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Thread: How A Raptors Trade of Bosh To Houston Might Work

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Default How A Raptors Trade of Bosh To Houston Might Work

    Most likely the Rockets would like to move Martin. Lets assume for discussion purposes that they are willing to do so.

    Now the Rockets might be willing to trade both Hill and Ariza along with Martin for Bosh. That comes to about $20 million in salary.

    That means as long as Bosh is signed for more than $16,100,000; which he should be, a trade for Martin, Hill and Ariza works. ($20 million divided by 125% is $16 million and add $100K)

    Now I would only do this trade if BC has a taker for Martin. He can immediately turn around and trade Martin for a player or multiple players (see below) from a third team whose salary is in the acceptable range which would be between about $7 and $14 million. (the 125% rule) This rule might not apply on a re-trade. If not, Martin would have to be re-traded for a single player or multiple players whose salaries total $11.1 million.

    1. Bosh goes to Houston
    2. Houston sends Martin, Hill and Ariza to the Raptors
    3. The Raptors then send Martin to a third team for a player or mulitple players with a contract value of between approximately $7 and $14 million; i.e 125% below and above Martin’s contract value for next season. $11.1 million if the 125% rule does not apply on the re-trade.

    I believe that the restriction on immediately re-trading a player as stated below applies to the second trade and not the first trade. However, I could be wrong on how I am reading it.

    ======================================

    In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

    * For two months after receiving the player in trade or claiming him off waivers, if the player is being traded in combination with other players. However, the team is free to trade the player by himself (not packaged with other players) immediately. This restriction applies only to teams over the salary cap. (Also see question number 74 for a special case where players can be traded together in less than two months.)
    http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q74

    If I am reading it correctly the Raptors would only be restricted in packaging Martin to a third team if they packaged him with another player. However, there would be no restriction on the Raptors immediately re-trading Martin to a third team for one or more than one player as long as the Raptors traded only Martin.

    End result

    Raptors subtract – Bosh
    Raptors add – Hill, Ariza and one or more players from a third team.
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    They won't give up Martin...Morey has wanted Martin for a long time. It would be something more like Jeffries+ Ariza+ Hill+ a couple picks + some come cash.

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    I think that trade would make a lot of sense, and I would love to get New York's First rounder.

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    Morey also told Martin not to unpack.. according to several reports.

    But if this isn't a 3-way trade in the beginning (that is.. if BC doesn't want Martin) then I'd stay away. You should never take on a player hoping that someone else will want him!

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    Quote Ripp wrote: View Post
    They won't give up Martin...Morey has wanted Martin for a long time. It would be something more like Jeffries+ Ariza+ Hill+ a couple picks + some come cash.
    That trade would work for me but giving up three players and two decent draft picks, they would have to be first rounders, is something I can't see Houston doing. Two mid to late second round picks which Houston might do I can't see why BC would do that because basically late second round picks are useless you get very lucky.
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    Personally, I'd like Scola, but that's even more confusing since he'd have to agree to a sign-and-trade as well..

    If there aren't other offers out there, I'd say give Yao a shot. I know he's injury prone, but his contract is up after this year, and if he works out he's a bonus. Again.. ONLY if there were no other offers; which won't be the case.

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    Quote da_goose09 wrote: View Post
    Morey also told Martin not to unpack.. according to several reports.

    But if this isn't a 3-way trade in the beginning (that is.. if BC doesn't want Martin) then I'd stay away. You should never take on a player hoping that someone else will want him!
    I agree.
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    Quote da_goose09 wrote: View Post
    Personally, I'd like Scola, but that's even more confusing since he'd have to agree to a sign-and-trade as well..

