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    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Default Raptors/Sixers Trade Buzz

    This cat from the Philly board at the RealGM has apparently been bang on with inside sources in the past. I'm not sure I'm happy with this rumour though.

    Re: The Sixerfan1976 Draft Thread (Update Pg. 34)

    Postby sixerfan1976 on Mon Jun 07, 2010 7:38 pm:

    Ok Ford was half right in the Indiana and Toronto talks. We have talked to both but neither conversation pertains to the #2 pick. In case you didn’t know we are taking Turner

    We have inquired about the 10th pick(Indiana) and the 13th pick(Toronto).

    Talks with Indiana center around Jeff Foster and the 10 pick for Lou and Thad. I don’t know who the target is at 10. Maybe they don’t even know yet. Could be Aldrich I guess.

    Talks with Toronto center around Lou and Jack. Toronto has interest in Thad but needs to move Hedo first who we apparently do not want. One version I heard was Lou and Thad for Jack, Belinelli and #13. Again…I do not know who the big guy is we are targeting. I got the feeling that moving to 10-15 was going to be a lot easier than moving up to 5-9 range.

    So maybe Lou is on the block or a lot more available than I previously thought.

    Its all just talk right now….lots of stuff floating around..we will see what sticks in a few weeks.
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    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    T. Young has actually regressed over his three years and L. Williams can't play defense.
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    Jack can not play defense either and I am not sure if he can be a useful player in a losing team.

    I trade Jack and 13 for Lou Williams and Young. Who ever we get at 13, will not be as good as young anyway.

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    Not sure I'm comfortable with the Raptors including the 13th pick or Derozan in any deal with Philly (unless it includes Igoudala), but Lou Williams is an awesome player imo. His perimeter D is not nearly as bad as what we're used to seeing and he plays very well defensively from the weakside in getting steals and generating fast break opportunities. I'm sure we're all aware of his offensive skill set already. With his ability to put the ball on the floor and improving at driving-and-kicking (philly didnt really have any 3 point shooters outside of kapono to run a drive and kick with), he can potentially become a very good player in a league thats growing more suitable for combo pg's.

    He plays similar to Devin Harris on the Mavs.

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    Quote Raptor4Ever wrote: View Post
    Jack can not play defense either and I am not sure if he can be a useful player in a losing team.

    I trade Jack and 13 for Lou Williams and Young. Who ever we get at 13, will not be as good as young anyway.
    and you're basing this on what?

    btw, that is definitely not gonna go down belinelli, jack, and the 13th for thad and lou.

    unless we are getting gil for turkoglu. who now apparently wants to go to sacramento.
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    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    I'm with you Raptors4Ever. Those are two very young, high talent players who have a lot of upside. Would a move like that signify they're done trying to please Bosh and they're putting the team as a whole first?

    DeRozan should be off limits here.

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    Not so sure Lou Williams is the right fit to give up no.13, at the very least 13 could turn out to be a cheaper option for the next 4yrs

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    Anyone who says no to this deal is delirious. Lou Williams was playing top 15 ball before he broke his jaw and AI stole all his minutes. The guy is a stud, while not a pure pg, he is an ideal running mate to pair with Derozan and Weems.

    I loved Thad Young back at Georgia Tech. He has been a prisoner of the big man glut that the 76ers have and the constant volatility of the franchise. A change in scenery could mean all the difference in the world to a young player of his ability.

    The number 13 pick is a joke compared to the skill and potential of these two guys. Lou is locked up to a very generous contract and Thad is due for a decent payday in a year.

    I don't include Derozan unless its followed by number 2 pick and I really, really like Jack, but Lou is a better player and a more ideal off guard to play along Jose for when Triano likes to mix things up.

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    Quote mo-sales wrote: View Post
    Anyone who says no to this deal is delirious. Lou Williams was playing top 15 ball before he broke his jaw and AI stole all his minutes. The guy is a stud, while not a pure pg, he is an ideal running mate to pair with Derozan and Weems.

    I loved Thad Young back at Georgia Tech. He has been a prisoner of the big man glut that the 76ers have and the constant volatility of the franchise. A change in scenery could mean all the difference in the world to a young player of his ability.

    The number 13 pick is a joke compared to the skill and potential of these two guys. Lou is locked up to a very generous contract and Thad is due for a decent payday in a year.

    I don't include Derozan unless its followed by number 2 pick and I really, really like Jack, but Lou is a better player and a more ideal off guard to play along Jose for when Triano likes to mix things up.
    The problem with Lou Williams is he's a tweener. I don't understand how you say he's not a pure PG, but is an ideal running mate to DeRozan and Weems. If he's not a pure PG, who on earth is going to run the offense? The one thing Williams has proven is that he's not a PG.

    I do like Young, and I have no problem trading the 13th pick, but I'd rather not trade Belinelli. I know, I know, many of you don't like him, but I still think he's going to be a very good player.

    As for the trade as a whole, I do think the Raptors do end up with some talented players. I'd still like to see them get the 2nd pick, though.

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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    The problem with Lou Williams is he's a tweener. I don't understand how you say he's not a pure PG, but is an ideal running mate to DeRozan and Weems. If he's not a pure PG, who on earth is going to run the offense? The one thing Williams has proven is that he's not a PG.

    I do like Young, and I have no problem trading the 13th pick, but I'd rather not trade Belinelli. I know, I know, many of you don't like him, but I still think he's going to be a very good player.

    As for the trade as a whole, I do think the Raptors do end up with some talented players. I'd still like to see them get the 2nd pick, though.
    I could see where that could get confusing, but Lou avg over 4 dimes a season last year with the Princeton offense which doesn't gear towards point guards. The guy is ideal because he can keep up with Derozan, Weems and Johnson whereas Jose and Jack can't. He isn't a pure pg, but scoring pg's seems to be the new breed anyways. Weems creates his own offense and Derozan will hopefully show up to camp with a handle so I don't think there would really be a problem kick starting the offense.

    Imagine Lou and Thad were in the draft, would they not go before #13?
    I like this draft and think #13 isn't a bad spot to be, but if you can turn possibilities into reality, you do that every day of the week.

    Jack is a nice player, but he's not a starter and can't really play the two guard. Have people not watched 76er games? Lou Wiliams was a breakout star last year before he got injured. Young is a versatile 21 year old big man who can play inside and out. Both guys might not pan out, but there is much greater chance one of them does than the #13 pick.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Teddy Bruckshut's Avatar
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    Quote mo-sales wrote: View Post

    The number 13 pick is a joke compared to the skill and potential of these two guys. Lou is locked up to a very generous contract and Thad is due for a decent payday in a year.

    I don't even know how you know who is available at 13 already. This is a lottery pick there will be players at 13.

    Lou Williams is a nice player, I like him as a weapon off the bench not as a starting PG. I would welcome Lou and Thad if we somehow acquire a ballhandler in the backcourt not named Jose Calderon.

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    Bosh leaving is such a great opportunity for us to rebuild...in my mind the #13 and DD are key pieces of that rebuilding...We need to collect picks and prospects, not trade them away...

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    Quote mattscottnelson wrote: View Post
    Bosh leaving is such a great opportunity for us to rebuild...in my mind the #13 and DD are key pieces of that rebuilding...We need to collect picks and prospects, not trade them away...
    You're overvaluing what the Raptors could get with the 13th pick. Besides, Lou Williams is 23 and Thadeus Young is 21. I think they qualify as prospects. The Raptors actually get YOUNGER in the deal, so if the Raptors are rebuilding, I think that's good, don't you?

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    I like Thaddeus.

    It's amazing to me how many fans don't want to include Demar in a deal. Did you see him play last year? Yes he has potential but he should also be coming off the bench next year, which is when he was most effective and dialed in his rookie season.

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    Quote sleepz wrote: View Post
    I like Thaddeus.

    It's amazing to me how many fans don't want to include Demar in a deal. Did you see him play last year? Yes he has potential but he should also be coming off the bench next year, which is when he was most effective and dialed in his rookie season.
    Demars rookie season was similar to TMacs... relatively lost on both offensive and defensive sets but his raw talent still allowed him to drop 18-20 pts occasionally; this with triano admitting to not running a single play for derozan.

