View Poll Results: Grade Bargnani's game.

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  • A

    9 7.09%
  • B

    47 37.01%
  • C

    30 23.62%
  • D

    18 14.17%
  • F

    23 18.11%
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Thread: Everything Bargnani: The Legend Continues

  1. #741
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    LOL, ur awesome dude. I will wait until your manifesto drops, let me know when it hits amazon.com so i can buy the kindle version of it
    Its already out in numerous books by numerous authors throughout the world
    No need for me to reinvent the wheel.

    If I spent my time dong that I would add nothing to what has already be published and worst of all it would take my time away from from my first two loves, hoops and hi-tech

    #Stop
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  2. #742
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    Quote Multipaul wrote: View Post
    Your arrogance is paralleled only by the ridiculousness of your avatar.

    This thread was entitled Bargnani Appreciation Thread- then you Bosh loving sycophants bombard it with your typical anti Bargs, anti Raptors, "lets tank this season and rely on the 'YGZ'" attitude.

    Am i not allowed to defend the premise of this thread? it was not the "lets defend Bargs thread".

    Maybe you can start a "i want to whine and b*tch when other members dont agree with me thread" , i promise i wont post on it
    yea but then defend your opinion with something of value... the last 10 posts by multipaul have all just been insults and links to web sites not even related to basketball.

  3. #743
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Multipaul

    You are trolling this website.

    #Pause
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    “As a captain, I played furiously. I drew a lot of fouls, but I brought everything I had to every practice and to every game. I left everything on the court because I simply wanted the team to win”
    Quote from well known personality who led their high school team to a state championship.

  4. #744
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    Quote Buddahfan wrote: View Post
    Multipaul

    You are trolling this website.

    #Pause
    I take offense to that, show up to the ACC and you will see me at almost everygame. I pour lots of time and cash into this team.

    You live in LA, you are trolling this site, you are probably a spy for the Clippers.

  5. #745
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    Quote Raptors4life wrote: View Post
    Chris Bosh Fucking Sucks! Really That Guy Never Ever showed up against big teams! Fuck that guy! How many times the motherfucker got dunk on! I so Happy When Paul Pierce Dunk all over his Rupaul ass! That guy was a straight pussy honestly! He did not nothing when he was here! And I hate this fucking city because they don't know shit about basketball period. All you mother fuckers who hate are Andrea are fucking dumb! Honestly fucking jack asses to the 3rd degree! If you want to compare Bosh to Bargnani let's do it! I can name OVER HUNDREDS THINGS BARGNANI IS BETTER CHRIS BOSH! Barg's has a better jumper, first step, handles, iq, court vision, athlete, composure and he his a way better defender than Bosh! And what you Fucking Morons don't understand know one can guard Barg's period! Did you see watch the LAKER GAME LAST YEAR! WHO WON THAT GAME! IL MAGO... The Best Front Court in the NBA could not handle Bargs! and ask your self this WTF!!!! did chris Bosh do when he was here! he won 3 playoff games and lost 8 in 7 years wow... that is so amazing! Yeah he's best! Fuck Chris Bosh Is Fucking PUssy I Good Motherfucking Riddens
    This is the best, do you mind if i print this comment on a t shirt!! I would wear it proudly!

  6. #746
    Administrator Dr. James Naismith's Avatar
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    Guys, can we please refrain from using the "F-Bomb" as much as its being thrown around right now. Let's be a little more civil. Please get this conversation back on track because its quickly heading the direction of this thread being closed shortly.

    Thanks.

  7. #747
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    Quote Doc Naismith wrote: View Post
    Guys, can we please refrain from using the "F-Bomb" as much as its being thrown around right now. Let's be a little more civil. Please get this conversation back on track because its quickly heading the direction of this thread being closed shortly.

    Thanks.
    Wordup. Love the avatar pic too, can't wait to see the Blur in action.
    Last edited by Multipaul; Thu Aug 26th, 2010 at 06:00 PM.

  8. #748
    Raptors Republic Rookie dzoni71's Avatar
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    Quote Buddahfan wrote: View Post
    Thanks makes sense and would explain what the TV talking heads are saying.

    For the most part I wasn't too enthusiastic about the Raptor euro-trend as their defensive deficiencies were exposed in the NBA, but there is one unheard player I want to share with you - Jan Vesely. He's a 6'11' small forward, yup that is correct a 6'11'' small forward!!! He is incredibly athletic for a Euro, runs the floor, finishes on the fast break and is an excellent offensive rebounder. His main defficiency which is kind of ironic (since he's a Euro) is his jump shot, but since he is only 20 years old that can change. I would love to see this guy in Raptor uniform as he would address all the Rap needs and fit perfectly with what Raps are trying to do. Even better I think he would love TO, unlike the usual African-American.
    Here's the link:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zlB5w08_Es
    Enjoy!!!

