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What will happen if the Raptors trade for an elite talent?

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  • #61
    Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Transcendent Talent = Superstar = Elite Player = Franchise Player = Cornerstone = All-NBA

    Take your pick.
    How about superfantasticalplayerguy?

    I know what a transcendent player is its just funny how these names are ridden for a month or so before the next buzz word comes out. I'd like to speak with the guy that releases these buzz words I think mine has a real shot at being something
    Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
    Because its 2015

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    • #62
      Uncle_Si wrote: View Post
      How about superfantasticalplayerguy?

      I know what a transcendent player is its just funny how these names are ridden for a month or so before the next buzz word comes out. I'd like to speak with the guy that releases these buzz words I think mine has a real shot at being something
      My post wasn't directed at you. Just a general jab at the ridiculousness of it all.

      For the record, I think superfantasticalplayerguy has some momentum.

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      • #63
        Uncle_Si wrote: View Post
        How about superfantasticalplayerguy?

        I know what a transcendent player is its just funny how these names are ridden for a month or so before the next buzz word comes out. I'd like to speak with the guy that releases these buzz words I think mine has a real shot at being something
        LOL. Good stuff. I like where you guys are going with this. I mean, you can almost envision a scenario where the Raptors actually DO end up getting Wiggins, and he doesn't deliver the championship and the fan-base turns on the home-town boy.

        Then, all these newly minted GM wannabe, championship franchise building experts are going to be saying... "oh, no... what we really meant was that you need a Generational Talent, like Lebron, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe or Garnett to get it done, and Wiggins is merely transcendent. We need Wiggins and that other guy."

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        • #64
          if we trade for an elite talent, that elite player will lose his legs in a tragic boating accident and we will cry bitter bitter tears

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          • #65
            I love what Houston's done.

            Of course the circumstances are not repeatable, but the principles are there. Instead of buying high on an established star with half his prime (or more) behind him, they bought fairly low from a cheap ass team on a player on the brink of stardom. Nobody knew if Harden would become the player he has as a #1 guy, but the buying price was fine either way.

            As Matt said, Houston kept so many young assets because their pantry was full of young assets and solid contracts. They had no problem making space to sign Dwight, and they've even had enough of a surplus of talent and flexibility to have Asik fall off a cliff this season and to overpay Lin, yet still be gearing up for championship-contender status here in the second half of the season. 3/4 of their roster is 23-25 years old, too.

            That's all MU has to do - keep building, keep adding young talent, keep the picks and prospects, and "swing for the fences" (or whatever) when the right transaction is there. Don't do it just for the sake of doing it - a lot of GM's predetermine to acquire talent within a time-frame or offseason, and do it even if the price is too high. When you've got youth, a currently competitive team, and a team-friendly cap situation, you can be patient. Some GM out there is going to blink first and sell low, or a disgruntled player is going to start asking out of a crappy situation.
            "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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            • #66
              S.R. wrote: View Post
              I love what Houston's done.

              Of course the circumstances are not repeatable, but the principles are there. Instead of buying high on an established star with half his prime (or more) behind him, they bought fairly low from a cheap ass team on a player on the brink of stardom. Nobody knew if Harden would become the player he has as a #1 guy, but the buying price was fine either way.

              As Matt said, Houston kept so many young assets because their pantry was full of young assets and solid contracts. They had no problem making space to sign Dwight, and they've even had enough of a surplus of talent and flexibility to have Asik fall off a cliff this season and to overpay Lin, yet still be gearing up for championship-contender status here in the second half of the season. 3/4 of their roster is 23-25 years old, too.

              That's all MU has to do - keep building, keep adding young talent, keep the picks and prospects, and "swing for the fences" (or whatever) when the right transaction is there. Don't do it just for the sake of doing it - a lot of GM's predetermine to acquire talent within a time-frame or offseason, and do it even if the price is too high. When you've got youth, a currently competitive team, and a team-friendly cap situation, you can be patient. Some GM out there is going to blink first and sell low, or a disgruntled player is going to start asking out of a crappy situation.
              Boom. If we don't do that, I'm happy with MU
              "Bruno?
              Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
              He's terrible."

              -Superjudge, 7/23

              Hope you're wrong.

              Comment


              • #67
                S.R. wrote: View Post
                I love what Houston's done.

                Of course the circumstances are not repeatable, but the principles are there. Instead of buying high on an established star with half his prime (or more) behind him, they bought fairly low from a cheap ass team on a player on the brink of stardom. Nobody knew if Harden would become the player he has as a #1 guy, but the buying price was fine either way.

                As Matt said, Houston kept so many young assets because their pantry was full of young assets and solid contracts. They had no problem making space to sign Dwight, and they've even had enough of a surplus of talent and flexibility to have Asik fall off a cliff this season and to overpay Lin, yet still be gearing up for championship-contender status here in the second half of the season. 3/4 of their roster is 23-25 years old, too.

                That's all MU has to do - keep building, keep adding young talent, keep the picks and prospects, and "swing for the fences" (or whatever) when the right transaction is there. Don't do it just for the sake of doing it - a lot of GM's predetermine to acquire talent within a time-frame or offseason, and do it even if the price is too high. When you've got youth, a currently competitive team, and a team-friendly cap situation, you can be patient. Some GM out there is going to blink first and sell low, or a disgruntled player is going to start asking out of a crappy situation.
                Great post. And Houston did all of that without having to lower themselves or subject their fan-base to the indignity of a tanking strategy. Morey creatively acquired other team's picks via trade, including ours, which was one of the keys to the Harden deal.

