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  • #31
    allintheeyes wrote: View Post
    You can have him play just as many minutes, but mostly against weaker competition, so that:
    A) his defense is less of an issue
    B) he can face weaker defenders and score even more points

    Our starters are a P&R unit, and DeRozan doesn't fit in all that well: he can't space the floor and he's a bit of a ball-stopper. I'd rather see his ability to create for himself put to use when we don't have as good P&R personnel on the floor, guys like Hayes and Hansbrough.
    Isn't the idea next season to have Demar or Lou on the floor as much as possible but not together. Both play the mid-range and handle the ball. JJ and Patterson together for spacing with Ross or GV. Any lineup with Lou+Demar+JJ+Amir+JV has no spacing at all. This is Casey's starting 5

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    • #32
      allintheeyes wrote: View Post
      You can have him play just as many minutes, but mostly against weaker competition, so that:
      A) his defense is less of an issue
      B) he can face weaker defenders and score even more points

      Our starters are a P&R unit, and DeRozan doesn't fit in all that well: he can't space the floor and he's a bit of a ball-stopper. I'd rather see his ability to create for himself put to use when we don't have as good P&R personnel on the floor, guys like Hayes and Hansbrough.
      This is all fine in theory but you are asking for locker room trouble and leaguewide mocking if you put our only all-star on the bench. It sends a terrible message that after all his hard work and eventual recognition we would demote him, even if you try to justify it with the minutes argument.

      If you care that much about his deficiencies then you trade him, simple as that.

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      • #33
        Scraptor wrote: View Post
        This is all fine in theory but you are asking for locker room trouble and leaguewide mocking if you put our only all-star on the bench. It sends a terrible message that after all his hard work and eventual recognition that we would demote him, even if you try to justify that with the minutes argument.

        If you care that much about his deficiencies then you trade him, simple as that.
        The question wasn't "who would you trade?"

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        • #34
          allintheeyes wrote: View Post
          Lowry, Ross, Johnson, Johnson. Valanciunas

          I think DeRozan would be more effective off the bench... 6man of the year
          But would our team? This starting lineup has horrible spacing, one of the worst combos in that sense from all the realistic possibilities the Raps could trot out. It also has just one ballhandler in Lowry. So the D will just load up on him and make it very hard for anything to work.

          DeMar is a starter, and making the starting unit significantly worse to make DeMar's life slightly easier is a horrible idea. That's also assuming there's enough ball to go around for GV, Lou and DeMar in a 2nd unit, not to mention Pat also getting his share of shots.

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          • #35
            S.R. wrote: View Post
            This would probably be the only time in the history of the NBA that a team used their only All-Star as a 6th man in order to give him softer match-ups.
            It's so ridiculous, summer time brings out some pretty awful ideas. Trade deadline and free agency are up there too. But I think summer might take the cake.

            While we're at it why not start Vasquez too and have Lowry and DD come off the bench! We'd DOMINATE every teams back ups. Brilliant.
            Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
            Because its 2015

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            • #36
              Same starting line-up as last year. It's shown to work, and keeps the continuity that was developed. It also gives fewer adjustments as players like Vasquez and PatPat can play solid minutes together.

              Amir can stay in the starting line-up, and keep his minute total down too. Would allow him and Patterson to split minutes at PF. With the new depth at wing (Williams and Johnson), the Raptors can also afford to limit DeRozan as well. No reason for him to be among the league leaders in minutes again this year.
              http://twitter.com/m_shantz

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              • #37
                Rosters are fluid organisms to start the season while coach figures out a rotation. The season will likely begin with the same starting 5 as last year: KL, DD, TR, AJ, JV

                I suspect everyone will get some burn for the first couple of weeks, but the rotations will settle on PP/GV/LW as major bench contributors.
                Welp, that sucked.

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                • #38
                  sorry if i offend anyone but anybody suggesting that Demar not start is plainly whacked. You cant have a player starting one year, becomes an all-star, and then coming of the bench the next, specially if he hasnt done anything to deserve the demotion (insert "why allen iverson? rant here". lowry, demar, jv are clear cut starters IMO.

                  Ross, id also make a starter, not because he deserves it yet, but because his development is more important than him "deserving" the spot. JJ would probably make the team better if he started, but it probably wouldnt be as far off as Ross starting.

                  I'd also move Ross to SG on defense and let Demar guard the SF. Demar needs to learn to handle the top guys. Lebron is always looking to guard durant or paul. Durant wants to guard James. Its time for Demar to take his defense to the next level and guard the elite. plus, demar is bigger and stronger than ross, he should learned to handle the load on both ends.

                  Amir, id probably sit. As everybody alluded to, health is a factor. less minutes he plays in the reg season the better for the raptors come playoff time. also, hes the perfect candidate to move to the 6th spot. hes the quintessential pro, always about team, never sulks. i doubt this point in his career he's still concerned about starting or not. i may be wrong, but my take on him is whatever he can contribute to a raps win, he'll be all for it, whether he starts or not. plus, his numbers dont falter whether he comes off the bench or not, and the intesity and hustle are always there.

                  Therefore, Lowry/Ross/Demar/2Pat/JV

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                  • #39
                    TheGloveinRapsUniform wrote: View Post
                    sorry if i offend anyone but anybody suggesting that Demar not start is plainly whacked. You cant have a player starting one year, becomes an all-star, and then coming of the bench the next, specially if he hasnt done anything to deserve the demotion (insert "why allen iverson? rant here". lowry, demar, jv are clear cut starters IMO.

