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Using The MLE To Sign A Player For The 3

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  • #16
    Mike Miller rebounds really well, something they need at the 3. He can hit shots from anywhere. He rebounds the ball really well. He's a smart player. They could do a lot worse than him.

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    • #17
      Tim W. wrote: View Post
      I'd completely agree.....if this was 2002.
      You don't think Howard can bounce back to be a solid contributor? He's long and athletic which couldn't hurt. And although he only played like 1 or 2 games for Washington and then got injured, it seemed like the change in scenery got him going. No doubt he has some issues, but he has gotten older and generally speaking, that brings maturity. I haven't heard of any recent issues on/off court with him, but I could have missed something.

      Apollo wrote: View Post
      Mike Miller rebounds really well, something they need at the 3. He can hit shots from anywhere. He rebounds the ball really well. He's a smart player. They could do a lot worse than him.
      Mike Miller is interesting, but he is 30 years old. No doubt a smart player, but I think that's more on the offensive end. Don't think his defense is outstanding and doesn't seem that athletic. And if I have a chance to get Outlaw, I'd go for him first. Maybe a good option if Outlaw doesn't work out.
      I think he's a better offensive player than Outlaw, but based on team needs, I think defense should be a priority at this spot. That's IF Bosh stays because him and Bargnani need their shots (I am certain Turk is not a Raptor next season so no "ball" requirements there). If Bosh leaves, then we need some offensive power to fill the void, so Miller MIGHT be a better option then. But then there's Al Harrington on that list as well (same age as Miller), who's a pretty decent offensive player. So I'd pick him over Miller.

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      • #18
        bodmon wrote: View Post
        You don't think Howard can bounce back to be a solid contributor? He's long and athletic which couldn't hurt. And although he only played like 1 or 2 games for Washington and then got injured, it seemed like the change in scenery got him going. No doubt he has some issues, but he has gotten older and generally speaking, that brings maturity. I haven't heard of any recent issues on/off court with him, but I could have missed something.
        I think there's a chance he can bounce back physically, but there were problems he before he got hurt. I think he's far too much of a question mark at this point. There are a lot of other players who I'd rather give the MLE to than Howard. Hell, there are a lot of player's i'd rather give a roster spot to than Howard

        bodmon wrote: View Post
        Mike Miller is interesting, but he is 30 years old. No doubt a smart player, but I think that's more on the offensive end. Don't think his defense is outstanding and doesn't seem that athletic. And if I have a chance to get Outlaw, I'd go for him first. Maybe a good option if Outlaw doesn't work out.
        I think he's a better offensive player than Outlaw, but based on team needs, I think defense should be a priority at this spot. That's IF Bosh stays because him and Bargnani need their shots (I am certain Turk is not a Raptor next season so no "ball" requirements there). If Bosh leaves, then we need some offensive power to fill the void, so Miller MIGHT be a better option then. But then there's Al Harrington on that list as well (same age as Miller), who's a pretty decent offensive player. So I'd pick him over Miller.
        A young Miller would have been great, but age and injuries have slowed him down. He used to be a good defensive player, but I don't know how good he is now.
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        • #19
          Nobody. Do not waste the team's cap flexibility on one of those options.
          nbaroundtable

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          • #20
            Dave wrote: View Post
            Nobody. Do not waste the team's cap flexibility on one of those options.
            WHat cap flexibility do the Raptors have? It's doubtful they'll be under the cap anytime soon. If the team can add a talented player without giving up anyone, why not do it?
            Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
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            • #21
              I agree. They need to start spending more if anything. All the best teams spend a lot of money. Most of the teams who make the playoffs are paying luxury tax. The Raptors management needs to put up or shut up with this "we are about winning" crap. They better spend the full MLE or else, simply put, they're full of it.

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              • #22
                Apollo wrote: View Post
                I agree. They need to start spending more if anything. All the best teams spend a lot of money. Most of the teams who make the playoffs are paying luxury tax. The Raptors management needs to put up or shut up with this "we are about winning" crap. They better spend the full MLE or else, simply put, they're full of it.
                I don't completely agree. I don't think the Raptors should spend money for spending sake. If the right player isn't there, or they can't get him, then throwing money at a player that isn't what the Raptors need isn't going to help anyone. We've already been down that road.
                Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
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                • #23
                  Tim W. wrote: View Post
                  Dave wrote: View Post
                  Nobody. Do not waste the team's cap flexibility on one of those options.
                  WHat cap flexibility do the Raptors have? It's doubtful they'll be under the cap anytime soon. If the team can add a talented player without giving up anyone, why not do it?
                  The Raptors have about $39.25 million tied up in five players (Hedo, Bargs, Jack, Jose, DeRozan) and their #13 pick heading into the summer of 2011. A couple of cap charges and another high lottery pick (2011 Draft) would add around another $5.5 million onto the total. That is $44.75 million ... meaning they could have somewhere around $10 million with cap room.

                  The Raptors could easily trade Jack and/or Bargnani for further cap flexibility creating $25 million worth of cap room in 2011.

                  The point here is options ... the Raptors are close to the cap figure but with a move or two they can create a lot of cap space. If they start tying up more of their cap with highly paid role players, then that will become more difficult and limit their options.

                  --------------------------------------------------------------------

                  The Raptors first priority is to address the core of their roster. It is a disaster area ... and signing expensive role players only makes that more difficult because it takes away cap flexibility and it increases your win total and lowers your draft position.

                  If the Raptors addressed the core of their roster this summer and a good core to build around going forward ... I would be very happy to spend the MLE this summer.

