View Poll Results: Grade Bargnani's game.

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  • A

    9 7.03%
  • B

    47 36.72%
  • C

    30 23.44%
  • D

    19 14.84%
  • F

    23 17.97%
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Thread: Everything Bargnani: The Legend Continues

  1. #1121
    Raptors Republic Starter matt's Avatar
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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    I think out of the 10-11 boards per game that Bosh averaged during his all-star years in Toronto, I'm sure Bargnani can find 1-2 rebounds out of that.
    Of course, it's all about trying the find those hidden rebounds isn't it? if it was the case, what happen to those missing rebounds he could of "find" instead of the disgusting 5.4 rebs/games he had the last five games of the season? apparently somebody stole it from him eh?

  2. #1122
    Super Moderator MangoKid's Avatar
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    Quote matt wrote: View Post
    Of course, it's all about trying the find those hidden rebounds isn't it? if it was the case, what happen to those missing rebounds he could of "find" instead of the disgusting 5.4 rebs/games he had the last five games of the season? apparently somebody stole it from him eh?
    The guy averages better than 6 boards a game last season. Most of the rebounds our team collected last season was by a guy who is no longer with us. Our third leading rebounder is also gone. If you don't believe that Bargnani can increase his rpg by 1-2, then I'd really like to know is who you think is going to be collecting the rebounds? Are those 10-11 rpg that was gobbled up by Bosh gonna find it's way to the opposition's hands for second and third chance baskets?

  3. #1123
    Raptors Republic Rookie RaptorRoo's Avatar
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    Quote sirchillymost wrote: View Post
    what do you know about balls (tony montana voice)- mr. Vagina monologues aka raptorroo...............

    As for frankthetank he pm'd this facetious balderdash the other day:
    http://raptorsrepublic.com/forums/pr...owpm&pmid=2197
    i don't like you lol
    just wanted to tell you that you suck as a raptors basher. I'd like to see you broken over triano's knee's lol. This forum isn't for guys from bc its from guys from ontario where the raptors play. There are many blogs and boards to talk basketball please take your negativity to those blogs and boards. Thank-you in advance


    btw- i don't want frankthetank to get banned over such a sure bet only to re-register under another alias......lol

    like i said...you don't have the balls to take up frank on his bet....

    And you sure as hell don't have the balls to take me on you little bitch

    i'll make you my girlfriend madam chilly bitch

  4. #1124
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    Quote RaptorRoo wrote: View Post
    like i said...you don't have the balls to take up frank on his bet....

    And you sure as hell don't have the balls to take me on you little bitch

    i'll make you my girlfriend madam chilly bitch
    Just like the hook is this klassic Boogie Down Production track- U Must Learn.....


  5. #1125
    Raptors Republic Starter matt's Avatar
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    Quote MangoKid wrote: View Post
    The guy averages better than 6 boards a game last season. Most of the rebounds our team collected last season was by a guy who is no longer with us. Our third leading rebounder is also gone. If you don't believe that Bargnani can increase his rpg by 1-2, then I'd really like to know is who you think is going to be collecting the rebounds? Are those 10-11 rpg that was gobbled up by Bosh gonna find it's way to the opposition's hands for second and third chance baskets?
    I forgot to mention the last five games were without Bosh in the lineup, thats worser than his 6 rebounds per game he had, so in theory, he was a BETTER rebounder when Bosh was playing with him. And I don't even want to look at his pts/game w/o Bosh, Im just going to hope he at least improves in that area.

  6. #1126
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    Quote matt wrote: View Post
    I forgot to mention the last five games were without Bosh in the lineup, thats worser than his 6 rebounds per game he had, so in theory, he was a BETTER rebounder when Bosh was playing with him. And I don't even want to look at his pts/game w/o Bosh, Im just going to hope he at least improves in that area.
    All the RR folks who think that Barg's is going to get Bosh's rebounds or the rebounds that Bosh stole from Bargnani & teammates(lol). How? If he's always camped out at the 3pt line? When Bosh was injured Bargnani didn't step up in my mind.

  7. #1127
    Raptors Republic All-Star RaptorsFan4Life's Avatar
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    I voted 9 in hopes it'll come true.

