The 2016 Offseason thread

[TrueTorontoFan]

Uhh, that's extension talks. DeRozan didn't even entertain extension talks (for good reason, but Bautista has good reason not to either unless the team pays a premium). Those scenarios are not remotely comparable.

true it is different. Still for the raptors so happy that we have a good player WANTING to be here

[michaelm_]

Seems like Masai is done for the off season. Said last spot will go to an training camp invite.

Didn't Masai say few weeks earlier that a PF and a backup small forward was part of the goal this offseason? If he is indeed done with the offseason that's a little dissapointing imo.

[DanH]

Didn't Masai say few weeks earlier that a PF and a backup small forward was part of the goal this offseason? If he is indeed done with the offseason that's a little dissapointing imo.

So, Sully at PF and a backup SF (maybe Daniels gets a camp invite and wins the spot). Mission accomplished, I'd say. Not the huge upgrade we wanted, but that could come mid-season this year.

[Axel]

So Nets now have Scola, Vasquez and Bennett from free agency....it's like they are taking the worst of our spare parts and expecting it to work. You'd think they'd have learned from Bargnani.

[enlightenment]

So Nets now have Scola, Vasquez and Bennett from free agency....it's like they are taking the worst of our spare parts and expecting it to work. You'd think they'd have learned from Bargnani.

Masai has somehow fucked over the NY/NJ area badly enough that they see him as god and are considering themselves lucky for taking out his trash.

[Mack North]

I'm glad Bennett is getting another crack. Going to a shitty team should give him PT, one would think. I hope he can make something(anything) of his career.

[ball4life]

1)No I get what you're saying and I disagree.

You're punishing teams for internal growth -- all of the Warriors before Durrant were developed internally. Because one is underpaid they can make this move. 2)But you're suggesting that because a star is underpaid the Warriors should not be allowed to add a star for competitive balance. The Warriors are going essentially pay around the same amount for their players as everyone else. They exist in a cap system league.

3)That would be akin to JV becoming a star on his current contract, Lowry taking a pay cut and through basic trades (Ross, Bebe, Bruno, 2Pat -- theoretically) the Raps created space to bring in a 4th star (who is willing to take a pay cut) and the NBA saying no.

The Raps would have developed JV as a star, scouted and traded for Lowry when the rest of the league spurned him, developed DD. But then they're not allowed to have an extra star because stars should be equally distributed amongst teams?

4) Isn't that punishing teams? Not that I care about punishing/rewarding teams (unless it's the Raps). More importantly, doesn't that punish players in free agency by limiting where they can play? If it doesn't impact the amount of money going to players, if it primarily impacts wins, what right does Silver have to step in at all?

The reality is that most players in the star - superstar range of talent get their money from multiple places. You can't stop people from taking paycuts to join teams. 5) Durrant is leaving millions on the table with this 2 year deal (and moving to a state with a brutal tax code). Money isn't his motivation. It's clear with his deal that winning means more to him.

6) But you think teams that create winning cultures, shouldn't be able to add star free agents? Doesn't that also punish players on mediocre teams who decide they want to win. "Sorry DeMarcus Cousins, you can't take a pay cut and try to win, after that nightmare in Sacramento, but these 15-16 mediocre teams can vie for your services."

7) PS -- You realize by correcting me on Freddie Mac you answered your own questions? You don't regulate against success. You regulate to avoid catastrophic failure. With regional and national TV deals exploding, and players willing to lose money to win. How does that lead to catastrophic failure under a capped system? Why must player movement be regulated?

1) No. You don't. The original discussion was how the NBA economy is compared to capitalism. There was no discussion about whether the NBA should block the KD move. Matter of fact, KD's move is well within the rules and I don't argue that.

Also, we are talking based on the fact that the product of the NBA is competitive basketball to its customers. We are not talking about pickup basketball.

2) Warriors this off season is a unique situation with a cap spike and all that. Again, nowhere in my argument have I suggested it is against the rules to do that.

3) That Raptors team will never win 73 games in a season and go up 3-1 against the eventual champion in the NBA Finals. So context matter here. Also, we don't have any superstar in this team like Steph Curry. We have couple of borderline stars. JV may become one in the future, but sure not a superstar. If you believe we have a superstar in this team, then let's agree to disagree.

4) Again, I did not say Adam Silver should block this move. This is why I initially said you misunderstood the discussion. But sure, since you mentioned that it is limiting where the players might want to play. Isn't it already what the max salary and salary cap are doing to players? What if KD really wanted to play for the Cavs but they don't have cap space? isn't that punishing the Cavs? they can't get another star player to solidify as the champion for the next 10 years? isn't it already taking away options for players? so why does this point even matter?

5) This is BS. KD is not sacrificing money by signing a 2 year deal. Matter of fact he is maximizing his earning potential. He will earn close to 50 million more by opting out next year and signing a 10 year vet max next off season. He is a 9 year vet this off season. All the while winning championshipS.

6) Star players are different from Superstars like KD, Steph, Lebron & Wade. See how you said players in shitty teams should join winning cultures? Think about how KD was up 3-1 against the Warriors 1 win away from NBA Finals. Also, KD has already been to the NBA Finals. So what was the motive for his move? In my opinion, he eliminated OKC as a contender by leaving them and solidified an already phenomenal championship squad as heavy favorites for the foreseeable future. That's different from a star leaving a mediocre team to join a winning culture.