                  But, for now at least, an most likely, the Raptors do not and will not have a strong enough core.
                  Last edited by Dave; Fri Jun 4, 2010, 09:22 AM.
                  nbaroundtable

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                  • #24
                    Tim W. wrote: View Post
                    I don't completely agree. I don't think the Raptors should spend money for spending sake. If the right player isn't there, or they can't get him, then throwing money at a player that isn't what the Raptors need isn't going to help anyone. We've already been down that road.
                    Tim, there are "right players" to be had in each and every free agency. I'm not saying spend for the sake of spending. I'm saying they better not let the tax stop them because if it does then they're full of shit and what's the point of it all? The numbers say it all. Team who are willing to commit financially win a lot more games than teams who don't want to go there.

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                    • #25
                      Dave wrote: View Post
                      The Raptors have about $39.25 million tied up in five players (Hedo, Bargs, Jack, Jose, DeRozan) and their #13 pick heading into the summer of 2011. A couple of cap charges and another high lottery pick (2011 Draft) would add around another $5.5 million onto the total. That is $44.75 million ... meaning they could have somewhere around $10 million with cap room.

                      The Raptors could easily trade Jack and/or Bargnani for further cap flexibility creating $25 million worth of cap room in 2011.

                      The point here is options ... the Raptors are close to the cap figure but with a move or two they can create a lot of cap space. If they start tying up more of their cap with highly paid role players, then that will become more difficult and limit their options.

                      --------------------------------------------------------------------

                      The Raptors first priority is to address the core of their roster. It is a disaster area ... and signing expensive role players only makes that more difficult because it takes away cap flexibility and it increases your win total and lowers your draft position.

                      If the Raptors addressed the core of their roster this summer and a good core to build around going forward ... I would be very happy to spend the MLE this summer.

                      But, for now at least, an most likely, the Raptors do not and will not have a strong enough core.
                      You're obviously speaking of next summer. My problem with trying to use the $10 million the Raptors could be under next summer is that it precludes re-signing Amir this summer, as well as Weems and Belinelli next summer. And considering that if Bosh leaves, the Raptors will only have 9 players under contract (10 if you include the draft pick), that means filling out the roster with one year contracts. All in the hopes that the Raptors can convince a free agent to sign with a team that will probably win fewer than 30 games next season.

                      Keep in mind that between this summer and next summer, only two teams are NOT projected to be under the cap. That's a lot of teams that will be under the cap and a lot of choices for free agents. How high on their list is Toronto going to be, especially since it will have been 3 years since the team made the playoffs?

                      Cap room is all nice and good, but how much is Sacramento or Minnesota's cap room going to help them this summer? Besides, the fact that teams that are over the cap are given as much chance of signing Bosh as teams under the cap shows that cap room is way over rated. What's more important than cap room are pieces that can be used in trades or simply development.

                      I don't believe the Raptors should simply spend for the sake of spending, but a guy like Travis Outlaw is a good young player who is exactly the type of player the Raptors could use. He can shoot, defend, rebound, is active and would improve the team. He could also be used, in conjunction with other players, in a trade for a better player down the line, if that's what you want.
                      Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
                      Follow me on Twitter.

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                      • #26
                        Tim W. wrote: View Post
                        I'd completely agree.....if this was 2002.
                        i think howard would/did want/make close to 3 times the MLE if this was '02.


                        BTW, who else voted for T-MAC?
                        If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

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                        • #27
                          Apollo wrote: View Post
                          Tim, there are "right players" to be had in each and every free agency. I'm not saying spend for the sake of spending. I'm saying they better not let the tax stop them because if it does then they're full of shit and what's the point of it all? The numbers say it all. Team who are willing to commit financially win a lot more games than teams who don't want to go there.
                          I keep hearing about the Raptors being afraid of the tax. Please, name some actual examples of when the tax has stopped the Raptors from making a move that would have clearly benefited the team. The only recent time I can remember was when we picked up O'Neal and had trouble filling the bench, but hey, going even $1 mil into the luxury tax level for a bit player so that we're docked $1 mil in tax, while ending up on the wrong side of the luxury tax distribution (another $4 mil or so), is a great cost-effective way of improving the team.

                          No, our bigger problems have been (in no particular order) 1) the inability to attract marquee free agents or to get them to come cheaply, 2) overpaying players who are willing to play for us, and 3) being over the cap. That last one is probably the biggest hurdle to the improvement of our team, bigger than the luxury tax level.

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                          • #28
                            Got to go with Outlaw. Matt Barnes is good too, even though he's more of a piece on a good team more than a building block. He made $1.6M last year and has a player option at that rate which I suspect he's not going to pick up. It might take half the MLE to get him.

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                            • #29
                              Would the Raptors take a look at Raja Bell? As for Outlaw, I liked him when he played for Portland, the fact that they deemed him expendable, at a position they could upgrade defensively, clearly means he's overvalued.
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                              • #30
                                Quixotic wrote: View Post
                                Apollo wrote: View Post
                                Tim, there are "right players" to be had in each and every free agency. I'm not saying spend for the sake of spending. I'm saying they better not let the tax stop them because if it does then they're full of shit and what's the point of it all? The numbers say it all. Team who are willing to commit financially win a lot more games than teams who don't want to go there.
                                I keep hearing about the Raptors being afraid of the tax. Please, name some actual examples of when the tax has stopped the Raptors from making a move that would have clearly benefited the team.
                                Can you tell me the last time they paid a significant amount of luxury tax over the past five years?

                                Oh and I never suggested that they're afraid to pay tax. They are, however, a corporation owned franchise and corporations for profit care about profit first.

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