Dion Waiters to skip national anthems because of his Muslim faith??

[Uncle_Si]

Similarly, I hate when the Raps where their camo alternates. Other the fact that they're ugly as fuck, the subtle Orwellian military propaganda makes me sick.

You probably hate remembrance day too don't you? The world is an imperfect place, and there are men and women that are willing to sacrifice their lives for your freedom. So you go ahead say what you will against the military, but remember as you're saying it that someone sacrificed their life to give you that right.

[Uncle_Si]

There's nothing in Islam that says we shouldn't stand up for the anthem, it's just some more B.S that these reporters love to spew.
There's nothing to see here

You're right there is nothing. Most Muslims do stand for the American anthem or whatever the anthem is in the country they are in. The problem is, the ones that don't and cite their religion as the reason are likely ATLEAST of the mindset more similar to those of anti-western views. That's the issue.

[Apollo]

Similarly, I hate when the Raps where their camo alternates. Other the fact that they're ugly as fuck, the subtle Orwellian military propaganda makes me sick.

I missed this bit. I think you're letting your imagination take control a little bit here. The Raptors wear those in support of the troops(and not 'Big Brother'). Whether you support where they are or who they're fighting, you still appreciate the sacrifices and the risks they take, right?

They're doing what they do because they believe it makes this country safer, just as most police and fire fighters. I don't believe that Canada should be in the middle east at all right now but I still respect our troops who go over there and risk their lives. Without people like these brave individuals you would be in an Orwellian State and one of our most cherished leaders would be Hilter(responsible for 30 million deaths) or maybe Stalin(responsible for 40 million deaths) or who knows, maybe Mao(responsible for 60 million deaths).

You should be thankful that there are brave men around you willing to lay it all on the line because the life you get to live was paid for with the lives of so many courageous people just like them. If there ever is an attack on Canadian soil it is these people you will be running to for protection. I bet you would have no issues with camo then.

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[kopite91]

Apollo, it's hard to argue against the mantra of "it's for the soldiers! The men and women who put their lives at risk for you to fight for you freedom". You can never argue against that. It's obviously for them (or us in the case of me). While a few sports clubs in North America (ex. Maple Leafs) are forever linked with the army and past war efforts, there is an underlying, unconscious objective of ponying up to patriotism when most other clubs honour the military.

Either way, I think we're getting a little sidetracked here. The debate is about national anthems and whether Dion Waiters has to stand through one.

[Scraptor]

Apollo, it's hard to argue against the mantra of "it's for the soldiers! The men and women who put their lives at risk for you to fight for you freedom".

Give me liberty or give me a bran muffin! - Colin Mochrie

The Pro-Bran Muffin agenda is just sickening. You're just a stool for the bowel movement.

[kopite91]

The Pro-Bran Muffin agenda is just sickening. You're just a stool for the bowel movement.

Don't worry. I won't forget to use the febreze after the bowel movements done.... i'll make sure to use the charming rose garden effects one

[JawsGT]

I remember Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf's career went downhill after he too refused to respect the national anthem. He was a very promising player with the Nuggets, but brought a lot of hate from fans, players and even his own teammates after he refused to stand for the national anthem. He got banned, but the league worked out some compromise where he didn't have to look up during the anthem or something.

I never understood the need for national anthems prior to games in North American sports. I can understand international games, but club games are unnecessary. Outside Canada and the US, you don't have national anthems prior to a club match in any sport anywhere in the world. It's unnecessary. This coming from a former Canadian army reserve...

I never understood either, and I imagine I never will. It's completely unnecessary.

[Apollo]

Apollo, it's hard to argue against the mantra of "it's for the soldiers! The men and women who put their lives at risk for you to fight for you freedom". You can never argue against that. It's obviously for them (or us in the case of me). While a few sports clubs in North America (ex. Maple Leafs) are forever linked with the army and past war efforts, there is an underlying, unconscious objective of ponying up to patriotism when most other clubs honour the military.

Either way, I think we're getting a little sidetracked here. The debate is about national anthems and whether Dion Waiters has to stand through one.

Patriotism is what this country needs right now, especially in the younger generations. I love my country and I want to see it thrive. The baby boomers are going to leave us with some messes to clean up and we have to be ready and willing to do it for the next generations that come after us so that they too get to grow up and live in a safe place where people of all walks of life come together and live comfortable and rewarding lives. A little love and thanks for what we have and what's had to happen for us to be right here, right now in my opinion is a necessity.