7) I have no question about it. I simply corrected a statement you presented as fact. I brought up the bank merger as an example of how even in capitalism there is regulatory bodies to monitor and prevent any unfair playing field. I think the difference is that you view KD to Warriors as a success for that team and I view the KD move as a failure from the league's mantra of parity and competitive balance. So yes, I answered my own question I guess. You regulate when the system seems to be failing.

[rocwell]

I'm glad Bennett is getting another crack. Going to a shitty team should give him PT, one would think. I hope he can make something(anything) of his career.

I don't know man. He should just go to Europe imo.

[ball4life]

I don't know man. He should just go to Europe imo.

Same. I think he should build up his confidence playing against lesser competition first.

[Axel]

Same. I think he should build up his confidence playing against lesser competition first.

With the Nets, I think they call those "team scrimmages".

[blackjitsu]

1) No. You don't. The original discussion was how the NBA economy is compared to capitalism. There was no discussion about whether the NBA should block the KD move. Matter of fact, KD's move is well within the rules and I don't argue that.

Also, we are talking based on the fact that the product of the NBA is competitive basketball to its customers. We are not talking about pickup basketball.

2) Warriors this off season is a unique situation with a cap spike and all that. Again, nowhere in my argument have I suggested it is against the rules to do that.

3) That Raptors team will never win 73 games in a season and go up 3-1 against the eventual champion in the NBA Finals. So context matter here. Also, we don't have any superstar in this team like Steph Curry. We have couple of borderline stars. JV may become one in the future, but sure not a superstar. If you believe we have a superstar in this team, then let's agree to disagree.

4) Again, I did not say Adam Silver should block this move. This is why I initially said you misunderstood the discussion. But sure, since you mentioned that it is limiting where the players might want to play. Isn't it already what the max salary and salary cap are doing to players? What if KD really wanted to play for the Cavs but they don't have cap space? isn't that punishing the Cavs? they can't get another star player to solidify as the champion for the next 10 years? isn't it already taking away options for players? so why does this point even matter?

5) This is BS. KD is not sacrificing money by signing a 2 year deal. Matter of fact he is maximizing his earning potential. He will earn close to 50 million more by opting out next year and signing a 10 year vet max next off season. He is a 9 year vet this off season. All the while winning championshipS.

6) Star players are different from Superstars like KD, Steph, Lebron & Wade. See how you said players in shitty teams should join winning cultures? Think about how KD was up 3-1 against the Warriors 1 win away from NBA Finals. Also, KD has already been to the NBA Finals. So what was the motive for his move? In my opinion, he eliminated OKC as a contender by leaving them and solidified an already phenomenal championship squad as heavy favorites for the foreseeable future. That's different from a star leaving a mediocre team to join a winning culture.

7) I have no question about it. I simply corrected a statement you presented as fact. I brought up the bank merger as an example of how even in capitalism there is regulatory bodies to monitor and prevent any unfair playing field. I think the difference is that you view KD to Warriors as a success for that team and I view the KD move as a failure from the league's mantra of parity and competitive balance. So yes, I answered my own question I guess. You regulate when the system seems to be failing.

Capitalism has two sides. You're dismissing labor.

You can't talk about industry without talking about the mobility of its labor force unless you're into sweatshop labor. If that's your thing, fine. But because you're angry doesn't make you right. Nor does my anger make me right. But you come off like a ... upset because someone sees the world different from you.

Whatever.

6/ KD is leaving millions to play for Golden State. MILLIONS. Where I come, from 1 million is a lot of money. He's losing 3-5 Mill a year in salary! Million. How could you look at multiple players making $30 + Million a year, Durant is making $27 a year, his contract comes up around the time of a new labor agreement, so those 5 year $30 Mill contracts will likely disappear. He isn't leaving money on the table? Again, he was guaranteed 5 years $30 million + . He's taking 2 years 27 million, with the labor agreement about to expire before he can negotiate income for those last 3 years.

Maybe where you come from 1 million dollars isn't a lot of money. My bad. Kevin Durant was raised by a single mother. (remember that, "You're the real MVP," speech.) Something tells me he thinks the same way as I do about 1 million dollars.

Kevin Durant is making Demar Derozan scale money. That $10 Mill (over 2 years) less than the current market dictates he's worth.

Can you actually read?

(Let see ....Mobility of labor....mobility of labor...)

7/ No, you posted something you knew the answer to, to feel superior over others.


Congrats.

[rocwell]

Acy is signing with the Mavericks!

[Simplicity]

I thought there would be more people ranting about how we didnt get Terrence Jones for the minimum

Some people were high on him here i think

[3inthekeon]

A lot of people were high on Jones, not just here.

Zach Lowe a year ago

Jones has barely logged 3,000 minutes over three seasons, but he has the potential to be the most versatile non–Anthony Davis two-way player from this draft class — especially if that languid 3-point stroke morphs into a reliable weapon. Would it be insane for Jones to hold out for at least $15 million per season? Probably not, even though he would likely be the least accomplished player ever to sign an extension that pricey. Would it even be insane for Houston GM Daryl Morey to accept that kind of deal? No one really knows, but Jones’s team will begin extension talks at an eye-popping number.

[tDotted]

Lol Terrence for the minimum. How long before most of this board loses their minds