Bosh Jersey Burning Party Tonight on Yonge Street

[Mess]

Heinz, Bosh did everything he could do to win. He is who he is. If you want to irrationally hate him for it then go ahead.

VC did the same for most of his time here (with a better team too). People only started hating him because he stopped doing that (and flew to NC for his degree).

Hypothetically, would Lebron be booed relentlessly in Cleveland if he left? I doubt it. If "the most dominant player in the game" leaves his team without getting them a championship and gets cheered, what will it say about Toronto when an All-Star (someone who has never gotten an MVP vote) leaves and gets booed upon his return?

[heinz57]

Heinz, Bosh did everything he could do to win. He is who he is. If you want to irrationally hate him for it then go ahead.

VC did the same for most of his time here (with a better team too). People only started hating him because he stopped doing that (and flew to NC for his degree).

right on dude. that i can agree with. bosh DID do everything he could do, no denying it. but if anything he proved to me that he isnt worth the money of being paid like he's the MAN. max contract franchise players win games. not "do everything he could do to win"... they WIN...

dont get me wrong... i DO NOT hate bosh. in no way would i ever condone jersey burning.

im just not riding his balls like he contributed more to the raptors than danny manning contributed to the clippers.

Hypothetically, would Lebron be booed relentlessly in Cleveland if he left? I doubt it. If "the most dominant player in the game" leaves his team without getting them a championship and gets cheered, what will it say about Toronto when an All-Star (someone who has never gotten an MVP vote) leaves and gets booed upon his return?

YES, Lebron would get booed.

but also, i wouldnt condone booing bosh either. there's no reason for toronto to hate him.. there's just no reason to celebrate his mediocrity. tons of players are good players on shit teams.. bosh isnt special

[James Ballswin (Realizar)]

I've never had a problem with people booing VC, because unlike the media around here I clearly remember him deliberately dogging it in his final season with the team. He earned it.

But this? This is juvenile.

Yes, Bosh may leave. So what? He's a kid, for crying out loud. He wants lots of fame and lots of money like just about anybody else I knew when they were kids. BC tried to keep him here and it didn't work out. You can't exactly blame him after watching the team behind him this past season.

Calderon? Bargs? Turk? PLEASE, SPARE ME!

Let him go in peace and let's try to build a new team with at least just a LITTLE bit of dignity and class. Reporters around the NBA are going to start calling Raps fans a bunch of whining babies.

Grow up!

Bosh is not a kid. He's a grown man.

And his decision is not about money. It's more about WINNING.

If it were about money, he'd just sign with the Raps.

Bosh's decision is more about winning because he's trying to put himself in the best possible position to eventually win a championship. He understands that what comes with winning: fame, respect, celebrated adoration, historical remembrance, and most of all, the successful accomplishment of the highest of career goals and the realization of lifelong dreams (dreams that are shared by people who really love you: your friends and family).

[Vik]

I think the better question is why should we boo a player who took NOTHING from the franchise and gave it 7 great years?

Hell why boo a player that leaves a city for free agency anyways??

Did Bosh have weak defensive skills? HELL YES. I'm certainly not denying that, but I continue to fail to see why he should be DISRESPECTED.

Did he do something to the city or the fans of Toronto? Did he give up? Did he insult us or our city? Did he make life unbearably difficult for BC or Sam Mitchell or Jay Triano? Did he stifle the development of another player for his own ego?

I mean I'm trying to think of reasons why we should BOO a player who set franchise records and did what none of our previous over-heralded "superstars" (Damon, T-Mac, VC) did when they were players.

Nobody boos Mighty Mouse, and really people never booed T-Mac until the VC fiasco.

So what is this? Repressed punishment? Do you feel like Bosh owes us something?

Why should Bosh have to be perfect? Almost all Raptors fans know the man is IMPERFECT. It was a team effort that won us an Atlantic Division chip, but CB4 gave just as much effort as anyone else.

Why aren't we all booing JO? He cost more and gave us less than CB4 ever did.

I'm not saying fans can't be upset. But there's a f'ing huge difference between being upset and disrespecting a player that gave us a FAIR CHANCE. He gave us as much of a chance as any other player did.

heinz57, your comment on "why celebrate a player who never made it out of the first round of the playoffs" is ignorant. I hope you realize that. Do you think we would have even MADE the playoffs without him after VC pussyed out??