  9. #749
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    Quote dzoni71 wrote: View Post
    For the most part I wasn't too enthusiastic about the Raptor euro-trend as their defensive deficiencies were exposed in the NBA, but there is one unheard player I want to share with you - Jan Vesely. He's a 6'11' small forward, yup that is correct a 6'11'' small forward!!! He is incredibly athletic for a Euro, runs the floor, finishes on the fast break and is an excellent offensive rebounder. His main defficiency which is kind of ironic (since he's a Euro) is his jump shot, but since he is only 20 years old that can change. I would love to see this guy in Raptor uniform as he would address all the Rap needs and fit perfectly with what Raps are trying to do. Even better I think he would love TO, unlike the usual African-American.
    Here's the link:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zlB5w08_Es
    Enjoy!!!
    Good height and shooting mechanics. I also love that he does not shy from contact. I would take a chance on him at the SF position and the fact that he defends the post makes him versatile enough to play the PF position in spurts. Not bad for a mid first round pick where the combination of the TPE and expiring contracts can make a deal getting a late teens(18,19,20) or early 20's(21,22,23,24) from a late Miami's first round pick(28,29,30).

  10. #750
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    Quote Buddahfan wrote: View Post
    That is why I think that the Raptors will be a lot better than many think.

    Johnson so far in his career hasn't put up the greatest individual box score numbers, but he makes the other guys on the court better as shown by the advanced metrics whereas Bosh does not. I have mentioned this a number of times.

    Whether Johnson's ability to make the other four players on the court with him better will carry over if he becomes a starter in 10-11 remains to be seen. My guess is that if he can manage to stay on the court 30 + mpg that by the end of 2010 that his play on the court with the starters will contribute to making them better though maybe not to the extent that he has done in the past playing primarily with and against second unit players but still positive and not negative.

    Though who knows eventually how good he could become in a couple of season if he manages to be able to stay on the court for 30+ mpg for the entire 10-11 season.
    mosales hits it squarely on the head with his description of what RuPaul did for anyone else's game but his own...ZERO. Which is why I believe that Bargnani and Amir will actually be a much better pairing with time provided the coach is not stupid. Both are currently unselfish, skilled big men who can see the value in each other and what that means to the team and their own games, so they can prosper together. This could never really happen with that selfish prick RuPaul as everything and everyone was always about making sure he was happy. This team has the abilty to actually be better than they were last year with the right coaching and a little time, and at minimum will be way more fun to watch without that girly haired douchebag RuPaul on our team.

  11. #751
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    Quote Buddahfan wrote: View Post
    So do you think that Bargnani is tough?

    I sure don't.

    I think he is soft like Neapolitan ice cream that has been setting outside in the summer sun for 20 minutes or more.
    I never said Bargnani is tough, although I have seen him play tough defense an not back down to anyone including Shaq, Duncan, Howard and play them effectively too. It does not take flagrant fouls to be tough. I don't see your pretty boy Amir taking flagrants or being tough, and RuPaul did not get his nickname kicking ass. Who exactly on the Raptors squad this year or last do you think is tougher than Bargnani? DD has shown no toughness, Weems nothing, RuPaul enough said, Amir no, Turdoloo nyet, Jack yes. The lineup they have right now has some possibility in Davis, Alabi, Kleiza, Bargnani, Jack.
    How about tough enough to play when injured as Bargnani has with sprained ankles, bad backs, and the stomach flu versus pussies like girly haired RuPaul sitting when he was cleared to play and the team was fighting for a PLAYOFF SPOT. That is my idea of a weak pussy player who showed the toughness of a bunny rabbit.
    I would like to see Bargnani develop the mental toughness to play hard all the time, and demand the ball more from his teamates.
    Your whole argument about Euro's being soft does not wash as the Euro league allows more contact than the NBA. The NBA has had to limit contact because it is full of idiots that could not control themselves if they were allowed more contact.
    Also generalising is bullshit because Gasol is as tough or tougher than any American player, as are Amundson, Delfino and many others who are not American, and as were Divac, Garbahosa etc...
    It just so happens that most non American players come here because of their superior basketball skills not their superior flagrant foul skills.

  12. #752
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Default Bargnani's Euro Numbers This Summer & An Interesting Comparison

    As I remember Bargs fans were raving about his numbers in summer league games for Italy.

    Just to put into perspective.