                Comment


                • #68
                  golden wrote: View Post
                  Great post. And Houston did all of that without having to lower themselves or subject their fan-base to the indignity of a tanking strategy. Morey creatively acquired other team's picks via trade, including ours, which was one of the keys to the Harden deal.
                  That's the beauty of MU's 5 year deal. TL gave him the reigns for 5 years, no pressure to build something in 2 that would require drastic moves.
                  Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
                  Because its 2015

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    golden wrote: View Post
                    Great post. And Houston did all of that without having to lower themselves or subject their fan-base to the indignity of a tanking strategy. Morey creatively acquired other team's picks via trade, including ours, which was one of the keys to the Harden deal.
                    I am actually curious to know what was Houston's record in past 5-6 years ... How many time they made the play offs ? What kind of picks did they have and ...

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Jamshid wrote: View Post
                      I am actually curious to know what was Houston's record in past 5-6 years ... How many time they made the play offs ? What kind of picks did they have and ...
                      07: 1st round loss to Utah
                      08: 1st round loss to Utah
                      09: second round loss to LAL
                      10: 42-40, 9th in Wet
                      11: 43-39, 9th in West
                      12: 34-32, 9th in West
                      12: 45-37, 8th in West
                      "Bruno?
                      Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                      He's terrible."

                      -Superjudge, 7/23

                      Hope you're wrong.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Jamshid wrote: View Post
                        I am actually curious to know what was Houston's record in past 5-6 years ... How many time they made the play offs ? What kind of picks did they have and ...
                        http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/HOU/

                        ANswers are found above in link.

                        But in a nutshell they were .500 or better from 2010, 2011, and 2012 but missed playoffs in tough west.

                        They drafted at 14, 14, and 12 but they had other picks.
                        Houston draft history: http://www.basketball-reference.com/...HOU/draft.html


                        Too bad he likes making deals so much. He had Mirotic and sent him to Chicago for a later pick, a 2nd round pick, and cash. Mirotic with Houston's current lineup would be sick.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          I think it will be a lot harder these days to get three picks in a lottery if you are a .500 team. Most teams struggle to give up first rounders, and when they do they add protections.

                          Not too many Colangelo's in the system anymore.

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                          • #73
                            stooley wrote: View Post
                            07: 1st round loss to Utah
                            08: 1st round loss to Utah
                            09: second round loss to LAL
                            10: 42-40, 9th in Wet
                            11: 43-39, 9th in West
                            12: 34-32, 9th in West
                            12: 45-37, 8th in West
                            In other words, Houston was classic treadmill .... repeat, treadmill team, who acquired valuable assets via trades, FA & mid-lower picks which were flipped for elite player - all without tanking. That's transcendent GM'ing.

                            Having said that, I'm not 100% sold on Dwight-Harden as a championship core.
                            Last edited by golden; Wed Feb 26, 2014, 08:53 PM.

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                            • #74
                              golden wrote: View Post
                              In other words, Houston was classic treadmill .... repeat, treadmill team, who acquired valuable assets via trades, FA & mid-lower picks which were flipped for elite player - all without tanking. That's transcendent GM'ing.

                              Having said that, I'm not 100% sold on Dwight-Harden as a championship core.
                              Look at their young assets that surround Harden/Howard though:

                              They are all young guys who play within a system and who play for each other. You can't discredit the passion or heart in such a team, the same one which gave OKC a scare in the first round last year. This year they are bound to have a solid postseason (I have no idea what will happen in the West since all of the top 8 teams are strong), and they can continue to build around a core of Harden, Howard, Parsons, Beverely, and co.

                              I love the Rockets/Pacers/Spurs analogy to the Raptor's situation because like those teams, we are seeing a young core of selfless individuals winning games right now. This season we have the potential to play in the second round of the playoffs, and if Masaii handles this situation correctly, we can continue to grow and eventually be on a higher level 5 years from now; the same one the Spurs, Pacers, and Rockets are on today, and that is a championship contender level.

                              Great post btw Matt, I agree with you fully.
                              I know this may be a bit controversial but I think the Raptors have proven that they're the best team in the NBA from Canada
                              -random Facebook user. 2016

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                              • #75
                                YoungGunRaptor wrote: View Post

                                I love the Rockets/Pacers/Spurs analogy to the Raptor's situation because like those teams, we are seeing a young core of selfless individuals winning games right now.
                                You can't really have Spurs in there because they have relied on Tim D. for so long and they got their Big man via tanking.

                                Pacers is a different story. They are run by one of the greatest Basketball mind of past 3 decades. Getting PG that late in draft and getting guys like Stevenson in 2nd round and ... That takes real talent.

                                Does MU have such a talent ? Looking at Denver I don't know if the answer is yes or no.

                                Rockets is a very interesting case for sure. How they were able to compete but at the same time, move some of their talents and get assets ( picks and ...) it is simply amazing.

                                We will see what MU will do with Novak, Vas.2Pat and other contracts that he has in hand this summer.

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