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Thread: Why do Raptors fans think we are better than Wizards and Hornets?

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    Default Why do Raptors fans think we are better than Wizards and Hornets?

    Wizards are better than us at almost every position, except for SG. If they are healthy, I think they are 48 - 50 wins easy.

    Wall > Lowry.
    Pierce & Porter (whos looking much better) > Ross & JJ
    Nene is a great big man, and if he and Humphries say healthy, than > Amir & 2Pat
    The Polish Hammer >>> JV

    Their bench isn't as great as ours, but they really abuse us in these matchups.


    Then there's Hornets.
    We got no answer for Big Al in the middle, and their frontcourt takes advantage of us.
    MKG can do a good job on Derozan, and they have a lot of firepower coming from Kemba, Henderson, and now Stephenson.

    Do you think we are a 5th-6th seed at best?
    As time goes on and young teams develop and we lose ground, is it worth it to stay a middling, treading team?

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    Raptors Republic Starter Demographic Shift's Avatar
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    Quote 2kfeen wrote: View Post
    Wizards are better than us at almost every position, except for SG. If they are healthy, I think they are 48 - 50 wins easy.

    Wall > Lowry.
    Pierce & Porter (whos looking much better) > Ross & JJ
    Nene is a great big man, and if he and Humphries say healthy, than > Amir & 2Pat
    The Polish Hammer >>> JV

    Their bench isn't as great as ours, but they really abuse us in these matchups.


    Then there's Hornets.
    We got no answer for Big Al in the middle, and their frontcourt takes advantage of us.
    MKG can do a good job on Derozan, and they have a lot of firepower coming from Kemba, Henderson, and now Stephenson.

    Do you think we are a 5th-6th seed at best?
    As time goes on and young teams develop and we lose ground, is it worth it to stay a middling, treading team?
    Can't see it with the Whiz

    Wall > to = with Lowry...
    Beal << to Derozan.. Derozan is a carded Allstar and will make the US whatever team this is vs Beal
    Pierce >= with Ross.. one on the way down the other on the way up.. they should be equal over the mean
    Nene >= to Amir (who starts) .. but Nene is injury prone and Amir will be on the floor longer.. again likely equal over the mean
    Gortat > JV... Gortat right now is better than JV

    Raps bench >>>>> Whiz bench.... and this is why we are better team... you have to sub out your guys for at least 12 to 15 minutes and we will club the whiz bench again this year.


    Charlotte has a better 5 right now than we do with Big Al vs JV.. after that....
    MKG is approaching bust status.. his jump shot mechanics are brutal at best
    Kemba Walker is not the player Lowry is
    Lance Stephenson will work his team busting chemistry on this impressionable squad before too long.. He is going to want the ball more than Walker and Jefferson... kaboom about December...
    Gerald Hendeson .. yawn
    Noah Vonleh is a raw rookie.. he is in the same class as Bebe & Bruno... but has had the benefit of being an American with the hype machine behind him...
    Charlotte is better than last year's 8th place finish.. by perhaps 1 rung...

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    1) You're not the only person to make this mistake but the Raptors only need to worry about being better than 4 teams if they want to secure a top four seed in the East - the Knicks, Nets, Celtics and Sixers. Unless you think the Knicks or Nets can win the Atlantic then the Raptors won't be a 5th or 6th seed.

    2) Your point about the Raptors losing ground to young + developing teams doesn't really make sense. All three of Charlotte, Washington and Toronto have key young pieces that are still on the come up and all three have key pieces that are either entering or currently in the middle of their prime. However, of those three the Wizards are the most reliant on guys who are on the downslope of their careers (Pierce, Nene, Hump).

    All three teams should be pretty close in record this season.

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    I think most of our fans value the chemistry of the raps over teams over individual talent

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    Raptors were 3-1 vs Wizards and won by 10+ in the wins and lost in 3 OT because of a fluke OReb. Hornet won all 3 head to head games all close including a game when Raptors were shorthanded because of the Gay trade. Within the conference Raps will finish at least fourth and Wizards, Hornets, Heat, Atlanta will have to play each other within the division. Toronto matches up well really well against the Wiz

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    Raptors Republic Starter YoungGunRaptor's Avatar
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    What about chemistry?

    Around the trade deadline last year, I felt like people were hyping up the Pacers to become the next great dynasty with the additions of Evan Turner and Bynum. But they absolutely imploded and, despite making it to the ECF, they failed exactly at the moment they were supposed to succeed in: beating the Heat and getting to the finals.


    I love our team right now because of the characters and the selflessness that each of them display. They developed a culture, an attitude of playing with passion, and it reflected with the Raptors going 42-22 after the Rudy Gay trade.