    Pops playing for Great Britain today


    Basketball: GB qualify
    Britain book spot at European Championships after seeing off Bosnia

    Last updated: 26th August 2010 Subscribe to RSS Feed
    Basketball: GB qualify

    Deng: Came alive for 38 points

    Great Britain booked their spot at next year's European Championships after a 94-85 overtime victory against Bosnia & Herzegovina.

    Chicago Bulls star Luol Deng scored 38 points while Pops Mensah-Bonsu grabbed 32 as well as dominating the paint with 21 rebounds during a tense contest at the Echo Arena in Liverpool.
    According to this tweet Pops also had 4 blocks.

    ! RT @teamziller: Deng had 38/13 in Britain's huge win. Pops Mensah-Bonsu had 32/21/4. BALLERS.

    http://www.skysports.com/story/0,195...340488,00.html

    http://twitter.com/NickFlynt
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    “As a captain, I played furiously. I drew a lot of fouls, but I brought everything I had to every practice and to every game. I left everything on the court because I simply wanted the team to win”
    Quote from well known personality who led their high school team to a state championship.

  13. #753
    Raptors Republic Starter jeff_hostetler's Avatar
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    I'll never for the life of me understand why we kept POB, who never played a god danged second in any minute of any game that was the least bit important or meaningful, while cutting Pops, who, while he was a Raptor, was deemed good enough to get rotation minutes - however meagre. The guy, regardless of how "reckless" or "unpolished" or whatever word the organization would use to describe him as not being worthy, can flat play. He was a guy that grabbed boards, on a team whose biggest failure was not grabbing boards. Yet he was cut and sent out of the league, while POB got paid to literally do nothing. It's astounding, really.

  14. #754
    Administrator Arsenalist's Avatar
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    Quote jeff_hostetler wrote: View Post
    I'll never for the life of me understand why we kept POB, who never played a god danged second in any minute of any game that was the least bit important or meaningful, while cutting Pops, who, while he was a Raptor, was deemed good enough to get rotation minutes - however meagre. The guy, regardless of how "reckless" or "unpolished" or whatever word the organization would use to describe him as not being worthy, can flat play. He was a guy that grabbed boards, on a team whose biggest failure was not grabbing boards. Yet he was cut and sent out of the league, while POB got paid to literally do nothing. It's astounding, really.
    Totally agree, I would rather never have traded Will Solomon. Always liked Pops, he brought the energy if not the intelligence, but at least he brought something. I have never seen POB EVER have two good possessions in a row. The guy has major effort issues and the worst part is that he thinks he's trying very hard to stay in the NBA. The guy is the definition of soft.

  15. #755
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    Seriously Buddahfan you need to get a life. Why do you feel the need to bash our best player at least 3-4 times a day? This thread is so comical its not even funny. Are you seriously comparing Pops, who has bounced from team to team because he cant hold a permanent job,to someone who averages almost 20 points a game in the NBA? Say what you want about his defence, but the truth is Bosh, who most were willing to give max money to, was even worse and provided 3 more rebounds and 5 more points. In my eyes we are getting great value in Bargnani, far more then we would if we maxed out Bosh.

    Also if you bothered to watch any of the games, what has people excited is that the majority of the points he's scoring are in the paint. He is second in scoring, 8th in rebounding and second in blocks for the tournament as the primary option on offence.

  16. #756
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Quote johnp wrote: View Post
    Seriously Buddahfan you need to get a life. Why do you feel the need to bash our best player at least 3-4 times a day? This thread is so comical its not even funny. Are you seriously comparing Pops, who has bounced from team to team because he cant hold a permanent job,to someone who averages almost 20 points a game in the NBA? Say what you want about his defence, but the truth is Bosh, who most were willing to give max money to, was even worse and provided 3 more rebounds and 5 more points. In my eyes we are getting great value in Bargnani, far more then we would if we maxed out Bosh.

    Also if you bothered to watch any of the games, what has people excited is that the majority of the points he's scoring are in the paint. He is second in scoring, 8th in rebounding and second in blocks for the tournament as the primary option on offence.
    I watched a lot of the games last season.

    Bargnani will not be the Raptors best player in 10-11. He might even turn out to be only their 3rd or 4th best.

    Using summer league Euro play to say that Bargnani is going to become the next Dirk is just out of touch with reality.

    Why do you think that almost everyone thinks the Raptors are going to be so bad?

    The reason is because all these people believe that Bargnani is the Raptors best player.

    If they realized that he will be maybe only their 3rd or 4th best then they would be ranking the Raptors higher like I am.

    You my friend are in a state of cognitive dissonance when it comes to Bargnani.
    Last edited by Buddahfan; Thu Aug 26th, 2010 at 09:49 PM.
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    “As a captain, I played furiously. I drew a lot of fouls, but I brought everything I had to every practice and to every game. I left everything on the court because I simply wanted the team to win”
    Quote from well known personality who led their high school team to a state championship.