Your mentality is that you "expect" things from him. No offense, but the man is not GUTTING our roster to pay for his salary. He hasn't done anything to PREVENT us from making moves. And, if the rumors are true, he might try to send something our way through a S&T if it comes down to that.

Is that the mentality and attitude of a player who deserves to be disrespected?

I'm telling you to treat the man with respect because he took the franchise - whether you like it or not - to places that NO ONE ELSE HAS.

It may have been with a team effort, but he played right along. He didn't have a prima donna attitude and pout when things didn't go his way. He didn't quit on the team. He fought just as hard for this team as any other of the players we love to cheer for (Alvin Williams, JYD, Oak).

So WHY are you insisting that we disrespect him? Is it because we don't like the decision he's making? Is it because you think WE as the fans deserve more from him?

I would love to see the Raptors win and make it out of the 1st round, but it certainly isn't CHRIS BOSH's fault that it didn't happen. But here we are, with you "fans" saying we should crucify him because he didn't do enough.

HE DID MORE THAN ANY OF OUR OTHER SUPERSTARS DID. And did it with a lot less drama and WITHOUT costing our team anything.

Think about that.

That pretty much says it better than I know how to say it in words...

It's not about riding Bosh's balls - no one defending him here is saying he is the greatest or even going to any extreme of appreciating his effort. We're simply saying that to go to the extreme of hating him and booing him is extremely hypocritical because we'd do exactly what he's doing in his position. He's looking out for his own best interests, and all things considered, leaving Toronto is likely to provide a better chance to win a championship than staying here. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

[James Ballswin (Realizar)]

Not one of you pro bosh guys has talked about his defensive numbers declining from when he was 19. Obviously you guys are manipulated by the media. OOhh wait Bosh is a media guy. If you want to bow down to bosh go ahead but to tell half the truth and tell everyone who is anti bosh that they're immature and embarrassing is anti free speech

Okay Frankthetank, I'm coming straight at you. I'm looking right at you. You issued a challenge and I'm accepting it.

• How many teammates has Bosh played with were "definitIvely" better defensively than him?

NONE! ZERO! Fact: ALL of Bosh's teammates have been equally bad or worse defensively.

• How many all-star teammates has Bosh played with?

NONE! ZERO! Fact: Bosh has been the Raps best player since his rookie year (which was the year VC was traded six weeks into the season).

Frankthetank, you and all the other anti bosh guys are exasperatingly irrational, frustratingly short-sighted, illogically narrow-minded and strategically incompetent.

(It's all good and all is forgiven because I totally understand why all you anti bosh guys are like this).

[Vik]

We have a right to be upset. Maybe not jersey-burning upset, but definitely upset. The guy has handled his exit with zero class and deserves to be called on it.

I'll take a page out of Buddahfan's book and draw an analogy to life.

Say that you are on a contract job. In a few months your contract is going to end. You need to start looking for your next job and to ensure that you get paid as well as you think you should. So you work your ass off the last few months before the contract ends and perform very well to highlight your skills and abilities. You've spent 7 years with the current company but there is not enough job satisfaction because you don't find the job rewarding enough. The company has made a few poor personnel decisions in the past, and has not made any real advancement itself against its competitors.

Now, near the end of the contract, you start to get all sorts of interest from competitors. But in order to maintain professionalism, you refrain from committing to anything and continue to work hard as always. All of a sudden, a couple of months before your contract expires, some of the competitors offer you promise of more rewards and greater incentives (aka championships/endorsement deals). This is a major life decision that means you will have to move - move from the place you've grown to call home, from the friends you've made, make new arrangements to see your kid, leave behind your colleagues, and start fresh somewhere else. It finally hits you that leaving your current position is actually something you need to consider. This starts to affect your job negatively. You are still working and performing well, just not at the same level. The company you work for also fails to kick things into high gear and deliver strong results.

As a result, you begin to realize that it might be time to move on. It's recruiting season and you have to make a whole bunch of networking trips - you have to go meet with other companies, and answer any questions regarding your decision. Only problem is that you cannot explicitly commit to anything yet. If you are getting strong interest from 4-5 competitors, and non-stop questions about what you are going to do, what do you do? Do you continually avoid the spotlight and shy away, possibly hurting your chances? Or do you network and put on a smile and go out there and give vague, non-committal answers that leave things open-ended? After all, you have to keep every door open until you can explicitly listen to all the offers and commit to something...