  8. #1128
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    Default Why Isn't Bargnani The Raptor's Go To Guy On Offense In 2010-11?

    The former number one overall NBA draft pick whom has been coddled ever since he set foot in TO now has the pressure that CB faced lifted off of him with both BC & Jay stating in various media reports that the Raptor's have no go to guy on offense and will move the ball around in 2010-11 after it was getting stuck in the hands of Mr 20 & 10 the past few years..

    Am I missing something here? I thought Bargnani was drafted #1 overall by BC to be a Franchise player- especially by year 5? Now he's just another option on offense on a team void of any proven leading scorers?

    The rotten PR stench coming from BC & company all summer long makes the Raptor's come off as politicians politicking to voters- the more you tell a lie over & over the more some people tend to believe it- especially fans aka fanatics. Image means everything, reality nothing.

    I may not like Bargnani's overall game but the one thing he can do is SCORE in a variety of ways it's just that he's has not been consistently aggressive or productive enough with the ball during his NBA career in my mind. I still think that with a consistent post game he could be a 20 ppg scorer for TO but it's not his offense that worries me it his DEFENSE or lack of conceptual understanding of team defense & his anemic rebounding numbers. If Bargnani could just average 8 or 9 rebounds (while boxing out consistently) a game it would make a load of difference in the paint for TO.

    But now is Bargnani's time to show & prove or as Young MC would say Bust A Move:


    Any thoughts?

    Last edited by SirChillyMost; Thu Sep 30th, 2010 at 02:45 PM.

  9. #1129
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    I think Bargnani is absolutely the go to guy. He was almost taking as many shots as Bosh last year.

  10. #1130
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    Quote Apollo wrote: View Post
    I think Bargnani is absolutely the go to guy. He was almost taking as many shots as Bosh last year.
    I agree.

    But can anyone help me to understand all this rhetoric coming from BC & Jay to the contrary?

    Are they trying to sneak Bargnani up on people in his 5th year?

    Trying to reduce his pressure, expectations to score?

    Just reciting more premeditated MLSE Raptor marketing strategy & PR media spins?

    I thought BC was so sure that Bargnani would be the man when he drafted him #1 overall back in 2006- especially by year 5 according to BC stated particulars in the media.

  11. #1131
    Administrator Apollo's Avatar
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    Quote SirChillyMost wrote: View Post
    Trying to reduce his pressure, expectations to score?
    I think you hit the nail on the head right here. I think they're spinning it like he's not "the guy" when in reality he's going to get his number called more than anyone else and especially at important moments of the game. That is, unless DeMar launches off and reaches orbit this year.

    Not labeling Bargnani "the guy" deflects some pressure off him.

  12. #1132
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    Like it or not, Bargnani is the best Raptors player and he will be the go to guy. I think he will struggle in the beginning of season to adjust to more tight defense than last years when he had CB4 drawing double-team attention.

  13. #1133
    Raptors Republic Starter blaze89's Avatar
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    4 words baby, number 1 draft pick

    either way you look at it he was supposed to be their go to guy since he came in the league and as of now he's it by default because there is no one else. like it or not, right now he is the team
    Last edited by blaze89; Thu Sep 30th, 2010 at 04:03 PM.

  14. #1134
    Raptors Republic Starter Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote SirChillyMost wrote: View Post
    The former number one overall NBA draft pick whom has been coddled ever since he set foot in TO now has the pressure that CB faced lifted off of him with both BC & Jay stating in various media reports that the Raptor's have no go to guy on offense and will move the ball around in 2010-11 after it was getting stuck in the hands of Mr 20 & 10 the past few years..

    Am I missing something here? I thought Bargnani was drafted #1 overall by BC to be a Franchise player- especially by year 5? Now he's just another option on offense on a team void of any proven leading scorers?

    The rotten PR stench coming from BC & company all summer long makes the Raptor's come off as politicians politicking to voters- the more you tell a lie over & over the more some people tend to believe it- especially fans aka fanatics. Image means everything, reality nothing.

