Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 21 to 33 of 33

Thread: Jonas Valanciunas' development - offense or defense?

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Rookie Jack_Bauer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    50
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Matt52 wrote: View Post
    It happened to Hibbert, too.
    Despite being two years younger, Jonas' second season compares favorably to Hibbert's sophomore year. If he can take similar steps forward as Hibbert has on the defensive end, we will all be very giddy.

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...bero01&y2=2010

    I think the offense will eventually come from Jonas, he's shown flashes and just needs to put everything together. While I'd like to see him be a bigger part of the offense, this year will end up being good for his development. He's playing in competitive games and will soon get a taste of the playoffs.

    One area which I hope he improves is his passing. Players like Noah and MGasol keep their teams' offense humming because they are such great passers for their position. Even incorporating more dribble hand-offs can go a long way in helping the offense become more efficient.
    Last edited by Jack_Bauer; Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:14 PM.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,801
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    JV needs to fire the jumper right away if he has even a bit of space. Also he needs to develop some triple threat jab steps and shit. He could really throw guys off, with a jab step and then bury the jumper or just drive right past them.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Rookie
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    13
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I was actually looking at those +/- stats the other day and wasn't surprised that the defense is not as efficient with him on it. Part of that has to do with him getting the quick hook early in the game from Casey when things are not looking to well. He rarely gets to work through tough situations (can't say I disagree with Casey when it comes to that).

    For me he never needs to be a dominant scorer. He's probably the 3rd/4th option on this team so 11-14 points is fine. The Raptors just need him to have a presence in the paint so that opposing players think twice before putting the ball on the floor to drive it.

    Quote torch19 wrote: View Post
    JV missed a lot of games last year as a rookie (right around 30 missed games). It could be the fact that his body is not in tip top shape yet & his struggles in some games can be attributed to fatigue. The NBA season is a grind with all the travel involved & I'm sure fatigue is a factor (mental & physical). I'm happy to see that he's matched his total games played last season with a lot of games left to be played -- the Alex McKechnie factor.

    In terms of actual progression, these are his on-off splits (rookie year v sophomore year)

    From basketball-reference.com

    Rookie Year - Team Offense

    Split eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% Ortg
    On Court 0.492 24.7 73.3 49.3 57.9 7.2 8.6 17.1 104.0
    Off Court .486 25.9 73.6 49.0 60.0 8.4 7.4 13.7 107.6

    Rookie Year - Opponent

    Split eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% Ortg
    On Court .498 26.7 75.3 50.7 62.6 9.3 7.3 15.1 107.7
    Off Court .501 26.4 74.1 51.0 59.1 6.8 8.0 15.8 107.9

    Sophomore Year - Team Offense

    Split eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% Ortg
    On Court 0.503 27.7 74.4 51.2 57.8 7.0 7.4 16.4 109.1
    Off Court .473 27.6 75.5 50.6 56.8 8.5 6.4 14.0 108.7

    Sophomore Year - Opponent

    Split eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% Ortg
    On Court 0.502 25.6 72.3 48.8 60.8 8.6 7.4 15.9 108.5
    Off Court .470 24.5 72.4 49.4 56.4 7.1 7.9 18.0 102.7

    Observations

    In Jonas' rookie year, the Raptors offense is better with Jonas not playing at a rate of 3.6 points per 100 possessions while the team's defense (see: opponent table) is relatively the same -- although Jonas being on the court was better for the team at a rate of 0.2 points per 100 possessions.

    In Jonas' sophomore year, the Raptors offense is better with Jonas playing (opposite of his 1st year) at a rate of 0.4 points per 100 possessions while the team's defense is a lot better with Jonas not playing at a rate of 5.8 points per 100 possessions.

    Based on these statistics, Jonas' impact on offense has been greater than his impact on defense. Keep in mind though, we are still a net positive with Jonas playing (so it's not as if he's a liability). We just play tremendous defense with him off the court & that's a testament to how well our 2nd unit is playing. Check out Patterson's on-off splits & you will be impressed.

    We are also a better rebounding team with Jonas playing (see: TRB%) this year. His net impact in terms of TRB% is a +0.6%. It's still a plus but overall, our team is rebounding better this year than last year. If you look at ORB%, we are a much better offensive rebounding team this year compared to last & we are much better at grabbing offensive rebounds with Jonas playing than when he's not.

    Overall, I'm okay with Jonas' development. Clearly, he has a lot of work to do especially on the defensive side. But all in all, his impact when he's on the court is positive (marginally) this year as opposed to his rookie year when opponents scored at a rate of +3.7 points per 100 possessions when Jonas was on the court.

    These statistics only measure a player's impact on the team's performance but I believe there's value there because basketball is after all, a team game. What is shows is Jonas is developing his game within the framework of winning & that's pretty much what you want to see from a prospect.

  4. #24
    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, BC.
    Posts
    4,057
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'm going to be honest with each and every one of you.

    I am growing more and more disappointed with JV this season; despite improved production. He's just so slow out there, it's tough being patient when he moves like Kendrick Perkins... I thought when the Raptors drafted him, they would be acquiring an athletic, mobile big? He put on some shitty weight this off-season.

    I don't know, but in my opinion, he's moved out of the "untouchable" range. But, hey, I'm hoping it's just a really, really, really.... uhm, really, really.. really long sophomore blues/wall/jinx/whatever the damn hell we all call it.