                    Ross, id also make a starter, not because he deserves it yet, but because his development is more important than him "deserving" the spot. JJ would probably make the team better if he started, but it probably wouldnt be as far off as Ross starting.

                    I'd also move Ross to SG on defense and let Demar guard the SF. Demar needs to learn to handle the top guys. Lebron is always looking to guard durant or paul. Durant wants to guard James. Its time for Demar to take his defense to the next level and guard the elite. plus, demar is bigger and stronger than ross, he should learned to handle the load on both ends.

                    Amir, id probably sit. As everybody alluded to, health is a factor. less minutes he plays in the reg season the better for the raptors come playoff time. also, hes the perfect candidate to move to the 6th spot. hes the quintessential pro, always about team, never sulks. i doubt this point in his career he's still concerned about starting or not. i may be wrong, but my take on him is whatever he can contribute to a raps win, he'll be all for it, whether he starts or not. plus, his numbers dont falter whether he comes off the bench or not, and the intesity and hustle are always there.

                    Therefore, Lowry/Ross/Demar/2Pat/JV

                    I agree with almost everything, except for Amir. Just because he starts doesn't mean he has to play a lot of minutes. I would rather keep him as a starter for now. Depending on how the season develops, you could imagine 2Pat taking over this role. But, I think you have to give Amir the start at the beginning of the season.
                    Welp, that sucked.

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                    • #40
                      Having thought about it a bit more, I would actually vouch for Amir in the starting lineup.

                      I agree with the point about continuity, and that means sticking with what has worked. Amir can start, but Patterson can still be the 6th man and play heavy minutes for the team.

                      I think that Amir completes the starting lineup. He does all of the small things that need to be done, especially on the defensive end. He is still the defensive anchor of this team alongside Lowry.

                      On the offensive end, he crashes the boards aggressively and is so efficient in the paint. He may or may not be working on his jumpshot, but if he is, that is a huge plus.

                      I'm still concerned about his health, and I would love to see a healthy roster that is primed for spring time basketball. Especially in Amir's case, since he is so valuable to this team.

                      Amir can start, but the minutes can definitely be split up evenly between him and Patterson. We also have Hansbrough, although I suspect he will play minutes at the 5 spot.
                      I know this may be a bit controversial but I think the Raptors have proven that they're the best team in the NBA from Canada
                      -random Facebook user. 2016

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                      • #41
                        I think eventually like probably next season the starting gig will be 2pat's but for now u gotta stick with Amir
                        #BringBackUzoh

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                        • #42
                          So much disrespect for amir. Of course you have to go back to him, not to mention he's still a better all around player than Patrick Patterson when healthy. As long as he quits shooting 3s and crashes the boards id still put a healthy amir as one of the 3 most important players on the team. He was nowhere near healthy in the Brooklyn series, so they definitely need to monitor his minutes.
                          9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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                          • #43
                            KeonClark wrote: View Post
                            So much disrespect for amir. Of course you have to go back to him, not to mention he's still a better all around player than Patrick Patterson when healthy. As long as he quits shooting 3s and crashes the boards id still put a healthy amir as one of the 3 most important players on the team. He was nowhere near healthy in the Brooklyn series, so they definitely need to monitor his minutes.
                            I don't think that people are advocating for Amir to come off the bench due to any disrespect. In fact, I think its because everyone knows how valuable he is to the Raptors' success. Remember, he was having the game of his life in Game 7 of the Nets-Raps series until fouls(refs) took him out of the game. Until Lowry and (partially) Demar came alive in the 4th, Amir was the best Raptor player on the floor.

                            And yes, the key to this discussion is Amir's health, and that should be the priority. We are deep at the 4 spot, and if Amir needs to rest, we do have Patterson and Hansbrough as backups. Nonetheless, the objective should be to enter the postseason with a healthy squad.
                            I know this may be a bit controversial but I think the Raptors have proven that they're the best team in the NBA from Canada
                            -random Facebook user. 2016

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                            • #44
                              Patterson has missed 28 games over the past two seasons. Amir has missed 6.

                              I'm all for preserving Amir's health and splitting the minutes close to down the middle but you can do that without taking Amir out of the starting line up that achieved so much success last season after the Rudy Gay trade. If the first 20 games plays out and you need to make a move… do it then. You don't just swap guys in and out of the starting line up on a whim when it's not broken.
                              Last edited by Fully; Wed Aug 13, 2014, 09:29 PM.

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                              • #45
                                Fully wrote: View Post
                                Patterson has missed 28 games over the past two seasons. Amir has missed 6.

                                I'm all for preserving Amir's health and splitting the minutes close to down the middle but you can do that without taking Amir out of the starting line up that achieved so much success last season after the Rudy Gay trade. If the first 20 games plays out and you need to make a move… do it then. You don't just swap guys in and out of the starting line up on a whim when it's not broken.
                                Just because Amir played more games, doesn't mean he was healthy that entire time. The number of games that Amir has played through what appear to be badly twisted ankles or other ailments...incredible! The man feels super human in how he deals with injury, but his impact isn't what nearly what it is when he is fully healthy.
                                http://twitter.com/m_shantz

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