Time of the Year to evaluate these players ....

[mcHAPPY]

Agreed, need a new coaching philosophy that demands driving into the paint



I think Ross will be a very good starting SG in this league. He can get into the paint at will (look at today) and can guard. If he can get his shot down during more pressure situations he will be very good. I think this will happen if he had a larger role and took some of his lumps without Casey breathing down his neck.

I'm not a huge fan of Vasquez...only reason he should be kept is if we plan to use him as a SG 6th man. He is too ball hoggish and poor defensively to play the back up PG. I like De Colo there, just needs a little confidence restored after Casey destroyed him.



No. He has been that bad.

You want a high potential, long, athletic SF who is an advanced playmaker for the SF position....Giannis Antetokounmpo. He is my #1 target this summer and should be Ujiri's as well.

I'm a huge fan of 'Po

Only problem is I think their first round pick and he are the only untouchables on the roster.

[Puffer]

Hands for Barnes might be doable. GSW need to trade Barnes for something and they need a PF who picks up fouls and cap space. May need to add Salmons as sweetener....

How is throwing Salmons into any trade a sweetener? For the buyout? Shouldn't the Raps look to use that themselves?

[mcHAPPY]

How is throwing Salmons into any trade a sweetener? For the buyout? Shouldn't the Raps look to use that themselves?

Or attach it to another trade that saves a team salary but offers the Raptors an asset in return?

[Quirk]

Legit Starters, must keep: JV, Lowry, Amir
Passable Starters, trade at least one: TRoss, DeRozan

Key backups, keep some, trade some: 2Pat, TH, Fields
Passable backups, no problem keeping, but whatevs, trade away: GV, Hayes, De Colo, Stone, Novak

Bye bye: Salmons, Buycks

Biggest needs:

1/ Legit starting SF or SG <-- very important, wing play is the biggest weakness
2/ Nice backup C <-- pretty important, need a prototypical bruising backup 5
3/ Better backup PG <-- would be cool, GV is ok but only barely
4/ Better starting PG <-- nice to have, but we're ok with Amir, he's a legit started, but would be a great backup

I remain unconvinced about Casey, but agree that maybe another year is ok.

[Stevo]

I disagree with some of that Quirk. DD is a fine starter that's slightly one dimensional, but dudes got something that most others on the team don't; an ability to create his own shot. Despite hating iso ball, I think we gotta recognize that talent. Plus DD has improved nearly every year, so why not make changes elsewhere to set-up a better more fluid system then see if DD can react to it.

Also, GV is a good second unit facilator and MU would have to get uber creative in the trade market to upgrade on him at his price.

Trading Ross at this point also doesn't make sense. Sure there are better options on the market (free agent and trade) but at his price along with his natural raw athelitism why not develop him instead? Might take a coaching change or addition, but to trade Ross (who is on his rookie contract) when his value is low doesn't make much sense.

In addition, trading young guys with atleast average starter potential works better when that player is costing games via bad attitude or unprofessionalism, and Ross hasn't exhibited any of those traits.

While I do agree that Ross isn't likely to be the long-term solution and should be traded eventually, why not let his value go back up via improvements made from more experience and then trade him？

I am skeptical of DC's ability to develop young guys like JV and Ross though, this is true.

[Nilanka]

Yeah, we could use a better backup centre. Maybe Vasquez will demand too much salary. Maybe we need a stronger wing defender.

But what we're truly lacking is an elite offensive player. A player who demands double teams every time he touches the ball. Joe Johnson, despite his decaying carcass, is still an elite offensive player. He single handedly won this series for Brooklyn (it all started in the 3rd quarter of game 5).

Sadly, the last such player we had was Bosh.

[Quirk]

Stevo, problem is that DeRozan and Ross and both only passible starters, so if you keep DeRozan as a starter, you need to upgrade SF, wich means you need trade assets, and Ross is one. If we can acquire a legit SF and keep Ross as a backup, then that's cool. But for the team to improve, we need a real star wing in our starting line up and neither DD nor Ross are good enough.

[Stevo]

Dude, I think DD qualifies at the very least as a decent starter now. The fact that he can make his own shot as a wing player can't be understated. That's really a skill thats pretty rare now for SG's. If overused DD's iso can kill our team momentum yes, but when the opposing team has the momentum it's nice and handy to have DD's iso with a decent chance of getting on the scoreboard without worry of a turnover from making his own shot.

