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Thread: Colangelo Won't Likely Be Able to Pull a Similar Deal

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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Default Colangelo Won't Likely Be Able to Pull a Similar Deal

    Chris Sheridan is referring to the Joe Johnson to Atlanta deal.

    Jordan (Toronto) - What is the main thing Bryan Colangelo needs to get back in a sign and trade with Bosh? Salary relief, draft picks or young talent? I personally think Utah is the sleeper team, offering up Kirilenko and multiple 1st rounders similar to the Joe Johnson sign and trade Colangelo did in Phoenix. A big reason why is because Colangelo is all about getting the headlines and signing HIS guy, he doesn't wanna inherit someone elses big signing, he wants to be the man.

    Chris Sheridan (3:27 PM) - I'm not so sure Utah would do Kirilenko and the Knicks' pick for Bosh, much less multiple picks. I think Colangelo will try to get back the best total overall package, but I don't think anybody will offer him anything like what he got from Atlanta in the Joe Johnson deal.
    Source - Click here

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    Raptors Republic Starter James Ballswin (Realizar)'s Avatar
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    There are 29 teams who'd love to get Bosh and half of them are teams Bosh should consider possible fits. Here's hoping BC can swindle one of them into giving us their farm for our prize stud.

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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Hmmm .... Sheridan thinks Washington shouldn't be forgotten in the mix this summer too.

    Lance (Pdx ) - Hey Chris, Does H-town really have a chance at Bosh? Seems like Chicago, Miami, and OKC have the best chance if he doesn't re-sign with the Raps (wink-wink)???

    Chris Sheridan (3:11 PM) - when we did our staff survey on Bosh's future (it ran abou a week ago), I mentioned that the Washington Wizards should not be ignored. Chris has a young daughter in the D.C. area that he doesn't get to see much, and that factor is a stronger pull than a lot of folks realize. But aside from that possibility, I think Miami, NY and Chicago are the three frontrunners, and NY would have an edge because they could do a sign-and-trade with David Lee. Chicago would have to sign him outright, and Miami would either have to do the same or try to do a Beasley-Bosh sign-and-trade, and I don;t see the Raptors biting on Beasley.

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    Raptors Republic Starter OzRapFan's Avatar
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    I am being the ultimate optimistic here, but why do we have to sign and trade Bosh for say Wade, Why can't we resign Bosh and get Wade in a sign and trade scenario? They could offer anyone on the Roster (except Bosh of course)

    Imagine a roster of

    C - Johnson
    PF - Bosh
    SF - Weems
    SG -Wade
    PG - Jack

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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Why would Wade want to come to Toronto? He won a ring in Miami, its a proven environment. The Raptors are a team that has done nothing and they have GM with a flawed basketball philosophy. Not a fun place in the eyes of most I am sure.

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Why would Wade want to come to Toronto? He won a ring in Miami, its a proven environment. The Raptors are a team that has done nothing and they have GM with a flawed basketball philosophy. Not a fun place in the eyes of most I am sure.
    Not that I think Wade is going to Toronto, but I can certainly imagine him leaving Miami. Riley mortgaged the team for a Championship and they've been paying for it ever since. They've got really very little talent outside of Wade, and I don't see them adding all that much this summer. Even if they get a good PF like Boozer or Amare, they'll still be thin on talent.

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    Quote OzRapFan wrote: View Post
    I am being the ultimate optimistic here, but why do we have to sign and trade Bosh for say Wade, Why can't we resign Bosh and get Wade in a sign and trade scenario? They could offer anyone on the Roster (except Bosh of course)

    Imagine a roster of

    C - Johnson
    PF - Bosh
    SF - Weems
    SG -Wade
    PG - Jack
    Yeah! And we could also have a go at Paul. We give Calderon, banks, evans and a couple of pizza pizza discount coupons. a line-up of:

    C johnson
    pf bosh
    sf weems
    sg wade
    pg paul

    is wicked no? way better than yours

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    Quote TIm W. wrote: View Post
    Not that I think Wade is going to Toronto, but I can certainly imagine him leaving Miami. Riley mortgaged the team for a Championship and they've been paying for it ever since. They've got really very little talent outside of Wade, and I don't see them adding all that much this summer. Even if they get a good PF like Boozer or Amare, they'll still be thin on talent.
    I don't see how Riley mortgaging the team for a championship is a bad thing. They won a championship. Colangelo mortgaged the Raptors' future to save his own hide, is that more marketable?

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    Raptors Republic Starter James Ballswin (Realizar)'s Avatar
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    Riley did mortgage the last 3 years to become a title contender and was successful in winning the title in 2006. Four years later, Riley has now enabled the Heat to beginning the process of rebuilding the team, starting this summer, another title contender. To me, this is an example of a successful results-based management strategy. Kudos to Riley.

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    colangelo may start to fire triano

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    I don't see how Riley mortgaging the team for a championship is a bad thing. They won a championship. Colangelo mortgaged the Raptors' future to save his own hide, is that more marketable?
    I never said Wade would choose Toronto over Miami. I just said that there is a good reason Wade would leave Miami.

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    I think unless Riley pulls off some magic like a Bosh S&T combined with another big name, Wade is gonna bolt. He's had three years of awful teams and dragged two of them to the playoffs. Unless Riley makes the Heat immediate contenders which would have to involve some of the biggest moves in NBA off season history, I don't see why Wade would waste the rest of his prime in Miami. It is a horrible basketball city, they have marginal assets and he already gave them a title.

