Off-Season Realistic Expectations / Predictions / probably devolve dream acquisitions

[BobLoblaw]

Gonna throw a wild card out there...

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mljnml2

Detroit gets: Salmons, Hansbrough, Novak (or some slight variation of our non-core players, ie Hayes, Fields)

Raptors get: Josh Smith

Rationale: One of Detroit's 3 starting bigs has got to go. Everyone talks about signing Monroe as a RFA, although he is a questionable fit with JV, and his defense is lacklustre. Everyone (rightfully) hates on Josh Smith, but a big part of the problem was his (foreseeably) terrible fit in that lineup. He had a very bad season, but he was a terrible fit in a disfunctional organization.

He is an elite defender versus most 3s and 4s, as well as a top-notch rim protector. He is also very good offensive player if he focuses on his strengths in transition, slashing, and in the post. That's a big if, obviously, but our strong organization and team chemistry, with leaders like Lowry, Demar, and Amir, could help in that regard.

Casey would obviously have to hold him accountable, and essentially ban all jump shots beyond 16 feet. FWIW, something like this happened in 2009-10, when Smith only took seven 3-pointers all season and finished with a FG% of .505. Last season he attempted 265 3-pointers!

Amir would move to our 3rd big, capable of backing up both Smith and JV for 20-30 minutes/night, which would limit wear and tear on his beatdown body. We could keep Patterson as our 4th big, let him walk, or S&T him for a good-value backup 5 or 3.

Detroit does this to get out of Smith's onerous contract, which obviously isn't working for them. They get cap relief from Salmons, Hansbrough buyouts, and SVG gets a little more flexibility in building his team around the killer Drummond/Monroe tandem. Also, Novak would have some appeal spreading the floor for these two young bigs. Throw in a 2nd rounder or two if needed.

Essentially, Josh Smith's stock has never been lower, but in Atlanta was a borderline all-star and legit 2-way player. In the right situation, there's no reason to think he can't regain that form. Is Toronto that right situation?

Thoughts?

I never was a fan of Josh Smith but it's pretty interesting. I think it's realistic too.

It comes down to what you prefer -- get Josh Smith now, or be more patient. Do you want to use 13.5 mil of your cap space on Josh Smith. Or wait a little and target someone else.

[yabadabayolo]

I never was a fan of Josh Smith but it's pretty interesting. I think it's realistic too.

It comes down to what you prefer -- get Josh Smith now, or be more patient. Do you want to use 13.5 mil of your cap space on Josh Smith. Or wait a little and target someone else.

It's weird, I honestly believe j smoove can bring us to the next level. He has the size and the talent to guard big small forwards and the strength to guard power forwards. And if we are just sending over dead expiring weight, that sounds amazing.

This is only true if smoove doesn't shoot threes, and that's a massive IF

[TSF]

To the Love Trade: We're not getting him. You want a better offer? Gibson+Mirotic+2014 pick. Dragic+Morris+Frye+2 1st rounders. Barnes/Thompson+Green+Lee+Future First rounder. Shoot, they'd probably prefer the high Lakers pick. But Love will not be a Raptor. Sad reality of the situation.

To the Smith Trade: Not a fan. In a vacuum, giving up those assets for Smith is wonderful. But on a team with three capable bigs, two of whom play the 4, Smith will have to spend at least a little time at the 3. Factor in that Ross is not a 3 despite all attempts to convince us to the contrary, he's going to probably start at the 3. Ugh. Now, in conjuction with a trade for a real SF, preferably sending away either Amir or 2-Pat, that's something I can get behind.

[imanshumpert]

Off-Season Realistic Expectations / Predictions / probably devolve dream acqu...

Just a useless trade

[magoon]

A Josh Smith trade as outlined is a bad idea because we're essentially repeating Detroit's problem: with Smith as a 3, we're running a front line that provides no spacing and clogs the paint, and then relying on the backcourt to provide spacing except whoops DeMar is an average three-point shooter at best so no, it's a bad idea. If we run Smith as a 4, then he works, but we have good talent at the 4 already who's more economical.

Josh Smith is a good player, but he's not a good fit for us. He'd excel on a team with heaps of three-point shooting; Golden State should be talking to Detroit about a straight-up David Lee for Smith trade if the Warriors can't land Kevin Love, Houston could send over Jeremy Lin, etc. But we're an average three-point shooting team at best.

[MACK11]

Gonna throw a wild card out there...

