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Thread: Patience desperately needed: Look how far Raptors have come in a year

  1. #21
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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    Why though? We already have 2Pat and Amir. I don't see why we'd want to give up either for Young.
    I don't think he is suggesting that. T.Young can play SF and we can use what we have and not using or don't have a use for, like late round picks, 2nd round picks, Hayes, Novak and Fileds expiring contracts and ... to get a guy like Young.

    It would be tough ... but that is why MU gets paid millions and has all those resources and will take our team to the next level that is attractive for Super Star FA in 2016.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic Starter Scraptor's Avatar
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    Quote enlightenment wrote: View Post
    Potential:

    Demar --> Allstar already, room to become even BETTER
    Lowry --> Possible Allstar this year, should've been last year imo
    Ross ---> Potential Star player, will reevaluate after this year
    Val ----> Potential top 3 Centre in the league. Can become perennial Allstar
    Bruno --> No limit to his potential (could be a franchise player, or a role player)
    Bebe ---> Potential defensive star

    All these potential STARS are now surrounded by serious glue (Amir, Patterson, Vasquez). The ceiling of this team, if they totally buy in on Defence this year, is really unbounded. Easily top 3 in the East, we could get 2nd seed as early as next year. Maybe even reach the NBA finals (probably not, but ECF would be likely). I see us winning 54 games this upcoming season, and the season before Durant, 56 games. We would be REALLY enticing for Durant to hop on board.
    I am as pumped about the summer as anyone but I do think we should be careful about counting our All Stars before they hatch.

    Ross caps out as a solid starter imo, which isn't a knock in any way. Not every player needs to be a star for us to have success.

    Bruno and Bebe haven't played a single minute in the NBA, so let's hold off on the hyperbole until we at least see them a little in action.

    I just don't like the backlash when these kids come in and the expectations are sky high, then when they have their inevitable struggles, people freak out and call them stiffs and useless and whatnot. For them, patience is indeed "desperately needed."

  3. #23
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    Quote Jamshid wrote: View Post
    Hahahaha, I was thinking about the same thing. I want to know what would be everyone's expectations when the dust is settled this year ... I am going to open a thread in week or two after we know where James and Melo are going and how the east looks like.

    As far as making ECF by 2016, you are 100%. We don't have to necessarily win the east but we have to have a YOUNG and TALENTED team that is able to compete at that level.

    MU has been great in getting role player but this team to make it to next level need a guy like T.Young at SF. We are not going far with the hole we have at SF.

    Organic Growth of Big Val is a an important factor as well. what he does this summer will say a lot about the type of players he is going to be and how much this team can rely on him.

    Lets see what MU will do
    A) Thaddeus Young pushes our ceiling up B) Thaddeus Young is the answer at SF? Honestly? A good stats/bad team Power Forward is the answer at SF? Seriously? If we're going to play someone out of position at SF, one of ross or demar is a much better option. If we're going to give up assets to get a talented player to raise our ceiling, it shouldn't be Thaddeus Young, even though I like his game. He wouldn't raise our ceiling. It should be for a natural small forward who offers above-average ball at both sides of the court.
    @Boymusic66

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    I see Ross' ceiling as being Wesley Matthews.

    Elite defender, athletic, can stroke the 3 like nothing and highly efficient scorer. I'd be ecstatic if he could reach that level.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar enlightenment's Avatar
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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    I am as pumped about the summer as anyone but I do think we should be careful about counting our All Stars before they hatch.

    Ross caps out as a solid starter imo, which isn't a knock in any way. Not every player needs to be a star for us to have success.

    Bruno and Bebe haven't played a single minute in the NBA, so let's hold off on the hyperbole until we at least see them a little in action.

    I just don't like the backlash when these kids come in and the expectations are sky high, then when they have their inevitable struggles, people freak out and call them stiffs and useless and whatnot. For them, patience is indeed "desperately needed."
    In my comment, Ross is not referred to as an Allstar. Star potential, but he plays SF/SG and is really hard to make the AS game in those positions. Still, the executive term is: "potential"

    Secondly, I said Bruno is really unknown potential, anywhere from franchise to role player, and I guess even to bench warmer.
    For Bebe, his block party in the summer league last year is enough to show POTENTIAL (not guarantee) of Defensive dominance.

    I don't see too many hyperboles in the comment I made.
    The Baltic Beast is unstoppable!

  6. #26
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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    A) Thaddeus Young pushes our ceiling up B) Thaddeus Young is the answer at SF? Honestly? A good stats/bad team Power Forward is the answer at SF? Seriously? If we're going to play someone out of position at SF, one of ross or demar is a much better option. If we're going to give up assets to get a talented player to raise our ceiling, it shouldn't be Thaddeus Young, even though I like his game. He wouldn't raise our ceiling. It should be for a natural small forward who offers above-average ball at both sides of the court.
    If you look at Philly games then you can se in many games he plays SF and he is quite good at it as well. He is a good defender as well and plays a smart team defence.

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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    Why though? We already have 2Pat and Amir. I don't see why we'd want to give up either for Young.
    Thad can be that big, mobile SF defender we are looking for. If we can get him for some combination of Hayes/Novak/Hands/2nd, since he hates the tank in Philly, I think he fills a need for us. Also solid insurance at the 4. Not sure how much longer our good fortune with injuries will last.

    Definitely wouldn't give up Pat or Amir for him.

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  9. #28
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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    The Croatian Dirk? He's about two years away from being ten years away.
    Ahahahaha nice twist

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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    Thad can be that big, mobile SF defender we are looking for. If we can get him for some combination of Hayes/Novak/Hands/2nd, since he hates the tank in Philly, I think he fills a need for us. Also solid insurance at the 4. Not sure how much longer our good fortune with injuries will last.