I don't think Ross is a starter, but my point was considering the market its too early to trade him. He'll have to be traded eventually as him and DD most likely will cancel each other out, but I can't think of a decent trade partner for Ross.

I see Ross as more of an asset that doesn't disrupt the team, just he doesn't make consistent enough contributions as a starter on a championship calibre team.

Changes are needed for the Raptors to contend though and yes I agree DD and Ross aren't likely to be superstars to bring us to the promised land.

But we're not really in a position to trade or get a max contract worthy player now are we?

And though DD's trade value is understandbly high right now, I think it'd be a blow to the team morale to trade him right now. Or maybe I just shouldn't do business because I value comrades in war as opposed to trading assets in business for profit. =)

[CalgaryRapsFan]

This core's ceiling is 2nd round at best. A significant roster overhaul is needed, in order for this team to become truly competitive. As I have all season, I remain committed to taking the long-term view with this team. Here's what I see when I look at this team:

STARTERS

C: Valanciunas
PF:
SF:
SG: Ross
PG: Lowry (ideally for $9-10M, but could accept front-loaded starting at up to $12M)

BENCH

C:
PF: Patterson/Johnson (prefer PP if traditional post-up starting PF is acquired)
SF:
SG:
PG: Vasquez & De Colo


There are lots of holes on this roster, but they don't need to be filled immediately. Between 1st round picks (2014, 2015, 2 in 2016), cap space over the next few offseasons (ie: Salmons & Hansbrough - $1M buyout, Hayes, Fields, Johnson) and potential trade assets, I trust MU to rebuild this roster far more effectively than his predecessor, while remaining far more faithful to his long-term strategy.

DeRozan made improvements this season, but I personally prefer Ross as the future starting SG. I would prefer a true starting SF over either DeRozan or Ross, and DeRozan (value & contract - for what it can return) makes much more sense as the ideal trade asset.

[Doc]

Can we merge these two threads, it is almost the same topic:
http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/forum...-these-players

Good call. I merged the two threads seeing how we're basically discussing the same time.

[Jamshid]

lolll There is no way anyone is taking Landry. Tack on another 8 million to your salary. Plus, you have to find someone to take Hayes and Novak. I think we could ship out Novak, but nobody is taking Hayes. That's now an addition 14 million. So you now have 12 million for FA. This is also assuming we ship out DD for absolutely no salary, which is absolutely not happening. Ps is sixth man on the spurs really that much of an insult when their sixth man for years has been HOF-worthy Manu?

Until you find a good trade for DD, you have about 3 million to work with- assuming you ship out Novak. PLUS you have to factor in the 1 million cap hold for a rookie. Now we're down to 2 million.

I fully agree with you said there. Can some one clear this to me: if we let all 3 contract expire by the end of next year, does this give us $14 million in Cap space for 2016 ? I have a feeling it does not but why ??

[Jamshid]

DeRozan made improvements this season, but I personally prefer Ross as the future starting SG. I would prefer a true starting SF over either DeRozan or Ross, and DeRozan (value & contract - for what it can return) makes much more sense as the ideal trade asset.

I think the discussion of Ross vs DD or Ross over DD should be put to rest after the amazing work of DD in the play offs and miserable play of Ross.

Trading DD and expecting Ross to take over will send us back 2-3 years in the SG position. This is how far behind Ross is compared to DD.

DD is very reliable SG now who is only growing and is on a very reasonable contract for what he brings in to the table.

Fans here should embrace this kid and stop the non-sense about moving him.

[Nilanka]

I think the discussion of Ross vs DD or Ross over DD should be put to rest after the amazing work of DD in the play offs and miserable play of Ross.

Trading DD and expecting Ross to take over will send us back 2-3 years in the SG position. This is how far behind Ross is compared to DD.

DD is very reliable SG now who is only growing and is on a very reasonable contract for what he brings in to the table.

Fans here should embrace this kid and stop the non-sense about moving him.

I don't think there's any doubt that DeRozan is the better player than Ross today.

But it all depends on what DeRozan can fetch in a trade.

[Jamshid]

I don't think there's any doubt that DeRozan is the better player than Ross today.

But it all depends on what DeRozan can fetch in a trade.

Tell me what do you like to get back that is worth setting us back 2-3 years in SG position, passing on a sure guy for that position, jeopardizing with the chemistry and ...

What could we possibly get back that will give us that much value ...

[magoon]

Serious question: what do the people who want to trade DeMar expect to get for DeMar? What is an acceptable return for DeMar?