You're right, this is sidetracked but I viewed the conversation pretty much over when Waiters came out and squashed a bad rumor, one with no source. There is now another important conversation propping up here.

I never understood either, and I imagine I never will. It's completely unnecessary.

Why is there a need for Remembrance Day or Thanks Giving for that matter then? These are traditions and they're put there as moments to remind what we all have. They're part of our culture. It's a good thing to be thankful and proud of where you come from. Without patriotism you're not going to get people who have the best interests of the nation competing for the positions of power. We need more Canadian patriots in office if you ask me.

[Superjudge]

um...why?

[kopite91]

I understand what you're saying Apollo. And it's true that our younger generation needs more reminders about the traditions and patriotism is needed, especially in times like these. But I'm of the old school line of thinking where sports shouldn't be undertaking a role in this regard, but rather the institutions already there in our society. Family. School. Church. Like, Barkley once said... athletes shouldn't have to be role models. Parents, teachers, priests should. Instead, divorce rates are cripling the institution of marriage and families are crumbling as a result in front of our very own eyes. Lack of good-paying jobs means parents have to work 2-3 jobs which leaves the kids susceptible to hanging out with the wrong company. Teachers are losing their jobs and instead of disciplining kids, are more focussed on keeping their jobs and more content with just sticking to teaching. Long gone are the days where you got pulled up by the ear to the principal's office. And people don't even want priests around their kids any longer. Lately, the only things kids look up to as role models are sports athletes and video game characters.

[JawsGT]

Patriotism is what this country needs right now, especially in the younger generations. I love my country and I want to see it thrive. The baby boomers are going to leave us with some messes to clean up and we have to be ready and willing to do it for the next generations that come after us so that they too get to grow up and live in a safe place where people of all walks of life come together and live comfortable and rewarding lives. A little love and thanks for what we have and what's had to happen for us to be right here, right now in my opinion is a necessity.

You're right, this is sidetracked but I viewed the conversation pretty much over when Waiters came out and squashed a bad rumor, one with no source. There is now another important conversation propping up here.



Why is there a need for Remembrance Day or Thanks Giving for that matter then? These are traditions and they're put there as moments to remind what we all have. They're part of our culture. It's a good thing to be thankful and proud of where you come from. Without patriotism you're not going to get people who have the best interests of the nation competing for the positions of power. We need more Canadian patriots in office if you ask me.

I don't get the comparison. I'm patriotic and very proud to be Canadian. Remembrance Day, although I do not participate in any celebrations or parades or what not, is one of the most important holidays to acknowledge IMO. I am very thankful for what others have sacrificed in order for me to take for granted the types of things I do, like voting for example. But I do not see the link between playing a national anthem prior to a non-international sporting event and patriotism. Playing the anthem prior to sporting events does not make sense to me, and if anything, dilutes the feelings of patriotism I feel when I do hear the anthem because I tend to hear it too much or just do not associate patriotism with professional domestic sport. Luckily, we do not have to hear it much on broadcasts. And it certainly isn't the same to hear the anthem prior to a Leafs/Canadians matchup then it is to hear it after a citizen of this country is being acknowledged for exemplary performance at the Olympics. That's something a fan, or any citizen, can be proud of.

If playing the anthem prior to games is necessary to increase feelings of patriotism, then that speaks to larger problems IMO.

[kopite91]

The funny thing is how Waiters squashed it. It isn't rumour... not when you're quoted by a journalist.

[Apollo]

If the journalist out defending his stance and saying Dion said it?

Jaws, my question to you is why not play the anthems? Who they're playing against shouldn't matter because playing if the anthem has nothing to do with a global passing contest.

You don't have two extra minutes to spare to stand in honor of your country? Why don't you show up two minutes late or step out for a beer? Everybody wins then.

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[Superjudge]

What the hell does my going to a basketball game have to do with my country, or its national anthem.

eff that. My country hasn't been all that honorable of late to be honest.

[rocwell]

What the hell does my going to a basketball game have to do with my country, or its national anthem.

eff that. My country hasn't been all that honorable of late to be honest.

giving up citizenship is easy..

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kit...n/CIT0302E.pdf

also.. it's never too late to become a politician you know