    Definitely wouldn't give up Pat or Amir for him.
    Now that is a well thought Post

  11. #30
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    Quote imanshumpert wrote: View Post
    I see Ross' ceiling as being Wesley Matthews.

    Elite defender, athletic, can stroke the 3 like nothing and highly efficient scorer. I'd be ecstatic if he could reach that level.
    That's actually a good comparison. If he can be anywhere close to Matthews in the future I would be ecstatic. Ross probably just won't be as strong and tough as Matthews is though.

  12. #31
    Raptors Republic Starter TSF's Avatar
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    Quote Jamshid wrote: View Post
    If you look at Philly games then you can se in many games he plays SF and he is quite good at it as well. He is a good defender as well and plays a smart team defence.
    No, he doesn't. He plays out wider as a spacing option on O, but he does not play SF. If you want proof, go to his basketball reference page- he's played 97-98% PF and 2-3% C for the last three years. He doesn't appreciably raise our ceiling, affect our on-court spacing, or improve our team defense in a way that sticking Ross at the 3 and letting him develop doesn't.
    @Boymusic66

  13. #32
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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    No, he doesn't. He plays out wider as a spacing option on O, but he does not play SF. If you want proof, go to his basketball reference page- he's played 97-98% PF and 2-3% C for the last three years. He doesn't appreciably raise our ceiling, affect our on-court spacing, or improve our team defense in a way that sticking Ross at the 3 and letting him develop doesn't.
    He guards the best opposing player that is usually the SF.

  14. #33
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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    No, he doesn't. He plays out wider as a spacing option on O, but he does not play SF.
    HAhahaha, never mind. I don't think you ever watched Philly play

    EDIT: Look at the explanation below He has more time and patient to explain it to you.
    Last edited by Jamshid; Fri Jul 4th, 2014 at 03:00 PM.

  15. #34
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    Quote TSF wrote:
    A good stats/bad team Power Forward is the answer at SF? Seriously? If we're going to play someone out of position at SF, one of ross or demar is a much better option.
    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    No, he doesn't. He plays out wider as a spacing option on O, but he does not play SF. If you want proof, go to his basketball reference page- he's played 97-98% PF and 2-3% C for the last three years. He doesn't appreciably raise our ceiling, affect our on-court spacing, or improve our team defense in a way that sticking Ross at the 3 and letting him develop doesn't.
    Man, Thad is the last guy I would characterize as a good stats/bad team type of player. He is a gritty, lunchpail type of player who does whatever he's asked, which includes playing the PF, a position he does not feel is his natural position. He's basically the Amir of that team when we asked Amir to play C.

    Going back to his DX scouting report: "Has prototypical tools for a small forward with his terrific size, length and lateral quickness, but has mostly been asked to defend the power forward position, which he lacks a bit of size for."

    Sticking Ross at the 3 was fine last year as we figured things out, but neither he nor Demar is going to be hold their own against Lebron or Paul George or Melo (if he goes to the Bulls).

    Like I said, we should only give up scraps for Young, and if we're not hunting elephants like Kevin Love (who we probably can't afford anyway), we need to scope out ways to improve the team as it currently stands.

    Looking out at the 2015 draft class, there aren't many options that wouldn't end up hurting our capspace for 2016 anyway. If Young exercises his option for 2015-16, fine, we have max capspace for Durant. If he doesn't we can add another piece next offseason anyway.

    Anyways, I apologize for de-railing the thread. Was just a thought.

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    Who are other SFs that we can get ?? How much you guys think Ariza will go for

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    Quote Jamshid wrote: View Post
    Who are other SFs that we can get ?? How much you guys think Ariza will go for
    Ariza isn't the money. He'll probably go to LAL LAC or Houston. Outside chance Mavs.

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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    Man, Thad is the last guy I would characterize as a good stats/bad team type of player. He is a gritty, lunchpail type of player who does whatever he's asked, which includes playing the PF, a position he does not feel is his natural position. He's basically the Amir of that team when we asked Amir to play C.

    Going back to his DX scouting report: "Has prototypical tools for a small forward with his terrific size, length and lateral quickness, but has mostly been asked to defend the power forward position, which he lacks a bit of size for."

    Sticking Ross at the 3 was fine last year as we figured things out, but neither he nor Demar is going to be hold their own against Lebron or Paul George or Melo (if he goes to the Bulls).

    Like I said, we should only give up scraps for Young, and if we're not hunting elephants like Kevin Love (who we probably can't afford anyway), we need to scope out ways to improve the team as it currently stands.

    Looking out at the 2015 draft class, there aren't many options that wouldn't end up hurting our capspace for 2016 anyway. If Young exercises his option for 2015-16, fine, we have max capspace for Durant. If he doesn't we can add another piece next offseason anyway.

    Anyways, I apologize for de-railing the thread. Was just a thought.
    Okay, fair enough. I was going based off what I'd seen in philly whenever I caught a game. I'll take the loss on this one, if we can get Young for less than a first I'm interested.
    @Boymusic66

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  20. #38
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    Quote TSF wrote: View Post
    Okay, fair enough. I was going based off what I'd seen in philly whenever I caught a game. I'll take the loss on this one, if we can get Young for less than a first I'm interested.
    How about if your first is number 19+ in the draft ??

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    Quote Jamshid wrote: View Post
    How about if your first is number 19+ in the draft ??
    Eh. I'd have to think about it. If we get rid of one or two of thr cap-clogging contracts in the deal, maybe.
    @Boymusic66

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    Quote Jamshid wrote: View Post
    MU from his time at Denver has shown to be good at moving small players and also moving stars for smaller pieces. However, in his resume, he does not signing a SUPER STAR ... Can he do it ... This team will need a Super star in a year or so to make the next step and get out of the 2nd round.
    That's Drake's job. And big Tim.

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