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Thread: Everything Coach

  1. #441
    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    you get the impression that Casey would play them less if he wasn't mandated to play them more. He has made statements as such. I don't recall him saying they wouldn't play at all. I think that was more exaggeration for effect

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    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote 3inthekeon wrote: View Post
    Did he say "not play them at all" or did you make that up also?
    I likely made it up.
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  3. #443
    Raptors Republic Icon mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote thead wrote: View Post
    you get the impression that Casey would play them less if he wasn't mandated to play them more. He has made statements as such. I don't recall him saying they wouldn't play at all. I think that was more exaggeration for effect
    Quit making stuff up.
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  5. #444
    Raptors Republic All-Star stooley's Avatar
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    Quote thead wrote: View Post
    you get the impression that Casey would play them less if he wasn't mandated to play them more. He has made statements as such. I don't recall him saying they wouldn't play at all. I think that was more exaggeration for effect
    It seems like there was an order from above.

    But it seems like it's not so much that he was mandated to play them more, but that he was told that the goal of this year was to develop young players.

    So he's saying if developing those players didn't matter at all, he'd have rather played them less. But this wasn't the case, and very rarely is unless you're a contender or the Bucks.

    Now, either way. At least he played them a reasonable amount, and at least he's listening to advice.

  6. #445
    Super Moderator thead's Avatar
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    It was said he would be judged not on wins but the development of the team. To me that means if you don't get things out of these young guys, I'm gonna buy you a fishing pole

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  8. #446
    Raptors Republic Starter 3inthekeon's Avatar
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    I would guess it wasn't a mandate, but an agreement. MU and DC seem to have a good working relationship, so they have plenty of interaction. Both I'm sure realize what's best for the long term may not be best for the short term. Also, since Masai had approached DC about an extension, win at all costs job security wouldn't play any factor (not that the options DC had at his disposal would have taken any significant amount of playing time from the sophs anyway after the Gay trade)

  9. #447
    Raptors Republic All-Star Primer's Avatar
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    Quote stooley wrote: View Post
    It seems like there was an order from above.

    But it seems like it's not so much that he was mandated to play them more, but that he was told that the goal of this year was to develop young players.

    So he's saying if developing those players didn't matter at all, he'd have rather played them less. But this wasn't the case, and very rarely is unless you're a contender or the Bucks.

    Now, either way. At least he played them a reasonable amount, and at least he's listening to advice.
    I still think he should have played them both more. Both guys were starters who averaged less than 30 minutes (JV 28 min, Ross 27 min), with only absolute scrubs coming off the bench behind them. I'm sorry, but that makes zero fucking sense to me.

    Demar was averaging 35 minutes per game in his second year and Ross and JV should have been getting that many minutes this year. If Casey pulls this bullshit again next year when Ross and JV are in year 3 (take the fucking training wheels off) then I'll quickly be back in the forums calling for his head.

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  11. #448
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    I still think he should have played them both more. Both guys were starters who averaged less than 30 minutes (JV 28 min, Ross 27 min), with only absolute scrubs coming off the bench behind them. I'm sorry, but that makes zero fucking sense to me.

    Demar was averaging 35 minutes per game in his second year and Ross and JV should have been getting that many minutes this year. If Casey pulls this bullshit again next year when Ross and JV are in year 3 (take the fucking training wheels off) then I'll quickly be back in the forums calling for his head.
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  12. #449
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    Quote ebrian wrote: View Post
    Yea! You better show Casey you mean business!
    Haha, not show Casey himself, just show all of his supporters on the forums. I'm behind Casey for now, but fair warning, I will turn on him in a heartbeat (Game of Thrones style) if he doesn't play JV, Ross, and the 2014 1st round pick.

  13. #450
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    I still think he should have played them both more. Both guys were starters who averaged less than 30 minutes (JV 28 min, Ross 27 min), with only absolute scrubs coming off the bench behind them. I'm sorry, but that makes zero fucking sense to me.

    Demar was averaging 35 minutes per game in his second year and Ross and JV should have been getting that many minutes this year. If Casey pulls this bullshit again next year when Ross and JV are in year 3 (take the fucking training wheels off) then I'll quickly be back in the forums calling for his head.
    Well you just completely ignored the very long, thoughtful and reasonable post that I made on the last page regarding accountability and playing time.

  14. #451
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    Quote stooley wrote: View Post
    Well you just completely ignored the very long, thoughtful and reasonable post that I made on the last page regarding accountability and playing time.
    I read it, and completely disagree. I think Casey is retarding the process of JV and Ross by not letting them play heavier minutes and taking them out of games when they're on the line (e.g. the entire 4th quarter). I don't think there was any benefit at all to yanking JV for every 4th quarter all year long.

    It's like your mom calling a babysitter instead of letting you watch your little brother, even though you're 12 years old and could dunk all over the shitty babysitter (Hayes). You gotta show trust in these young guys at some point. Casey would rather wait until they're 35 years old.
    Last edited by Primer; Wed May 7th, 2014 at 12:41 PM.