    If there aren't other offers out there, I'd say give Yao a shot. I know he's injury prone, but his contract is up after this year, and if he works out he's a bonus. Again.. ONLY if there were no other offers; which won't be the case.
    Scola would be good by he is a BYC player and has limited trade value so the Raptors would have to basically choose between Scola and Hill, I can't see Houston trading both, and I would prefer HIll. Just my preference.
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    This is adapted from an earlier post of mine and is, pretty much, how I would see a Houston/TO trade going down:

    Bosh, Calderon & Toronto 2nd 2012
    FOR
    Jeffries, one of Battier/Ariza, one of Brooks/Lowry, one of Hill/Scola, Houston 1st 2010 and New York 1st 2012 - WITH - the caveat that one of Ariza or Brooks has to be in the deal

    I went with Calderon for Houston because:

    a. I don't think Houston takes Turkoglu regardless;
    b. Calderon is a proven bench strength and better fit/distributor for Houston if he has Yao/Bosh to send passes to;
    c. Calderon's contract is cheaper and shorter than Turkoglu's (far more enticing to Houston imo)

    PG Brooks or Lowry/Calderon
    SG Martin
    SF Battier/Budinger
    PF Bosh/Scola or Hill
    .C Yao/Anderson

    Also, the flexibility of the trade, for Houston, would have to be tempting for them as they are able to retain the ability to tailor their team as they wish.

    Great trade for TO (compared to, say, Miami) all things considered as:

    1. Ariza is a nice fit for Turkoglu (if Turks is retained) or replacement for him if Turks is traded and if Houston goes with Battier I don't see TO having a problem trading him
    2. Either one of Brooks or Lowry make for a nice back-up/co-chair for Jack
    3. I much prefer Scola as it retains as much competitiveness as possible for the Raps but Hill is a nice consolation prize and has better upside
    4. The picks allow us to continue to retool/help dump Turks
    5. Calderon is one of the problem contracts and dumping it is a big plus
    6. What we lose with Bosh we may get via the massive defensive upgrade that this trade represents (especially if its Scola at PF)

    PG Jack/Brooks or Lowry
    SG Weems/DeRozan
    SF Turks/Ariza
    PF Johnson/Scola or Hill
    .C Bargnani

    Banks, Bellinelli, Evans remain last-year contracts up for trade going forward. Center spot remains an issue but hopefully a trade would deal with that.

    Note: Bosh can only get 30% of the cap. If the new Cap number is $56.1 million this gives him a new starting number of $16.83. Newsflash: He actually takes a small dip on the 1st year of a new deal compared to the last year of his current one ($17.15).

    Bosh ($16.83) + Calderon ($9.00) = $25.83 million

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    Quote YKOil wrote: View Post
    This is adapted from an earlier post of mine and is, pretty much, how I would see a Houston/TO trade going down:

    Bosh, Calderon & Toronto 2nd 2012
    FOR
    Jeffries, one of Battier/Ariza, one of Brooks/Lowry, one of Hill/Scola, Houston 1st 2010 and New York 1st 2012 - WITH - the caveat that one of Ariza or Brooks has to be in the deal

    I went with Calderon for Houston because:

    a. I don't think Houston takes Turkoglu regardless;
    b. Calderon is a proven bench strength and better fit/distributor for Houston if he has Yao/Bosh to send passes to;
    c. Calderon's contract is cheaper and shorter than Turkoglu's (far more enticing to Houston imo)

    PG Brooks or Lowry/Calderon
    SG Martin
    SF Battier/Budinger
    PF Bosh/Scola or Hill
    .C Yao/Anderson

    Also, the flexibility of the trade, for Houston, would have to be tempting for them as they are able to retain the ability to tailor their team as they wish.

    Great trade for TO (compared to, say, Miami) all things considered as:

    1. Ariza is a nice fit for Turkoglu (if Turks is retained) or replacement for him if Turks is traded and if Houston goes with Battier I don't see TO having a problem trading him
    2. Either one of Brooks or Lowry make for a nice back-up/co-chair for Jack
    3. I much prefer Scola as it retains as much competitiveness as possible for the Raps but Hill is a nice consolation prize and has better upside
    4. The picks allow us to continue to retool/help dump Turks
    5. Calderon is one of the problem contracts and dumping it is a big plus
    6. What we lose with Bosh we may get via the massive defensive upgrade that this trade represents (especially if its Scola at PF)

    PG Jack/Brooks or Lowry
    SG Weems/DeRozan
    SF Turks/Ariza
    PF Johnson/Scola or Hill
    .C Bargnani

    Banks, Bellinelli, Evans remain last-year contracts up for trade going forward. Center spot remains an issue but hopefully a trade would deal with that.