Keep in mind that there is strong speculation rampant because you've proven yourself to be among the best at what you do. So any flames you light with anything you say will be fanned by anyone with an interest until everyone hears what you've said.

[Frankthetank]

James you give no statistical evidence of Bosh's defense. I've never said burn his jersey, i've said i will boo bosh as you should if your raptor fan. I may cheer for him when he gets his name called before the game starts. But will boo Bosh as the opposition. His defense sucks period stats don't lie. I wonder what his man averaged per game..

[Vik]

Kind of lost track myself there, but the point was that he hasn't really shown lack of class. He is an athlete, and a celebrity. By nature he seeks the spotlight, and by the nature of the business he is put in a situation where he is constantly being questioned about his decision.

Lack of class would be bad-mouthing the Raptors, or openly declaring he is definitely not coming back (which he has yet to do btw). Lack of class would have been whining during the season or forcing BC's hand or requesting a trade. Lack of class would have been quitting on the team openly or not being an at-least neutral locker room presence. Bosh has done none of these things. In my mind he's actually been pretty professional, and right now he's doing what he needs to in order to maximize his opportunities the next couple of months.

If you guys don't like his decision, fine - feel free to hold it against him. The booing is then more because you feel rejected as a fan than it is because what he did is wrong. If that's why you're booing or burning jerseys, then have the balls to say it. But please don't frame it like he's somehow been an ass or a villain of some sort. Sure he could have been a better basketball player at times, and sure not all of us liked him. But using his decision as an athlete aspiring to win - a decision almost all of us would probably mimic i n his shoes - as an excuse is just not right.

[Doc]

Good discussion going, but you guys do realize the comment was a joke right? That being said, I was gullible enough to originally believe it. No one was burning Bosh's jersey. Just a mocking of the all the protests that have been going on for the last couple days.

[6264]

Okay Frankthetank, I'm coming straight at you. I'm looking right at you. You issued a challenge and I'm accepting it.

• How many teammates has Bosh played with that were "definitIvely" better defensively than him?

NONE! ZERO!

Fact: ALL of Bosh's teammates have been equally bad or worse defensively.

• How many all-star teammates has Bosh played with?

NONE! ZERO!

Fact: Bosh has been the Raps best player since his rookie year (which was the year VC was traded six weeks into the season).

Frankthetank, you and all the other anti bosh guys are exasperatingly irrational, frustratingly short-sighted, illogically narrow-minded and strategically incompetent. (I also understand why all you anti bosh guys are like this).

+1. Any rational Raptors fan would understand that individuals players cannot win games within good/great/all-star players around them. In Bosh's case, he did whatever he could to make his team better. Honestly James, take the higher road and not reply to these people because I'm not sure if they're trolling or they actually believe that Bosh's jersey should be burned.

[Multipaul]

So it was just a joke. too bad. this city poured it's heart out for cb4 despite the fact that he was such an underachiever. that last game of the season he just walked out of the acc...no feigned goodbye or wave to the crowd, just a smirk and a face that said 'im outta here'.

i agree with that dude that said cb is 'the enemy' now. he has expressed no allegiance to the team or the city, and is whoring himself mercilessly to reporters trying to beef up his exposure. 'miami is a contender', 'im waiting for lebron'...dude...go f*ck urself. arsenalist is right, zero class.

people, cb4 does not give a f*ck about u or the raptors. hate to say it but u will have to let it go and realize he could care less about this fanbase. i absolutely cannot wait for his first game here on an opposing team. i hope demar knees him in the nuts like pierce...or maybe reggie will give him the kaman special

all hail the NEW AND IMPROVED raptors

[heinz57]

+1. Any rational Raptors fan would understand that individuals players cannot win games within good/great/all-star players around them. In Bosh's case, he did whatever he could to make his team better. Honestly James, take the higher road and not reply to these people because I'm not sure if they're trolling or they actually believe that Bosh's jersey should be burned.

im not going through the whole thread... but im pretty sure nobody has actually said "yes, i agree with burning his jersey"

[Buddahfan]

You're comparison is completely off the mark.

You can't compare a personal family relationship to a professional business career.