    Lebron gets all the hype, but Wade is just as talented, a killer in the post season and already poesses championship swagger. Hell would likely have to freeze over before Wade would come to Toronto, but I think Dallas is a great fit for him and Riley would be hard pressed to turn down a S&T involving Beaubois, Butler and a 1st.

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    Quote James Ballswin (Realizar) wrote: View Post
    Riley did mortgage the last 3 years to become a title contender and was successful in winning the title in 2006. Four years later, Riley has now enabled the Heat to beginning the process of rebuilding the team, starting this summer, another title contender. To me, this is an example of a successful results-based management strategy. Kudos to Riley.
    Riley mortgaged the prime years of Wade's career for a Championship. It's great that they won a Championship, but Wade is now 28, and the Heat have acquired very little talent in the last 4 years in order to rebuild. Instead of trying to build a team that would contend every year in Wade's prime years, Riley mortgaged everything for one shot. When most player's of Wade's calibre are playing for a contender, the Heat either were a lottery team or a first round flameout.

    I think it's great that the Heat were able to win the Championship, but that was four years ago and they've done very little since then to build around Wade. And now they're banking everything on one free agent.

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Why would Wade want to come to Toronto? He won a ring in Miami, its a proven environment. The Raptors are a team that has done nothing and they have GM with a flawed basketball philosophy. Not a fun place in the eyes of most I am sure.
    the same could be said about new york.


    but, the thing is the last few times they've coupled an all-star pf/c and an all-star sg, rings have been won.

    shaq/kobe
    shaq/wade
    pau/kobe
    garnett/allen
    duncan/ginobili

    miami won a ring they dumped an aging all-star haven't been anywhere close to that good since.

    shaq may be winning another ring while wade watches his team tear through the playoffs at home.
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    Quote TIm W. wrote: View Post
    I never said Wade would choose Toronto over Miami. I just said that there is a good reason Wade would leave Miami.
    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    the same could be said about new york.


    but, the thing is the last few times they've coupled an all-star pf/c and an all-star sg, rings have been won.

    shaq/kobe
    shaq/wade
    pau/kobe
    garnett/allen
    duncan/ginobili

    miami won a ring they dumped an aging all-star haven't been anywhere close to that good since.

    shaq may be winning another ring while wade watches his team tear through the playoffs at home.
    Guys you're undervaluing somethings. He won a championship in Miami and the management there ranks among the league's elite. When he showed up in Miami the team wasn't any better than it is now but Riley managed to make the moves to turn them into a contender. If I'm Wade I'm laying my chips down on the proven winner. Then there's the loyalty factor that comes into to play. He's been treated well, it's home to him. He's accomplished great things there. Why leave Riley now? It doesn't make sense to me. Most people don't jump ship on a good company, working a good job.
    Last edited by Apollo; Tue May 4th, 2010 at 05:24 PM.

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    Quote LBF wrote: View Post
    the same could be said about new york.


    but, the thing is the last few times they've coupled an all-star pf/c and an all-star sg, rings have been won.

    shaq/kobe
    shaq/wade
    pau/kobe
    garnett/allen
    duncan/ginobili

    miami won a ring they dumped an aging all-star haven't been anywhere close to that good since.

    shaq may be winning another ring while wade watches his team tear through the playoffs at home.
    I think you're vastly undervaluing the supporting cast. I mean, just look at Boston and San Antonio. You left out two FInals MVPs!

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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    Guys you're undervaluing somethings. He won a championship in Miami and the management there ranks among the league's elite. When he showed up in Miami the team wasn't any better than it is now but Riley managed to make the moves to turn them into a contender. If I'm Wade I'm laying my chips down on the proven winner. Then there's the loyalty factor that comes into to play. He's been treated well, it's home to him. He's accomplished great things there. Why leave Riley now? It doesn't make sense to me. Most people don't jump ship on a good company, working a good job.
    In Wade's first season in Miami, he had Lamar Odom, Eddie Jones, Caron Butler, plus guys like Brian Grant and Udonis Haslem. I'd take that over the current Raptors squad, apart from Bosh. In the four seasons since they won a Championship, the only real big piece they've added is Michael Beasley, and it's doubtful he'll even be back.

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    The only really big move Riley ever made was acquiring Shaq and that is arguably one of the biggest trades in NBA history. They won a title with Shaq, but a core of Wade, Butler and Odom would have kept them consistently more competitive.

    If i'm Wade im waiting to mid July and giving the Heat a chance to make major moves, if they don't or can't then I go west via a S&T.

    In Riley's tenure since he had Wade what has he really done? I think Riley has taken advantage of Wade. He wasted two years of his prime and Beasely has not panned out early. Say what you want about BC, at least he has tried to surround Bosh with talent, Riley has been folding for two straight years, waiting for this summer to go all in.

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    Colangelo got the following from Atlanta in the Joe Johnson sign and trade

    • Boris Diaw -- a player entering his third season who had been a colossal failure up to this point. Only able to earn 18mpg on a 13 win team and was doing absolutely nothing with playing time (five points, two rebounds and two dimes). A bust.
    • Two protected future first round picks which became the #21 pick in 2006 and the #15 pick in 2008

    Seriously, what was so great about the Joe Johnson sign and trade trade package ... that Colangelo can't repeat it in a Bosh sign and trade?

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