    Note: Bosh can only get 30% of the cap. If the new Cap number is $56.1 million this gives him a new starting number of $16.83. Newsflash: He actually takes a small dip on the 1st year of a new deal compared to the last year of his current one ($17.15).

    Bosh ($16.83) + Calderon ($9.00) = $25.83 million
    Your trade would mean substituting Lowery or Brooks for Calderon.

    The rest assuming it is Ariza and Hill would be the same as mine except that you are getting Houston's 14th pick this season (NY?) and Jeffries whereas in my trade the Raptors keep Calderon at least on this deal yet get up to $14 million worth of players in trade value for Martin rather than Jeffries. I would rather keep Calderon out of the trade and forget Houston's first round pick and Jeffries and rather have up to $14 million from trading Martin.

    I think that if BC could trade Martin as part of a three way deal that with his trade value of up to $14 million BC could get more value for him than Jeffries and Houston's first round pick this season. (NY?)


    I don't see much upgrade in Lowry over Calderon if any at all. Brooks would be an upgrade over Calderon but I don't see Houston moving him for Calderon in order to get Bosh if there is another way to do it.
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    Quote from well known personality who led their high school team to a state championship.

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    You'd really be ok with Weems as the starting 2?

    Listen, I understand that he had a great/surprising year, but putting him in the starting line-up is the exact opposite of what should be done! He excelled as an energy guy off the bench providing a spark (even though he did play well when he started, we weren't exactly a good team then). Some people are just meant to be role players.. just because they work well in that role doesn't mean they should get a bigger one.

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    YKoil: I don't think anyone wants Jose in a S/T. They already have two good PGs who are being paid peanuts. If you want to add Jose in a CB S/T, it greatly increases the complexity of the deal (16 mil in salary versus 25 mil), and you won't get any picks and prospects back...just pure expirings (or the equivalent.) Better to make two separate deals, imo.

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    Im okay with sending him to Houston
    its in the West, they have some okay pieces
    i just really want a draft pick coming back to toronto

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    Ariza = slightly less lazy Turkelou

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    Quote da_goose09 wrote: View Post
    You'd really be ok with Weems as the starting 2?

    Listen, I understand that he had a great/surprising year, but putting him in the starting line-up is the exact opposite of what should be done! He excelled as an energy guy off the bench providing a spark (even though he did play well when he started, we weren't exactly a good team then). Some people are just meant to be role players.. just because they work well in that role doesn't mean they should get a bigger one.
    Weems played his best when he was put in the starting lineup. His game is suited to either bench or starting. He plays just as well as a fifth option as he does as a second. He doesn't need shots and doesn't seem to lose effectiveness the more he's on the court. Weems certainly wouldn't be a great starting SG, but it's not as if he'd be a weak link on either end of the court.

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    Quote OTFP wrote: View Post
    Ariza = slightly less lazy Turkelou
    ?????

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    Believe it

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    Quote OTFP wrote: View Post
    Ariza = slightly less lazy Turkelou
    Aside from the fact that they possess ENTIRELY different skill sets and play an ENTIRELY different style, this is bang on!

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    Yeah, Turk and Ariza are pretty different. I like Ariza's contract and abilities a lot more, though. A defensive SF who can shoot threes is nice to have.

    I agree with Tim, Weems is a solid, if unspectacular starting SG. And since he is supposedly already in San Antonio training (at least, this is what I gather from Twitter), he might be a good starting SG next season.

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    Quote TM Williamson wrote: View Post
    Aside from the fact that they possess ENTIRELY different skill sets and play an ENTIRELY different style, this is bang on!
    And one is Turkish, the other is American.

    They ARE both small forwards, though, so he could be on to something.

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