    I may not like Bargnani's overall game but the one thing he can do is SCORE in a variety of ways it's just that he's has not been consistently aggressive or productive enough with the ball during his NBA career in my mind. I still think that with a consistent post game he could be a 20 ppg scorer for TO but it's not his offense that worries me it his DEFENSE or lack of conceptual understanding of team defense & his anemic rebounding numbers. If Bargnani could just average 8 or 9 rebounds (while boxing out consistently) a game it would make a load of difference in the paint for TO.

    Any thoughts?
    Thanks for the insight Chilly - I have to fully agree with absolutely everything there... I think everyone is worried that Andrea is going to buckle under the pressure (which may be a valid concern) so they're holding off on the "face of the franchise" thing... Given the circumstance it's probably best - It's better to wait and see who deserves such a moniker (if anyone).
    When Tom Chambers dunks an NBA player gets their hops...

  15. #1135
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    If by go-to guy you mean most number of plays called for him, then yes I agree that he is. But if you mean one who you'd want taking that last second shot, or the one whom you can rely on to carry the team when everyone else is in a slump...then no I don't think he is.

    First off, he isn't that good at creating his own shot. So when a play is broken and the shot clock is winding down, putting the ball in his hands isn't really a good idea (often leads to a bad forced shot). He can blow by a slower big, and post up a smaller guy, but doesn't do it consistently or effectively enough (yet). He is also very very inconsistent, and relying on him to carry the scoring load night in and night out is a bad idea. And I think the coaches know this and are thus trying to involve everyone else in the offense. And lastly, I believe the coaches know that, once the opposing team draws up a defensive scheme for Bargnani, there's little the guy can do to counter it effectively. He just isn't that good (yet) or experienced imo.

    Now this could all change during the season, and we see a much better, much improved Bargnani, but neither we nor the coaches can state that as fact at this point. Putting it all on his shoulders just because he was drafted number 1 isn't really fair to the guy. He definitely needs to step up (a lot), but so does the rest of the team if they want to succeed. It's on EVERYONE.

  16. #1136
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    Quote jlongs wrote: View Post
    Putting it all on his shoulders just because he was drafted number 1 isn't really fair to the guy.
    I wholeheartedly agree. It wasn't his own choice to be a #1 pick. I think it's unfair the way players like Kwame Brown, Araujo and Darko are the punchlines of a million jokes because of another person's decision. As much as they suck in the NBA context, they would humiliate 99% of the world population on a basketball court. Whatever, lol. They got their millions.

    Back to the original topic though, it's been beaten to death already. Bargnani will probably be the focal point of the offence (but probably not by much, I think); whether he has the talent for that role remains to be seen, even if things aren't looking spectacular right now.

  17. #1137
    Raptors Republic Starter minks77's Avatar
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    Every time I get hopeful and I start feeling like he's really showing progress, he regress'. Case in point: The end stretch of last season with Bosh out Andrea disappeared. It wasn't even about "stepping up" he didn't play up to his own level, he faded. His post game started off improved at both ends last season but that too disappeared when the going got tough. I see the flashes but Andrea as the go-to guy is far fetched IMO. I think his game screams role player, not top dog.

  18. #1138
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    Most definitely.

  19. #1139
    Raptors Republic All-Star Balls of Steel's Avatar
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    He's not even option 2 in my opinion. He'll never be the main option because he's Dirk Nowitzki 2.0 with 5 years worth of bball IQ regression. Yes, he's Euro, 7-feet tall and can knock the three's - 34% of the time. However, the difference between him and Dirk is not the physical and offensive skill set. It's the basketball IQ. Perhaps I'm the first to acknowledge this but it's his IQ. He simply does not strike me as a smart player. He's slow on defense but his positioning and help D is atrocious (that's IQ). Every time someone penetrates the zone, he acts like a 2 year-old trying to defend a home broken in by burglars.