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mljnml2

Detroit gets: Salmons, Hansbrough, Novak (or some slight variation of our non-core players, ie Hayes, Fields)

Raptors get: Josh Smith

Rationale: One of Detroit's 3 starting bigs has got to go. Everyone talks about signing Monroe as a RFA, although he is a questionable fit with JV, and his defense is lacklustre. Everyone (rightfully) hates on Josh Smith, but a big part of the problem was his (foreseeably) terrible fit in that lineup. He had a very bad season, but he was a terrible fit in a disfunctional organization.

He is an elite defender versus most 3s and 4s, as well as a top-notch rim protector. He is also very good offensive player if he focuses on his strengths in transition, slashing, and in the post. That's a big if, obviously, but our strong organization and team chemistry, with leaders like Lowry, Demar, and Amir, could help in that regard.

Casey would obviously have to hold him accountable, and essentially ban all jump shots beyond 16 feet. FWIW, something like this happened in 2009-10, when Smith only took seven 3-pointers all season and finished with a FG% of .505. Last season he attempted 265 3-pointers!

Amir would move to our 3rd big, capable of backing up both Smith and JV for 20-30 minutes/night, which would limit wear and tear on his beatdown body. We could keep Patterson as our 4th big, let him walk, or S&T him for a good-value backup 5 or 3.

Detroit does this to get out of Smith's onerous contract, which obviously isn't working for them. They get cap relief from Salmons, Hansbrough buyouts, and SVG gets a little more flexibility in building his team around the killer Drummond/Monroe tandem. Also, Novak would have some appeal spreading the floor for these two young bigs. Throw in a 2nd rounder or two if needed.

Essentially, Josh Smith's stock has never been lower, but in Atlanta was a borderline all-star and legit 2-way player. In the right situation, there's no reason to think he can't regain that form. Is Toronto that right situation?

Thoughts?

1. Pistons are gonna want more then our trash for there better trash
2. If Masai can somehow pull this off, I wanna know who's holding the gun to SVG's head?
3.Maybe bringing J.Smith up to Canada could increase he horrendous basketball IQ?

[The Chef]

1. Pistons are gonna want more then our trash for there better trash
2. If Masai can somehow pull this off, I wanna know who's holding the gun to SVG's head?
3.Maybe bringing J.Smith up to Canada could increase he horrendous basketball IQ?

Yeah, fair enough. Looking back at this, we'd need to sweeten the pot more. It's just like the rumours that were floating around last off-season about Detroit offering garbage expirings for Rudy. His trade value had gone down, but not that much.

I wouldn't include Ross, because, as pointed out above, if we were to get Josh Smith, we'd need as much 3-point shooting on the roster as possible. I'd include a future first-rounder (not 2014), or maybe one of Patterson or Greivis in a S&T.

I think it boils down to talent. You need lots to win, and this is an opportunity to buy some serious talent at a relative bargain.
This move wouldn't give us a "complete" roster, but I'd think we'b be a few simple tweaks from being really good.

[The Chef]

A Josh Smith trade as outlined is a bad idea because we're essentially repeating Detroit's problem: with Smith as a 3, we're running a front line that provides no spacing and clogs the paint, and then relying on the backcourt to provide spacing except whoops DeMar is an average three-point shooter at best so no, it's a bad idea. If we run Smith as a 4, then he works, but we have good talent at the 4 already who's more economical.

I only do the trade if Smith is our starting 4, and Amir is moved back to the 3rd big role (c/pf). Amir is an ironman, but his body has a lot of miles on it for someone his age. I think it's in everyone's interests if we're able to play him 20-25 min.

I agree on Ross being a little undersized at the 3, but he's still young enough that he should be able to add a little more muscle and toughness aver the next few seasons. Also, my preferred use of our #20 pick in this year's draft is a big, athletic 3.

[MACK11]

Yeah, fair enough. Looking back at this, we'd need to sweeten the pot more. It's just like the rumours that were floating around last off-season about Detroit offering garbage expirings for Rudy. His trade value had gone down, but not that much.

I wouldn't include Ross, because, as pointed out above, if we were to get Josh Smith, we'd need as much 3-point shooting on the roster as possible. I'd include a future first-rounder (not 2014), or maybe one of Patterson or Greivis in a S&T.

I think it boils down to talent. You need lots to win, and this is an opportunity to buy some serious talent at a relative bargain.
This move wouldn't give us a "complete" roster, but I'd think we'b be a few simple tweaks from being really good.

Say we add Ross and our #20 for Smith and there 2014 1st?