    So why not? The Hornets and Wizards are great, but honestly, they were good last year as well. The Raptors still pulled of a 3-1 series win vs. the Wizards, but always came up short vs. the Hornets. Knowing this team, I highly doubt Lowry and Derozan will go into any game vs. the Hornets without knowledge of that fact, and they will lead the team to victory.

    What I truly love the most about the Raptors is the fact that they continue to grow as players, and I am expecting bigger and better things from our young guns next season.
    “You can sink and drown, or you can float, and we out here like Michael Phelps."


    Demar Derozan

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    Raptors Republic Veteran rocwell's Avatar
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    We got Casey bruh. Don't mess with Kentucky guys

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    How could u possibly say that pierce is better than Ross at this point? Pierce was effective at the 4 but was a COMPLETE NIGHTMARE at the 3!!!!! Does anyone else not remember how god awful the nets were before they moved Pierce to the 4?? And now in Washington he's playing the 3 again. Also really? Otto fcking Porter? What has he done besides a decent showing at shitty ass summer league? Give me a break.

    If the wiz kept Ariza and had pierce coming off the bench they'd be close to us. But like this? Helllllll no

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Miekenstien's Avatar
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    i don't see it either. two teams we were better than last year that didn't get better but somehow both supplant us?
    chewbacca is a wookie. wookies do not live on endor.

    lot's of people on this site go opposites on the issue of internal development, either we get better and no one else improves or like this thread, they get better and we don't improve.

    we have just as many young players in prominent roles with potential as either of these teams. we have a top 10 player(last year lowry).
    For The Win

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    Raptors Republic All-Star stooley's Avatar
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    simple answer:

    we were better than both teams last year.

    we haven't added anyone new, and i think all the wizards' moves combined hold them about even.

    lance stephenson is a wild card. i think he helps them improve, but starting zeller at PF will hurt too, and their team seriously lacks spacing.
    "Bruno?
    Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
    He's terrible."

    -Superjudge, 7/23

    Hope you're wrong.

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    Raptors Republic Starter S.R.'s Avatar
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    Most discussion I've seen around here has recognized the similar trajectories of the Horncats and the Whizzards. Don't think many are assuming the Raps are ahead of these teams by much. A couple key injuries last year and the Raps could have just as easily finished 7th.

    All that said, the East is gonna be fun this year. I'm glad the ECF is up for grabs.

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    Wall and Beal complement eachother very well, but so do Derozan and Lowry. I don't think there is a GM on the planet that would take Lowry over Wall at this stage of their careers.

    The Wizards are solid. I don't value Nene or Gortat over JV and Amir that much but I think they have much more solid, experienced depth up front. Even Pierce has proven that his size can be still be a problem for a lot of 3s.

    To me, the Wizards and Raptors are pretty much even. I do think the minor moves we made will improve our bench significantly but we are going to be be punished for not having a big bruising center off the bench

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    Quote stooley wrote: View Post
    simple answer:

    we were better than both teams last year.

    we haven't added anyone new, and i think all the wizards' moves combined hold them about even.

    lance stephenson is a wild card. i think he helps them improve, but starting zeller at PF will hurt too, and their team seriously lacks spacing.
    PJ Hairston and Lance wing tandem will be good enough in terms of Spacing issues. Yes, PJ is rookie but be minded dude was playing in the D League last year and was tearing it apart. he is way ahead of other rookies when it comes to adjusting to the game speed and the NBA grind. But if PJ's knucklehead clashes with Lance's knucklehead, then there goes it all for the Hornets. LOL.

    i think they will be a drama filled team to watch next season. much more drama than the INDIANA team from last year.

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    ALSO, is it just me or what? the comming season seems like the most "i cant wait till the season start" season EVER. i mean, I CANT WAIT FOR THE SEASON TO START, FURRREAL!

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    I'm looking forward to the 2017 lockout. Constant unsubstantiated tweets on labor negotiations are cool.

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    I'm not sure the Raptors are better than the Wizards or Hornets. We are definitely going to get the 4th or higher (because of the titanic division) but in terms of records I think that all 8 playoff teams (sorry was counting Pacers... I guess that leaves 7) are going to be ridiculously close in terms of season records. The only two teams who have a chance at distancing themselves from everyone else are the Cavs and Bulls, but the Cavs need to incorporate Lebron with their young guys (or Love and Lebron) and Chicago needs to incorporate Rose. If those two teams take a month or two to start rolling, the East could be a delicious blood bath.