    He still has a lot to prove and I'm not saying he's the next tmac, but it would be a little premature to give up/trade him so soon.

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    Quote abstract wrote: View Post
    Demars rookie season was similar to TMacs... relatively lost on both offensive and defensive sets but his raw talent still allowed him to drop 18-20 pts occasionally; this with triano admitting to not running a single play for derozan.

    He still has a lot to prove and I'm not saying he's the next tmac, but it would be a little premature to give up/trade him so soon.
    Took the words right outta my mouth. DeRozan ain't goin' anywhere. This is the guy they wanted months before the draft, why would they make him expendable now?

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    Quote abstract wrote: View Post
    Demars rookie season was similar to TMacs... relatively lost on both offensive and defensive sets but his raw talent still allowed him to drop 18-20 pts occasionally; this with triano admitting to not running a single play for derozan.

    He still has a lot to prove and I'm not saying he's the next tmac, but it would be a little premature to give up/trade him so soon.
    I can't make that Tmac comparison as their skill-set is different and McGrady was essentially a point forward. I don't think DeMar has shown as much potential as Tmac did. A rookie can certainly develop a lot between year one and 2 but for a 2 guard with limited ball handling and a flat jumper? I tihnk he should focus on being a good defender and rebounder with his athleticism. I would trade him before I traded Weems though.

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    Quote sleepz wrote: View Post
    I can't make that Tmac comparison as their skill-set is different and McGrady was essentially a point forward. I don't think DeMar has shown as much potential as Tmac did. A rookie can certainly develop a lot between year one and 2 but for a 2 guard with limited ball handling and a flat jumper? I tihnk he should focus on being a good defender and rebounder with his athleticism. I would trade him before I traded Weems though.
    flat jumper? his mid range game is pretty effective even at the nba level. i agree his ball handling is limited but we haven't really seen him too much in high screen scenarios so who knows how well he can create if he actually has screens set for him at the top of the perimeter? its an entirely different dynamic especially if he has a big man that can roll towards the basket.

    considering the raptors were totally void of an athletic wing for 3.5 years under colangelo, i dont understand how undervalued derozan is amongst the fan base. if anything, raptor fans should know that athletic wings with scoring potential dont grow on trees and are hard to come by. the fact that one of these players is young, locked in long term and willing to learn/improve, it makes no sense to even include him in a trade... unless we're getting back a stud

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    Quote abstract wrote: View Post
    flat jumper? his mid range game is pretty effective even at the nba level. i agree his ball handling is limited but we haven't really seen him too much in high screen scenarios so who knows how well he can create if he actually has screens set for him at the top of the perimeter? its an entirely different dynamic especially if he has a big man that can roll towards the basket.

    considering the raptors were totally void of an athletic wing for 3.5 years under colangelo, i dont understand how undervalued derozan is amongst the fan base. if anything, raptor fans should know that athletic wings with scoring potential dont grow on trees and are hard to come by. the fact that one of these players is young, locked in long term and willing to learn/improve, it makes no sense to even include him in a trade... unless we're getting back a stud
    His jumper is flat which is why the coaching staff has had to work on his mechanics. He has a decent mid-range game but it's based more on team daring him to shoot right now than him creating a shot for himself. Don't get me wrong, I would like DD to be a solid player if they decide to keep him but if there is an opportunity to move up in the draft or get a solid young player in the league that has shown ability I would let him go. He is athletic but in the NBA today I would want my 2 guard to be a shot creator or a liquid shooter and right now he's shown me neither ability on a consistent basis. If he could develop into a top tier defender however he would be a keeper in my books.

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    I think that trade is realistic and plausible, but I don't see it happening. Also, I love Jack for his hustle, taking hard fouls, and playing at 100% every game and being the most vocal player on the Raptors team. In the end I think Jack>Lou and would not do the trade. Maybe Young and their second round pick for belinelli and the 13#?

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