    I know that this thread is on offense but I feel that the more attention is made about his defence or lack thereof, the more he's likely to tail off on his offensive talents. Hence the need to switch his position to the 4. Less emphasis on defence and more on offence. That way, the media and fans can get off his ass about how he's got the defensive mindset of a sea-horse. The latest moves made and now the attempt to bring in Dampier is just another one of BC's long strings of attempts to feature Bargs as the second coming of Dirk. He'll go down with Andrea one way or another.
    “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

  20. #1140
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    Default Top 10 Bargnani Myths

    A very interesting find that I wanted to share with all the RR folks to get your feedback on this on-point breakdown (in my mind) of Bargnani's skills & hype. Click on the provided link for myth breakdowns # 9 - 1.

    http://www.wearingfilm.com/picketfen...drea-bargnani/

    10. BARGNANI IS A TOP TEN CENTER

    There was a poll recently on Raptors Republic that asked whether Bargnani is a top ten center. Half of the respondents answered yes, which was rather disconcerting. I’m not sure whether these people simply HOPE he’ll be a top ten center, or whether they just value offense over defense and rebounding, but the way Bargnani is right now, he’s not.

    The main argument seems to be that Bargnani is such a great scorer that he’s obviously a top ten center. Well, not quite. First of all, according to ESPN, Bargnani was 6th among centers in scoring this season, a hair above Al Jefferson. It’s certainly not ridiculous to argue that he has a chance to be the top scoring center in the league this season. No center scored more than 20.2 ppg last season and without Bosh, it’s possible Bargnani could average more than that.

    And while it’s certainly possible, although no probable, that Bargnani could end up being the top scoring center, does that automatically make him a top ten center? Well, no. Again, that brings us back to defense and rebounding.

    Last season, Bargnani was 45th in the league in rebounding, despite being 42nd in minutes per game. 16 centers grabbed more rebounds than Bargnani did last season. All but 2 played fewer minutes than Bargnani. Per minute, Bargnani is even worse. He’s 79th overall or 30th in rebounding among centers. In fact, Bargnani was the second worst rebounding center in the entire league, ahead of only Ryan Hollins. And the only PFs who are worse rebounders are guys like Jeff Green and Rashard Lewis, who are naturally small forwards. Needless to say, Bargnani is a very, very poor rebounder.

    Just looking at his statistics, Bargnani certainly isn’t a top ten center. John Hollinger’s PER is renowned for not paying attention to defense, and last season Bargnani was 27th among centers. However much I don’t like the PER rating, it does give a good idea of the on court production of a player. What I don’t like is that it doesn’t properly take into consideration defense. Of course, defense isn’t a Bargnani strong suit, either.

    Bargnani is a pretty good post defender, in certain circumstances, but he’s certainly a poor defender overall. So if not even the PER rating, which mostly ignores defense, doesn’t place him in the top ten, why on earth would anyone rank him that high if you include defense?

    Offensively, I’d say he is a top ten center. Overall, there’s no way.

    Just for the record, here are the centers I believe are inarguably better than Bargnani. Notice there are more than 10. And keep in mind I only included legit centers, so no David Lee, Al Jefferson or even Tim Duncan, who probably is a center, but is generally listed as a PF.

    In no particular order:

    Dwight Howard
    Brook Lopez
    Andrew Bogut
    Andrew Bynum
    Greg Oden
    Chris Kaman
    Joakim Noah
    Marc Gasol
    Al Horford
    Nene
    Mehmet Okur
    Yao Ming
    Marcus Camby
    Kendrick Perkins


    Most are not the scorer that Bargnani is, but all are better defenders and rebounders than Bargnani is.END

    Other Bargnani myths discussed on the blog link:

    9. BARGNANI IS A GOOD INTERIOR DEFENDER BECAUSE HE BLOCKS A LOT OF SHOTS

    8. BARGNANI IS A GOOD PASSER

    7. BARGNANI SHOULD REBOUND BETTER WITHOUT BOSH

    6. BARGNANI HAS IMPROVED EVERY YEAR IN THE NBA

    5. BARGNANI IS A GREAT SCORER

    4. BARGNANI HAS NOT BEEN GIVEN A CHANCE TO SHINE

    3. BARGNANI IS LIKE DIRK NOWITZKI OR PAU GASOL

    2. BARGNANI IS REALLY A POWER FORWARD

    1. I HATE BARGNANI AND AM BEING TOO HARD ON HIM
    Last edited by SirChillyMost; Mon Oct 4th, 2010 at 02:15 PM.

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