    I think that all of these team's have a realistic shot of ending up with the 3rd best W-L records

    Chicago (underachieves)
    Cavs (Underachieves)
    Raps (Meets Expectation)
    Wiz (Meets Expectation)
    Hawks (Meets Expectation)
    Hornets (Meets Expectation)
    Heat (Meets Expectation)
    Indy (unfortunately the George injury drops them out of contention for the 3rd seed, and probably out of the playoffs altogether).

    I think that all of those 5 teams are expecting to have the 3rd best record in the East.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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    Quote YoungGunRaptor wrote: View Post
    What about chemistry?

    Around the trade deadline last year, I felt like people were hyping up the Pacers to become the next great dynasty with the additions of Evan Turner and Bynum. But they absolutely imploded and, despite making it to the ECF, they failed exactly at the moment they were supposed to succeed in: beating the Heat and getting to the finals.
    Nobody, and I mean NOBODY was hyping the Pacers as a dynasty. A bunch of people (myself included) had the Pacers as the slight favourite win the Eastern Conference, but getting to the Finals is a FAR cry from a dynasty. And those of us who had the Pacers as a slight favourite didn't have them their because of Turner and Bynum. They were there because they played the Heat to 7 games in the previous post-season, their core players were younger and still on the uptick (with the exception of David West), whereas the Heat were older and didn't get better in the off-season (they lost Mike Miller, and all their old men were one year older), that fact is what explains the difference between a hotly contested 6-7 game finals (last year) and a quick destuction in 5 games (this year). A lot of people question the Bynum decision (although I liked it because it kept the Heat from getting him). And pretty much everyone was skeptical of the Turner for Granger move (including me) although Granger didn't seem to do a whole lot for the Clippers.


    Quote bryan colangelo wrote: View Post
    Wall and Beal complement each other very well, but so do Derozan and Lowry. I don't think there is a GM on the planet that would take Lowry over Wall at this stage of their careers.

    The Wizards are solid. I don't value Nene or Gortat over JV and Amir that much but I think they have much more solid, experienced depth up front. Even Pierce has proven that his size can be still be a problem for a lot of 3s.

    To me, the Wizards and Raptors are pretty much even. I do think the minor moves we made will improve our bench significantly but we are going to be be punished for not having a big bruising center off the bench
    100% agreed. Although, if your were playing the hypothetical one year and one year only game, I think the league would be pretty split on which PG they wanted. I wouldn't even be surprised if more of them took Lowry. It's a toss up between who was better in the regular season (although Lowry's stats are slightly better in overall), but if you compare how they did in the playoffs it's a no contest. Not only does Lowry destroy him in the stats department, for those of us who watched the games it was obvious that Lowry was our main guy; whereas, John Wall was a huge negative in several stretches of important games. Now it was Wall's first playoffs so it's expected. Two years from now Wall will be the better player for sure, but unless Lowry was playing for a contract (and why come back to the Raps if all he was looking for was the pay day?) I think there's a good chance he out plays Wall again this year.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

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    Raptors Republic Starter OptimalOptimist's Avatar
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    Quote S.R. wrote: View Post
    Most discussion I've seen around here has recognized the similar trajectories of the Horncats and the Whizzards. Don't think many are assuming the Raps are ahead of these teams by much. A couple key injuries last year and the Raps could have just as easily finished 7th.

    All that said, the East is gonna be fun this year. I'm glad the ECF is up for grabs.
    A couple key injuries to any starters on the Hornets or the Wiz would have the same effect...

    Lowry is currently better than Wall. Wall couldn't shoot for shit vs the Pacers as they sag off him and he was more of a negative than a positive. He will sort things out, but Lowry is overall better than Wall as of now.

    Lowry > Wall
    Demar > Beal
    Ross = Pierce
    Amir = Nene, one is better on offense, the other on defense.
    JV < Gortat, Although that could change soon as JV is improving and Gortat is aging.
    Myself (March 2014):
    The raptors are a tremendous young team and will win a championship in the following five years.

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    Quote ball4life wrote: View Post
    PJ Hairston and Lance wing tandem will be good enough in terms of Spacing issues. Yes, PJ is rookie but be minded dude was playing in the D League last year and was tearing it apart. he is way ahead of other rookies when it comes to adjusting to the game speed and the NBA grind. But if PJ's knucklehead clashes with Lance's knucklehead, then there goes it all for the Hornets. LOL.

    i think they will be a drama filled team to watch next season. much more drama than the INDIANA team from last year.
    NBA needs a Hard Knocks TV show.

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    You are assuming no growth in DD , PP, TRoss and JV . Nene always sustains injury. Gortat reached his peak. Wall and Beal are talented- but consistency is not guaranteed. Paul Pierce is a scorer but will play 22 minutes and who knows about Porter's NBA game

    Time will tell

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