  5. Like Nilanka liked this post
  6. #25
    Raptors Republic All-Star
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    2,376
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
    I'm going to be honest with each and every one of you.

    I am growing more and more disappointed with JV this season; despite improved production. He's just so slow out there, it's tough being patient when he moves like Kendrick Perkins... I thought when the Raptors drafted him, they would be acquiring an athletic, mobile big? He put on some shitty weight this off-season.

    I don't know, but in my opinion, he's moved out of the "untouchable" range. But, hey, I'm hoping it's just a really, really, really.... uhm, really, really.. really long sophomore blues/wall/jinx/whatever the damn hell we all call it.
    Right! That's the thing that is worrisome is he's become sooo out of shape almost even though he was suppose to get into shape. What ever weight he gained clearly wasn't good weight. He labours running up and down the floor so much this season. He also gets tired very easily. This wasn't the case in his first year. The lack of post game and defensive mistakes are one thing but his inability to keep up is hurting him big time. He needs to figure out a way to get his body together this offseason. He did not gain that weight correctly.

  7. Like OldSkoolCool liked this post
  8. #26
    Raptors Republic All-Star BigCamB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    1,449
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote GLF wrote: View Post
    Right! That's the thing that is worrisome is he's become sooo out of shape almost even though he was suppose to get into shape. What ever weight he gained clearly wasn't good weight. He labours running up and down the floor so much this season. He also gets tired very easily. This wasn't the case in his first year. The lack of post game and defensive mistakes are one thing but his inability to keep up is hurting him big time. He needs to figure out a way to get his body together this offseason. He did not gain that weight correctly.
    Exactly. If he manages to get it right, I'll be positive about his chances of being a difference maker for the raptors on both ends.

  9. #27
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Kigali, Rwanda
    Posts
    1,678
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    He's a runner by nature (based on games he's been in prior to the NBA). I'm sure the weight issues will balance out and he'll get his mobility back. I'd be nice to see him playing well in this year's playoffs, but the truth is he's more of a long term investment.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  10. #28
    Raptors Republic All-Star JawsGT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    1,315
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
    I'm going to be honest with each and every one of you.

    I am growing more and more disappointed with JV this season; despite improved production. He's just so slow out there, it's tough being patient when he moves like Kendrick Perkins... I thought when the Raptors drafted him, they would be acquiring an athletic, mobile big? He put on some shitty weight this off-season.

    I don't know, but in my opinion, he's moved out of the "untouchable" range. But, hey, I'm hoping it's just a really, really, really.... uhm, really, really.. really long sophomore blues/wall/jinx/whatever the damn hell we all call it.
    I tend to agree, he just hasn't impressed much this season and I also don't think he is untouchable. However, he would be difficult to replace, as even decent consistent big men are hard to come by, so I'm more than willing to have patience with the kid. I can't imagine that he will not make significant strides over the remainder of his rookie contract.

    But what frustrates me the most is that the team isn't doing what it needs to in order to get him involved consistently. One single post up last night that resulted in a poor shot and that was it for him. The team needs to have patience with him too, and give him the opportunity to make some mistakes in the post. Now if his defence is holy, then bench the guy I can live with that. But Jonas tends to rush his post-ups because he gets so few of them. If he knew he would be a more consistent player in the offense, I think he would be much better in the post, and be a much more willing passer out of it. And that is what this team needs more than anything, some inside-outside play that is pretty much non-existent as this point and which would help out a lot come playoff time. He needs the touches to improve, I hope the team gives him a better chance over the rest of the season.

  11. #29
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    2,654
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    One thing I've noticed is that DeMar consistently looks off him. I can't remember the last time JV got an assist form DeMar. The way opposing teams collapse on DeMar, JV is regularly in a good spot, if not to make the shot then make the assist.

  12. Like OldSkoolCool liked this post
  13. #30
    Raptors Republic All-Star stooley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    1,961
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
    I'm going to be honest with each and every one of you.

    I am growing more and more disappointed with JV this season; despite improved production. He's just so slow out there, it's tough being patient when he moves like Kendrick Perkins... I thought when the Raptors drafted him, they would be acquiring an athletic, mobile big? He put on some shitty weight this off-season.

    I don't know, but in my opinion, he's moved out of the "untouchable" range. But, hey, I'm hoping it's just a really, really, really.... uhm, really, really.. really long sophomore blues/wall/jinx/whatever the damn hell we all call it.
    The biggest difference for this team between right now and the start of january, is the play of JV. He was playing really strong for about a month, then dropped off, and has now really hit a slump.

    He's young, it all comes with the territoy.

  14. #31
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    5,970
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Alex McKechnie's had Jonas on an all-milkshake program.

    Little did he know they were supposed to be DIET milkshakes.

    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  15. Like white men can't jump, Letter N liked this post
  16. #32
    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    5,970
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default


    "I don't lie. I willfully participate in a campaign of misinformation." - Fox Mulder

  17. #33
    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    7,864
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post

    Yeah, that's pretty much what I figured. Sometimes Val hurts the team, but last night he was actually fine (the "D" was bad some times while he was on mostly because other guys were throwing the ball away and giving the Cavs easy transition opportunities)...Last night it was more just that the other guys were helping more, especially Hansbrough just having a great game down low.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •