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Thread: Should we go all in to win now?

  1. #1
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    Default Should we go all in to win now?

    Okay so the East is at an all time weakpoint to be honest.

    Miami lost Lebron.
    Indiana lost Paul George and
    Nets lost Livingston, Paul Pierce and probably Andray Blatche
    Detroit will probably lose Greg Monroe (reports say he is leaning towards not resigning)
    Philly, Bucks, Boston, Orlando, New York, Detroit are not really in playoff contention.

    So really, only
    Chicago, Cleveland are noticabely better than us (for this season anyway)

    And I would say that we are sorta on the same page as Washington and Charlotte.

    I think its time we make a play for a true offensive star like Kevin Love that can make us a legit 55 win team out East. We should take advantage of the weak East before young tanking teams develop and get better than us

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Axel's Avatar
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    Would depend on the cost, but I would be hesitant. Love won't guarantee to resign and I wouldn't feel confident in our chances to resign him.

    Even if we were to survive the east, beating one of the top western teams in a series seems a daunting task.

    I think we should stay the course. If we can show that we are a legit competitive team this year, then maybe take a run at Love in the offseason. Better to use cap space than give up a bunch of assets (we can't compete with any of the rumoured Cavs offerings).

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    ...I think we should stay the course. If we can show that we are a legit competitive team this year, then maybe take a run at Love in the offseason. Better to use cap space than give up a bunch of assets (we can't compete with any of the rumoured Cavs offerings).
    This. With regards to Love or any other major star. Asset accumulation and consistent internal growth means that you are never in a spot where you are forced to do anything. You can allow your assets to increase in value and then pick a strategic situation to use them.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mr.Z's Avatar
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    Raps got a good thing going (for once!), don't fuck with it! Let it grow!
    "You clearly don't know who you're talking to, so let me clue you in: I am not in danger, Skyler. I am the danger. A guy opens his door and gets shot, and you think that of me? No! I am the one who knocks!"

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    In the next few days we shall see, would love to get Monroe and have him pair up with Val but don't know where Monroe will sign, the Celtics, Knicks, Wizards, or ship him to the West. I see the Eastern Conference as:

    Chicago Bulls - Lock for No1 Seed
    Cleveland Cavs - Lock for No2 Seed
    Toronto Raptors, Washington Wizards, Charlotte Hornets - Compete for the 3rd, 4th, 5th spot
    Miami Heat, Atlanta Hawks, New York Knicks - Compete for the 6th, 7th, 8th spot

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    Patience...please.

    What does the op mean by "all in"? We are already close to lux. territory. We need to ensure that last season wasnt a mirage...not just for MU but also for potential f/a looking for a good landing spot. Should we breakup the team/trade, acquire f/a...? Love is gone to Clev. and will probably resign with LBJ unless there is a PG type catastrophe there so forget about him. Durant is as remote a thought as LBJ...more than half the league are creating cap space for him/lots of competition.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote 2kfeen wrote: View Post
    Okay so the East is at an all time weakpoint to be honest.

    Miami lost Lebron.
    Indiana lost Paul George and
    Nets lost Livingston, Paul Pierce and probably Andray Blatche
    Detroit will probably lose Greg Monroe (reports say he is leaning towards not resigning)
    Philly, Bucks, Boston, Orlando, New York, Detroit are not really in playoff contention.

    So really, only
    Chicago, Cleveland are noticabely better than us (for this season anyway)

    And I would say that we are sorta on the same page as Washington and Charlotte.

    I think its time we make a play for a true offensive star like Kevin Love that can make us a legit 55 win team out East. We should take advantage of the weak East before young tanking teams develop and get better than us
    If he doesn't play in Detroit it is Detroit's choice... unless he plays in another league. The leverage he has is signing qualifying offer and becoming UFA next year. Either way he plays in Detroit if they want him to.


    And what core pieces will remain to get Love?
    And what happens if and when he walks next summer?


    Bendit nailed it - patience.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

  10. #8
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    We've worked our way in a middling situation.
    Lowry will get worse as he gets older, considering he has a lot of mileage, and his style of play isn't sustainable.
    Boston, Orlando, Philly, Washington will take strides in the next few seasons as their young players prosper.

    DD is great, and he's a keeper, but Ross and JV will have to really take strides in the next few seasons to take us to the next level.
    Free agency is not a strength of ours, so it will be tough to get a Durant type guy.

    We should go for a sign and trade for Greg Monroe, that can help us at PF with Amir + 1st going I guess.
    We could also go for Love, Masai could give up 2-3 rounders, Amir, and a couple of 2nds for Kevin Love and a bad contract,

  11. #9
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer mcHAPPY's Avatar
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    Quote 2kfeen wrote: View Post
    We've worked our way in a middling situation.
    Lowry will get worse as he gets older, considering he has a lot of mileage, and his style of play isn't sustainable.
    Boston, Orlando, Philly, Washington will take strides in the next few seasons as their young players prosper.

    DD is great, and he's a keeper, but Ross and JV will have to really take strides in the next few seasons to take us to the next level.
    Free agency is not a strength of ours, so it will be tough to get a Durant type guy.

    We should go for a sign and trade for Greg Monroe, that can help us at PF with Amir + 1st going I guess.
    We could also go for Love, Masai could give up 2-3 rounders, Amir, and a couple of 2nds for Kevin Love and a bad contract,
    Bold: In less than a season!

    I don't mean to come off as disrespectful but Ross and JV are 23 and 22. They are just getting going.

    You talk about other teams but the same holds true for Toronto. People might be a bit shell shocked by Bruno but this is a kid who even next year will be younger than most freshmen drafted who happens to have superstar physical abilities and potential superstar talent. Instead of being in an NCAA program he is going to be spending his 'freshmen' year with the absolute best training, coaching, and practice situations. He is going to be playing against inferior NBA talent but superior NCAA talent in the D-League with NBA rules.

    That offer for Love is nothing compared to Cleveland.
    And then what if he leaves as UFA next summer?


    Back to original bold: patience.
    "Championships are what we live for, now lets go win them."
    Tim Leiweke

    Basketball has clear winners every night --
    except at the draft, which is all homework, politics and chance.

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  13. #10
    Raptors Republic Starter Demographic Shift's Avatar
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    Quote 2kfeen wrote: View Post
    Okay so the East is at an all time weakpoint to be honest.

    Miami lost Lebron.
    Indiana lost Paul George and
    Nets lost Livingston, Paul Pierce and probably Andray Blatche
    Detroit will probably lose Greg Monroe (reports say he is leaning towards not resigning)
    Philly, Bucks, Boston, Orlando, New York, Detroit are not really in playoff contention.

    So really, only
    Chicago, Cleveland are noticabely better than us (for this season anyway)

    And I would say that we are sorta on the same page as Washington and Charlotte.

    I think its time we make a play for a true offensive star like Kevin Love that can make us a legit 55 win team out East. We should take advantage of the weak East before young tanking teams develop and get better than us
    We are not desparate for a player like Love. Don't misconstrue that for not wanting to have him but we are in a position to determine the price we would be comfortable to pay and not gut our roster to have Love and some but not enough help around him to win the ECF in 2014-15. Only Ujuri knows what the personel price he can afford to pay for Love is right now and lets assume we pass and Love either languishes in Minny till the trade deadline and then moves back to the west coast (LA or GSW) OR Cleveland goes all in within the next 30 days and offers up Wiggins plus Bennett plus a pick and makes the move to win this year.

    Regardless of how the love story plays out this still leaves us as the third or fourth team in the east with the real prospect of organic growth this year and some folding money for an FA next season that moves us another rung up the ladder and improves our chance of winning the East outright in 2015-16. We will be top 4 this year and hopefully top 2 or 3 the following season.

    I think we watch the Love drama unfold and not play a speaking part in its outcome and feel pretty good about it.

  14. #11
    Raptors Republic Starter OptimalOptimist's Avatar
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    Our contention window should be in 3-4 years, depending on Klow situation as the other starters should be here (counting 2Pat as a starter).
    Myself (March 2014):
    The raptors are a tremendous young team and will win a championship in the following five years.

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    Quote OptimalOptimist wrote: View Post
    Our contention window should be in 3-4 years, depending on Klow situation as the other starters should be here (counting 2Pat as a starter).
    I think we are closer than two years away from being two years away

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    Why not wait until next year? You've got some big expirings (Fields, Hayes, Hansbrough, Lou), so you can make a big splash on the free agent market without harming your core starting five (I'm assumign Amir will be re-signed for 10M+/yr) and top two bench players.

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    By the time we are anywhere close to contending, Ross & JV will have to get re-upped, DD will look for that max and we will be out of cap space.
    Big man who are coordinated enough to tie their shoes will get paid, and a 3&D like Ross should command 7 mil+.
    Unless we can go out and sign someone in 2015, and then extend these guys, are you ready for a future like that?

    History has shown that winning teams have one concrete star that they can contend with, another star who knows their role as a #2, and bench pieces.

    Usually that #1 option comes from draft or trade, and the other pieces come from F/A

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    Weak Atlantic means we can give Bebe and Bruno minutes without dropping below 4th in the Playoff seeding. For the foreseeable future we can develop players and compete without mortgaging the future. Sooner or later Celtics , NYK and 76ers will be competitive and having assets ready will be an advantage.

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    Patience, even if there is a larger chance to get to the finals, I don't see a move that makes us a lock for them or even the ECF. An injury or another team having a ridiculous year closes that window for us. It's not worth the risk. I'd rather

    Free agency is risky for everyone. Houston already has two superstars, space to sign a max player, a great location... basically all things we used to say you needed in order to sign big name free agents. They missed out on Melo, Lebron, and even the home town kid, Chris Bosh. The only knock against Houston, would be that they didn't have the "right" two superstars, but you can't split hairs that thin. I'd rather trade for an impact player with over a year on their contract, or try to sign them in free agency, yeah it's a crap shoot, but it's a crap shoot for everyone.

    We aren't good enough to try to give up assets to "win now".

    JV and Ross need a year or to more of development time, that's when you look at going all in.
    Last edited by ezz_bee; Tue Aug 5th, 2014 at 06:35 AM.
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