together a big enough body of work for me to be critical.
    Last edited by ezz_bee; Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 04:09 AM.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  10. #29
    Raptors Republic All-Star
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    1,199
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote planetmars wrote: View Post
    I've questioned MU's decisions on the Nene signing and the Iggy trade before. With Iggy he could have come back if MU was there.. unfortunately MU never had the chance to work with Iggy to keep him - so you can't really judge him on that but it was a high risk move (a first rounder and good player on a good contract (Afflalo)) for a rental is a tough pill to swallow consider Iggy isn't even a super star.
    Yeah, exactly. It's just high risk. Iggy might've stayed or not, but it's still such a high risk.

    Obviously right now we are living in the worst case scenario -- Iggy leaves, Afflalo plays like an all star, and Orlando very likely gets a lottery pick in a loaded 2014 draft from that trade. That's a nightmare.

    But the best case scenario would be what. Iggy stays at 12 or 13 mil a year vs. Afflalo's under 8 mil a year, and they give up a non-lottery pick. That would be ok-ish I guess but nothing amazing.

    So overall risk-reward just isn't there. Lots of risk to lose a lot, small reward.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •