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Thread: Andrea Will Be the Starting All Star PF

  1. #41
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Quote mo-sales wrote: View Post
    Its not that far off as far as ridiculous, unabashed claims go.

    If Bosh leaves, Bargs should be putting up minimum 19-7, 1.5 blk, decent percentages and hopefully not world class matador defense.

    Dwight will have center, Brook/Bogut backing him up and if Amare stays west and Bosh goes west or maybe even Bulls, Josh Smith is the only real threat at PF. Conventional wisdom says the East just stacks up on centers and undersized small forwards rather than let Bargs into the all star game.
    If Bosh leaves Johnson will start at PF - You can buy gold with this one
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Well, Horford made the All-Star team last year ahead of Bargnani. And all those centers had a higher PER than Bargnani (including Noah, who's a defensive player which PER doesn't generally recognize). Lopez and Bogut had PERs 5 points higher than Bargnani. And since PER doesn't take into account defense, and all those players are also much better defensive players than Bargnani, it's difficult to argue that Bargnani is better than any of them.

    SImply trying to reverse what people are saying doesn't make it magically true.

    It's great that you're optimistic about Bargnani, but the facts don't support your argument, so don't pretend they do.
    Tim- is All Star voting predicated on PER? Last time I checked...it was not......so...simply trying to throw unrelated statistics at your argument does not validate it either. Throw a poll up on this board which asks who people think are the best Centers in the East and I am guessing most will not agree that Lopez is better than Bargs.

  3. #43
    Raptors Republic Rookie robito's Avatar
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    What exactly did Bargnani do better than Lopez last year?

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    Raptors Republic Starter matt's Avatar
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    Ok I'm sorry, Bargnanni will NOT be a starter EVER b/c he is UNPOPULAR among NBA fans and therefore in NO WAY is he EVER going to start in an ASG. Put that IN your head. Period.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie Jive's Avatar
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    Multipaul is just Mrs. Bargnani, trying to support her son. If I had a kid I'd be hyping him up on forums too .

  6. #46
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    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    Tim- is All Star voting predicated on PER? Last time I checked...it was not......so...simply trying to throw unrelated statistics at your argument does not validate it either. Throw a poll up on this board which asks who people think are the best Centers in the East and I am guessing most will not agree that Lopez is better than Bargs.
    I was responding to this quote which you wrote: "It could also be construed that your conviction that Bogut, Lopez, Horford, Noah, et al are better centers than Bargs is also "bold". "

    And I'm willing to bet money that most people would choose Brook Lopez because he is easily a better player. The ONLY thing Bargnani does better is shoot the 3.

    And is Bargnani going to start ahead of Dwight Howard? No. End of discussion.

  7. #47
    Raptors Republic Starter Mess's Avatar
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    While it's nice to see some positive thinking (or blind faith) about the Raptors it doesn't help that he's making himself out to be a fool...or a troll.

  8. #48
    Raptors Republic All-Star hateslosing's Avatar
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    Their is a scenario that will see Bargs get a chance at the all star team next year and that's if he leads the league in scoring. I know it sounds ridiculous, but let's look at who is going to be back on this team and who we can reasonably anticipate them having. Demar DeRozen, Sonny Weems, and Amir Johnson will be back but does anyone see them realistically taking a whole lot of shots next year? DeRozen will take a few but that's all I see their. So let's say DD takes 10 shots per game, and Amir and Weems take 7 each. Let's say for the sake of argument that Jose is also back as a 35 minute a game guy and he takes 10 shots per game (an increase from 8.4 last year). So so far we have 34 shots spoken for. So let's say whoever fills out the team takes an additional 20 shots and that the Raptors take 80 shots per game (around what they took last season). That leaves Bargs with 26 shots per game, easily enough for him to score upwards of 30 points per game. I personally think that if the young guys don't come in a lot better and BC doesn't make a big move, you're going to see Bargs score a tonne of points every night. And the NBA fan loves a guy who scores, even if his team sucks.

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/TOR/2010.html

    As far as the argument that Bargs played worse when Bosh went down this year, I attribute that to the system being based around Bosh and Bargs played poorly because their was a massive adjustment to be made. I base this on his increasingly competent play toward the end of the season, after there was some to adjust to Bosh's absence. I think if he is made the primary option in training camp, you'll see him step up much better.
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  9. #49
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    Obviously he is. Just look at him. Greatest player ever. I hear Marcus Banks is gonna jion him in the starting rotation at center
    Last name ever, first name greatest

  10. #50
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    Assumption #1: Chris Bosh signs with Miami, leaving us with zilch in return.
    Assumption #2: Amir Johnson becomes the starting PF by default, keeping Bargnani at C.
    Assumption #3: Turk gets traded for trash and/or Andres Nocioni.

    Bosh and Turk leave behind a total of 35 PPG, at least 30 of which will have to be picked up by the remaining players. Is it not plausible that Andrea could chance to add a modest 7-8 of those to his total, and possibly more? That would give him a solid 25-26 PPG to go with his usual 6-7 boards and 1-2 blocks. Judge for yourself if that would be all-star worthy.

    A little optimism never hurt anyone.