I'll say it again.

Answer the following question:

If any of you put yourself in Bosh's shoes, would you, in all honesty, choose to re-sign with the Raps after having spent 7 seasons struggling to earn a playoff berth, given the numerous opportunities to play with SIGNIFICANTLY more talented teammates and have a legitimate chance to play in a NBA finals series and a realistic chance to win a championship?

Answer the question and say you still hate Bosh.

I completely disagree with your comment about my assessment being off the mark. The reason is simple

In both types of relationships the party that is left holding the jersey has invested a lot of emotion and in some cases love into the relationship. They have given seven years of their life, now I am talking about the fans and jilted lover, not MLSE, to caring about this person, spent money on this person and put a great deal of their soul into this person.

Then one day this person says "screw you, I don't care about your feelings. I need to take care of my own feelings and needs."

Well fine for them. They are entitled to do that.

However no one, unless they have never loved, can ever tell me with a straight and honest face, that when that person they invested 7 years of emotion and love in, gives them the finger for whatever reason that the person left behind is not going to be hurt and mad.

Only a person incapable of feeling and love would not be frustrated and mad. Burning a jersey is a heck of a lot better way to help deal with these feelings of abandonment by a loved one than breaking store front windows, over turning cars, beating the dog etc.

It is a healthy response to a normal healthy feeling that one gets when they have been jilted by someone that means a great deal to to them.

If you or anyone can not grasp this I feel sorry for you because you have lived an emotionally empty life.

[heinz57]

So it was just a joke. too bad.

except this dude... i think he'd burn his jersey

[Arsenalist]

I'll take a page out of Buddahfan's book and draw an analogy to life.

Say that you are on a contract job. In a few months your contract is going to end. You need to start looking for your next job and to ensure that you get paid as well as you think you should. So you work your ass off the last few months before the contract ends and perform very well to highlight your skills and abilities. You've spent 7 years with the current company but there is not enough job satisfaction because you don't find the job rewarding enough. The company has made a few poor personnel decisions in the past, and has not made any real advancement itself against its competitors.

Now, near the end of the contract, you start to get all sorts of interest from competitors. But in order to maintain professionalism, you refrain from committing to anything and continue to work hard as always. All of a sudden, a couple of months before your contract expires, some of the competitors offer you promise of more rewards and greater incentives (aka championships/endorsement deals). This is a major life decision that means you will have to move - move from the place you've grown to call home, from the friends you've made, make new arrangements to see your kid, leave behind your colleagues, and start fresh somewhere else. It finally hits you that leaving your current position is actually something you need to consider. This starts to affect your job negatively. You are still working and performing well, just not at the same level. The company you work for also fails to kick things into high gear and deliver strong results.

As a result, you begin to realize that it might be time to move on. It's recruiting season and you have to make a whole bunch of networking trips - you have to go meet with other companies, and answer any questions regarding your decision. Only problem is that you cannot explicitly commit to anything yet. If you are getting strong interest from 4-5 competitors, and non-stop questions about what you are going to do, what do you do? Do you continually avoid the spotlight and shy away, possibly hurting your chances? Or do you network and put on a smile and go out there and give vague, non-committal answers that leave things open-ended? After all, you have to keep every door open until you can explicitly listen to all the offers and commit to something...

Keep in mind that there is strong speculation rampant because you've proven yourself to be among the best at what you do. So any flames you light with anything you say will be fanned by anyone with an interest until everyone hears what you've said.

Now say while I'm under contract I publicly start asking everyone in the world what they think I should do, thus pissing off the shareholders of my existing company in the process, all the while making my existing company look really bad. Then I (while I'm still under contract) hold a public meeting with employees of other firms where I put myself up for sale, giving the impression to everyone watching that my existing company is crap and that I have zero intention of returning. Not to mention, telling "friends" and media "sources" the same, thus hurting any compensation my company would get for me.

Of course, this is after you bail out on your company when they needed you most.

Look, I understand why Bosh is leaving, as I wrote on ESPN two months ago, Bosh shouldn't be blamed for leaving town, it should be Colangelo who should be held accountable for not dealing with the situation.

http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/p...423/chris-bosh

But that doesn't change the fact that instead of dealing with the matter privately behind closed doors, he's let stuff leak out to the media via Twitter, his friends, and that stupid free-agent summit.