I'm not gonna reply to the bold because it's cumbersome to have to copy paste all of it again. Next time please multi quote...
Just to make this more clear to you since you don't seem to understand why TS% is being used instead of eFG%.
Basketball Reference wrote:Basketball Reference wrote:
Yes it is. I can cherry-pick a 28 game stretch from DeRozan (Feb 1st - Mar 31st) where he averaged 24-5-5 on 55% TS. I've pointed this out already, but you have conveniently chosen to ignore it.A 30 game stretch is not "Cherry Picking"
Actually, using a 30 game stretch in an 82 game season as a measure of how good a player actually is, IS cherry-picking. If I were to evaluate DeRozan based on his 28 game stretch from the start of February to the end of March, he would measure out at somewhere near Kobe (his stats during that period are right around Kobe's career numbers). Do you see how foolish that is? Players have hot and cold stretches during the course of the season, the average of that is what matters. That's why ESPN, NBA.com, Synergy, 82Games, Basketball Reference and virtually every major sports statistics site start off by showing you season averages and not hot stretches/cold stretches.Cherry Picking entails that you choose 1 stat that tells a completely different story from the rest of the data. If you look at the whole picture you will see that Waiters is as good as DD. Yes, DD has a higher TS% (only by 2%), but Waiters has a higher eFG% (by 6%), higher 3fg%, higher AST% and the same TOV%....and yet you have the audacity to support that this ONE STAT makes DD SIGNIFICANTLY MORE EFFICIENT....
Also some of the things you're saying aren't even true. Waiters' AST% (18.4%) is not higher than DeRozan's (19.1%) and his TOV% (12.3%) is not lower than DD's (9.5%). Looking at the whole picture Waiters is not better than DD and it's not just one stat. DeRozan scores more with better efficiency, rebounds the ball better and produces points for his teammates without turning the ball over as much despite seeing regular double-teams and being the focal point of the opposing team's defence. Additionally he holds his opponent to lower PER (only really objective way to measure individual D statistically). Both players typically match up defensively against the weaker wing player so that's a wash I suppose.
I'm not your friend, and you should look in the mirror.You, my friend, are not making a very intelligent case
No that's not what I said, don't twist my words. First of all I don't think that comparison is accurate because you're talking about the majority of the season (60+ games with the Raptors) and trying to compare it to 30 games.So by your reasoning the Toronto Raptors from the first 20 games is exactly the same as the Raptors from the last ~60, because the whole data set includes those first 20 and that nothing can ever change over the course of a season......
Nevertheless I'll entertain the idea. Obviously there are huge differences in performance between the pre-Gay and post-Gay Raptors, that is obvious. And yes like you said the whole data set includes those first 20. That doesn't mean that nothing can change. Clearly something did change (ie. the Raptors record). But unfortunately I don't get to take those 60 odd games and just extrapolate them for the whole season like you're trying to do with Waiters' 30 game stretch. Yeah the Raptors are, what, 41-21 since the Gay trade? Does that mean I get to take that winning percentage, apply it to the whole season and say we're a 54-win team? No it doesn't because we still played those 18 games at the start of the season and they still count towards our record.
This is even more true for Waiters' 30 game stretch. Cool, he increased his efficiency a bit and scored at a higher rate for the last 30 games. But the previous 40+ games also count towards his performance, and at the end of the day he's going to finish the season with around a 50% TS% on around 16ppg. So in essence not only is he not scoring at a high rate, he's not even doing so efficiently despite taking more shots per 36 than players like DeRozan, Harden, Curry, etc. I'm not sure how you're going to try and justify that 15.9ppg on 14.2 shots is acceptable under any circumstance.
There isn't even any real proof that Waiters is an above average player atm. His AST%/TO% rate is below 2:1. He has extremely high usage but doesn't score efficiently with it whatsoever. His defense is average at best. He's a good 3pt shooter but they don't constitute a large enough percentage of his shots to make him an efficient scorer. He doesn't get to the line at a high rate, nor convert his free throws (68%) when he gets there. He finishes poorly at the rim. Both his oRTG and dRTG are worse than that of his team (which is atrocious in both categories). He also is known for having locker room problems, so even the intangibles aren't there.
But yet we should deal DeRozan for him because you don't like how he plays. Once again, thank God you're not Ujiri.
I've already pointed out several times that it's not large enough to define his whole season. It just means he's played well the last 30 games (just like DeRozan was basically Kobe offensively from the start of February to the end of March --- 28 games). You want to define a player's season, look at what he's done for the whole season.30 games is a large enough data set. Pretty sure this was argued at the beginning of the year with DD's 3pt shot...when he could not maintain it for 30 games and regressed to the norm.
And DD's 3PT shooting, while it did regress from the beginning of the season, isn't really at "the norm". He's shooting over 30% for the first time despite increasing his number of 3PT attempts by a large margin. He's still not at a point where he needs to be though for a 3 to be considered an effective shot for him though (33%+).
Btw with your whole 30-games being "large enough" mantra, does it matter if it's 30 consecutive games or not? Why do they have to be in order?
DeRozan - November + March:
30 Games Played
So above average 3PT shooting on over a make per game. Seems like DD has really become a great 3PT shooter based on those 30 games...