  11. #51
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    I can say I think DeRozan will be an All-Star next year. There's no evidence to support that, but I can see a scenario where he gets a lot more shots if Bosh leaves, and makes a big jump in development, but I'm certainly not going to try and come up with an argument why. That would be silly. It's simply an opinion with no basis in fact. It could very well be that Bargnani makes a big developmental jump and becomes an All-Star. It is, however, highly unlikely. In that same mould, I can say that I think that Amir Johnson will average 15-10 next season. Again, there's no basis in fact for that, but he could.

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    u guys can hate as much as u want, just wait and see, and try not to cry ur eyes out when ur 'franchise' bails.

    bargs will be a perennial all star this yr forward.

    respect to the guy with the jeff bridges pic who keeps insulting me. the new tron looks dope, and much more entertaining than ur anti raptors posts

  13. #53
    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Quote Tim W. wrote: View Post
    I can say I think DeRozan will be an All-Star next year.
    One of the boldest and bravest comments we've had here Tim. I can't see it happening based on what I saw this season, but kudos to you for calling it if it does happen.

  14. #54
    Raptors Republic Starter OzRapFan's Avatar
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    I hope he makes the all star team next year... As a member of another team.

  15. #55
    Raptors Republic Superstar Mack North's Avatar
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    Default Andrea Will Never Be The Starting All-Star PF

    Unless that is, of course, hell freezes over and pigs fly(well swine flu last winter, so I guess it's just the first).

    Starters are voted in by fans to begin with, and with the young crop of bigs coming in this season it'll be that much tougher for the big lug. It also doesn't really seem to be in his makeup to become endearing to fans, let alone get a real endorsement deal. Ital Pasta doesn't count.

    For seconders, he doesn't come across as a guy that will step up big in the crunch and will his team to victory. I realize he hasn't had a real opportunity to prove this but his inconsistencies and lackadasical play especially when Bosh was out would lead you to believe he won't be able to do it.

    Thirdsies, I really hope I'm wrong. It ain't freakin' likely.

    Lastly, I'm just throwing out a semi-baseless post hoping to get a rise out of all you Andrea boosters.

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    Last edited by Mack North; Thu Jun 10th, 2010 at 09:29 PM.
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  16. #56
    Raptors Republic Rookie Moon Knight's Avatar
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    Brook Lopez is good, but you have to take into consideration that his team was the worst team in the NBA. He was the man in New Jersey, thus getting all the shots and such. So for now, its really unfair to judge the two even though they have similiar minutes per game.

    Bottom line, it is really unrealistic to see Bargnani to make the allstar team. As someone stated earlier, Derozan has a better chance simply because he has a little more upside, since we've kind of seen all what Andrea could do in a game. Unless he drastically changes his game to a more conventianol approach, but still not losing his three point shot, then he could make the all star team. So as far as predictions go, there really isnt anything to say that Bargnani could successfully operate as the main man in T-Dot....

    or maybe im just suffering from group polarization...

  17. #57
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    Quote OzRapFan wrote: View Post
    I hope he makes the all star team next year... As a member of another team.
    ok, that was friggin funny lol

  18. #58
    Raptors Republic Rookie Moon Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Mack North wrote: View Post
    Unless that is, of course, hell freezes over and pigs fly(well swine flu last winter, so I guess it's just the first).

    Starters are voted in by fans to begin with, and with the young crop of bigs coming in this season it'll be that much tougher for the big lug. It also doesn't really seem to be in his makeup to become endearing to fans, let alone get a real endorsement deal. Ital Pasta doesn't count.

    For seconders, he doesn't come across as a guy that will step up big in the crunch and will his team to victory. I realize he hasn't had a real opportunity to prove this but his inconsistencies and lackadasical play especially when Bosh was out would lead you to believe he won't be able to do it.

    Thirdsies, I really hope I'm wrong. It ain't freakin' likely.

    Lastly, I'm just throwing out a semi-baseless post hoping to get a rise out of all you Andrea boosters.

    Yours Truly,
    Buck Foston
    Well for one, the all star is yes from voters but the voters could also be international (im pretty sure). Since Andrea is an international dude, im pretty sure he'd get votes if he'd produce. Every Italian would vote for him if he got 20 and 8.

    It's the matter if wheather or not he could produce, not his popularity. I'm really not sure if he could produce those kinds of numbers, but im kinda leaning towards him not producing those numbers.

    The only way that Andrea gets those numbers if

    Andera becomes the next Monta Ellis, and takes 25 shots per game and averaging around 20 while the Raps struggle.

  19. #59
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    The all-star starters has always been a popularity contest. That's why we almost saw Allen Iverson and Tracy McGrady voted in as starters. More people who don't watch much ball and who don't know ball all that well vote for the brand names. It's all a popularity contest. Maybe the coaches with select him someday but I don't see him ever beating out the likes of Howard and CB4.

  20. #60
    Raptors Republic Rookie Moon Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    The all-star starters has always been a popularity contest. That's why we almost saw Allen Iverson and Tracy McGrady voted in as starters. More people who don't watch much ball and who don't know ball all that well vote for the brand names. It's all a popularity contest. Maybe the coaches with select him someday but I don't see him ever beating out the likes of Howard and CB4.
    Obviously. But how do you get popular? If you produce. Plus, he has an advantage since he's an international player.

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