  15. #452
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    I read it, and completely disagree. I think Casey is retarding the process of JV and Ross by not letting them play heavier minutes and taking them out of games when they're on the line (e.g. the entire 4th quarter). I don't think there was any benefit at all to yanking JV for every 4th quarter all year long.
    Ok well... interesting. You think accountability has 0 effect on helping a player develop I take it?

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    Quote stooley wrote: View Post
    Ok well... interesting. You think accountability has 0 effect on helping a player develop I take it?
    I don't equate sitting someone the entire 4th quarter to holding them accountable. No other coaches in the league do that shit with their star sophomores. How will they ever learn to close out games if never given the opportunity?

    My theory, just a theory, is that Casey was given more lineup control at the end of games, and the starting lineup was basically forced on him by Masai. Hence the disparity in those lineups throughout the year. I guarantee Casey's first choice was to start Salmons instead of Ross after the Gay trade.

  17. #454
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    I think it more has to do with Casey trying to develop players (playing JV and Ross decent minutes) but also trying to win games when the 4th quarter came around (playing whoever would help the team win). Worked out quite well if that was his plan. Whether this was a good plan or not, I'm not entirely sure, since 4th quarter minutes are valuable. But can't argue with the overall results of developing and winning at the same time

  18. #455
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    Quote wallz wrote: View Post
    I think it more has to do with Casey trying to develop players (playing JV and Ross decent minutes) but also trying to win games when the 4th quarter came around (playing whoever would help the team win). Worked out quite well if that was his plan. Whether this was a good plan or not, I'm not entirely sure, since 4th quarter minutes are valuable. But can't argue with the overall results of developing and winning at the same time
    Hayes wasn't out there winning games for us in the 4th, neither was Salmons. That's what makes it egregious in my eyes. The backup options off the bench were horrendous.

    Oh well, new season coming up. JV and Ross better average closer to 35 minutes per game this year. No more excuses, they're 3rd year players, not rookies.

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  20. #456
    Raptors Republic Starter 3inthekeon's Avatar
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Haha, not show Casey himself, just show all of his supporters on the forums. I'm behind Casey for now, but fair warning, I will turn on him in a heartbeat (Game of Thrones style) if he doesn't play JV, Ross, and the 2014 1st round pick.
    The only way I can see you behind Casey is with a raised battle axe in your hands (Game of Thrones style)

  21. #457
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    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    I don't equate sitting someone the entire 4th quarter to holding them accountable. No other coaches in the league do that shit with their star sophomores. How will they ever learn to close out games if never given the opportunity?

    My theory, just a theory, is that Casey was given more lineup control at the end of games, and the starting lineup was basically forced on him by Masai. Hence the disparity in those lineups throughout the year. I guarantee Casey's first choice was to start Salmons instead of Ross after the Gay trade.
    Jonas averaged 6.7 minutes per fourth quarter, out of 28.2 minutes per game. So he played almost exactly one quarter of his minutes in the fourth.

    Further, he averages far more minutes in close game situations than in blow outs.

    You just don't like Casey and I'm not sure you'd feel any different about any other coach. You see the world as black and white. If he's not with you, he's wrong. It's a lot more complicated than that, especially when we're talking about developing a young player.

    edit: Jonas also played in 25 overtime minutes this year

    edit edit: also, do you not realize how, in all of your arguments, you pin anything good on everyone except for DC? does this polar extreme not strike you as strange and unlikely?
    Last edited by stooley; Wed May 7th, 2014 at 01:29 PM.

  22. #458
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    casey is a good coach.

    players like him.


    Look at what they fucking accomplished under him.


    Anyone refuting this is an idito as it pertains to the game of basketball and how it works.

  23. #459
    Raptors Republic Veteran Bendit's Avatar
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    To be honest I was agnostic about Casey being retained...either way. MU made a good deal signing him for what is essentially a 2 year deal (team option for the 3rd) which allows for a hook if things bog down or the offense issues continue to not improve. The continuity is pretty important after the year the team had and keeping the chemistry thing going...but I am sure Masai is going to be looking for improvement not just in team personnel but coaching levels as well. I'd like DC to succeed here (he is good with the media and communicates well with the team and good guy) but his rotations, end of game situation management were numbing sometimes (I dont think they ever got the inbounds plays right the entire season!).

  24. #460
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    Default Everything Coach

    Quote Primer wrote: View Post
    Hayes wasn't out there winning games for us in the 4th, neither was Salmons. That's what makes it egregious in my eyes. The backup options off the bench were horrendous.

    Oh well, new season coming up. JV and Ross better average closer to 35 minutes per game this year. No more excuses, they're 3rd year players, not rookies.
    Yet they were a top 4th quarter team in the league. I understand questioning certain rotations, but when the team is succeeding with said rotations, there's not much value in arguing against them. I'd rather have Hansbrough in instead of Hayes, but the coaches must be pretty confident in Hayes' ability to defend if he consistently gets more minutes. My only real complaint is salmons getting minutes over fields in the playoffs, as JJ tore the defense apart when guarded by anyone other than Landry

    But with that said, I do agree with you in that those two should get more minutes next season, and im sure Casey is thinking the same thing

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