Detroit receives: Ross, Salmons, Hayes, Raptors 2014 1st

[MACK11]

Say we add Ross and our #20 for Smith and there 2014 1st?

Detroit receives: Ross, Salmons, Hayes, Raptors 2014 1st

EDIT

Detroit Receives: Salmons, Hayes, Ross, and Raptors 2014 1st

Toronto Receives: Josh Smith and Detroit's 2014 1st

[BobLoblaw]

Yeah, fair enough. Looking back at this, we'd need to sweeten the pot more. It's just like the rumours that were floating around last off-season about Detroit offering garbage expirings for Rudy. His trade value had gone down, but not that much.

I wouldn't include Ross, because, as pointed out above, if we were to get Josh Smith, we'd need as much 3-point shooting on the roster as possible. I'd include a future first-rounder (not 2014), or maybe one of Patterson or Greivis in a S&T.

I think it boils down to talent. You need lots to win, and this is an opportunity to buy some serious talent at a relative bargain.
This move wouldn't give us a "complete" roster, but I'd think we'b be a few simple tweaks from being really good.

I don't think there's a need to add anything, and especially not 1st rounders. Josh SMith has 3 years and 40 mil + left on his contract. That's a lot even for Josh Smith at his best. And he's been playing and acting poorly. It would be completely understandable if Detroit decided to drop him for some expirings. SVG has other concerns in Detroit besides managing Josh Smith's personality for the next 3 years. Josh Smith doesn't fit SVG usual Orlando system either. And as most new GMs, SVG might want to have cap space and sign his own players.
If SVG likes and wants to keep Josh Smith, then that's it. The trade idea ends right there. If he doesn't want Smith, then there's no reason to add 1st rounders. That would be as bad as when the Knicks gave 1st rounders for Bargnani for no reason.

The big question to me is do the Raptors want Josh Smith at all. If they do, then I think this offer is fine.

PS: Detroit's rumored offer for Rudy was better than Sacramento's. No salaries past this year. Stuckey is solid for a bench player. Compare to getting Patterson for a few months and then some 7 mil+ of bad salaries for next year.

[phiLLy]

I don't think there's a need to add anything, and especially not 1st rounders. Josh SMith has 3 years and 40 mil + left on his contract. That's a lot even for Josh Smith at his best. And he's been playing and acting poorly. It would be completely understandable if Detroit decided to drop him for some expirings. SVG has other concerns in Detroit besides managing Josh Smith's personality for the next 3 years. Josh Smith doesn't fit SVG usual Orlando system either. And as most new GMs, SVG might want to have cap space and sign his own players.
If SVG likes and wants to keep Josh Smith, then that's it. The trade idea ends right there. If he doesn't want Smith, then there's no reason to add 1st rounders. That would be as bad as when the Knicks gave 1st rounders for Bargnani for no reason.

The big question to me is do the Raptors want Josh Smith at all. If they do, then I think this offer is fine.

PS: Detroit's rumored offer for Rudy was better than Sacramento's. No salaries past this year. Stuckey is solid for a bench player. Compare to getting Patterson for a few months and then some 7 mil+ of bad salaries for next year.

Though, if we took Detroit's offer, we likely would've shipped out Lowry to NYK or somewhere else, since the team would've been blown up.

Hell, DD might've even been shipped too, lol.

[JawsGT]

I'd rather have Amir than Smith. I am no fan of J. Smooth and I think the Raps should avoid him. I can see how his skill set could fit with this team, but I don't think his attitude and personality would mesh well. He seems like a lazy douche to me. If we could flip him for something of value, while only giving up non-core pieces to acquire him, then I might be more inclined to consider. But having Smith as your highest paid player and getting 30 + minutes a night has disaster written all over it IMO.

[Fully]

I think you'd have to add a little more to that deal (Hansbrough/Salmons/Novak) to get the Pistons listening, but not much. Maybe the right to swap future draft picks or something. The Smith contract has been tossed around as one of the worst in the entire league since practically the day he signed it. They just gave SVG $35 million to overhaul this thing and right now the biggest hinderance of widespread change on that roster is Josh Smith. Plus Smith doesn't appear to be a typical Van Gundy type of player. I think they're very motivated to move him this summer.

What it does for the Raptors is a completely different conversation. I have to say that I'm intrigued, but it's probably too big of a risk for Ujiri to ever consider it in the real world.

[planetmars]

I say no to Smith.. I don't like the idea of losing our cap space for him.. but I also really don't like inefficient players. After seeing Gay on the team I think that's the last thing I'd want back on the team.. another inefficient/trigger happy player.