  17. #757
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    Actually i never once compared him to Dirk, so unless you suffer from dyslexia, I'm confused as to why you even brought that up.

    So you claim Bargs will be the third or fourth best player on the team, and consequently the third of fourth option on offence i assume? Care to name who the two or three players are that will surpass him? I'm guessing you're not willing to put your money where your mouth is.

    Finally if summer league isn't a good barometer to measure development, then why do you use it to pump up the "young guns"? I too watched all the games last season, and DeRozan was often a ghost and didn't do half of what he did in the summer.

  18. #758
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Quote Pizzaman wrote: View Post
    mosales hits it squarely on the head with his description of what RuPaul did for anyone else's game but his own...ZERO. Which is why I believe that Bargnani and Amir will actually be a much better pairing with time provided the coach is not stupid. Both are currently unselfish, skilled big men who can see the value in each other and what that means to the team and their own games, so they can prosper together. This could never really happen with that selfish prick RuPaul as everything and everyone was always about making sure he was happy. This team has the abilty to actually be better than they were last year with the right coaching and a little time, and at minimum will be way more fun to watch without that girly haired douchebag RuPaul on our team.
    OT: Steve Nash sighting at the Phoenix - San Antonio WNBA playoff game.

    It is true that Bargnani and Johnson compliment one another.

    However I do think that Davis will prove to a be a better defender than Bargnani and a more efficient scorer. It goes without saying that Davis will be a better rebounder

    The Lakers have proved that you can have two big guys operating on the inside and both of them can be effective.

    So I see Davis and Amir, provided Amir can solve his foul problem, as the two bigs of the Raptors future and not Bargnani and Johnson.

    If Johnson can't solve his foul problem then he will continue to come off the bench and it will be Davis and Bargnani as the starters. I imagine that they could be just as effective if not more so than Johnson and Bargnani once Davis gets some NBA experience under his belt.
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  19. #759
    Raptors Republic Veteran Buddahfan's Avatar
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    Quote johnp wrote: View Post
    Actually i never once compared him to Dirk, so unless you suffer from dyslexia, I'm confused as to why you even brought that up.

    So you claim Bargs will be the third or fourth best player on the team, and consequently the third of fourth option on offence i assume? Care to name who the two or three players are that will surpass him? I'm guessing you're not willing to put your money where your mouth is.

    Finally if summer league isn't a good barometer to measure development, then why do you use it to pump up the "young guns"? I too watched all the games last season, and DeRozan was often a ghost and didn't do half of what he did in the summer.
    Well if Bargs has improved so much what other big would he become comparable to that plays the game similarly. 7' big man who scores with mostly with jump shots and doesn't play much defense.? Or maybe you are saying that the improved Bargnani will only be as good as Okur?

    I never said Bargs would be the 3rd or 4th option on offense. That statement by you shows why you grossly overstate Bargnani's value to the Raptors winning. You are saying well if he is only going to be the 3rd or 4th best it means he must therefore be the 3rd or 4th option on offense. Therefore you are saying in effect, that offense is the only way to measure a players value to a team. That is why you over value Bargnani's value to the Raptors.

    In 09-10 when you look at all forwards and centers who were 6'9" or more and played 1,000 minutes or more there were 94 total players. Bargnani was ranked only 43rd in TS% and 37th in eFG%. Those numbers show that he is not at all very efficient as a scorer.

    In fact among big men Bargnani is only slightly better than average as an efficient scorer..

    It is not the total points you score. It is how many and how efficiently that counts.

    When it comes to rebounding we have already seen that Bargnani is one of the worst rebounders ever for a 7 footer. As I recall only J. Bender (sic) is worse. Even if you lower it 6'10" the number is also pretty bad.

    Of all players in the history of the NBA who were/are 6'10" or taller and played at least 5,000 career minutes Bargnani is the 11th worst all-time in rebounds per 36 minutes. That is just awful. Interestingly enough Turk is 6th worst all-time in rebounds per 36 minutes among players 6'10" or more.

    Now lets look at his defensive rating among the same group of players that we used to look his rebounding. Bargnani has the 6th worst all time defensive rating among this group.

    So clearly I am saying that Bargnani will be only the 3rd or 4th best Raptors player at best based upon his scoring efficiency, rebounding and defense.

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...order_by_asc=Y
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    “As a captain, I played furiously. I drew a lot of fouls, but I brought everything I had to every practice and to every game. I left everything on the court because I simply wanted the team to win”
    Quote from well known personality who led their high school team to a state championship.

  20. #760
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    Quote Buddahfan wrote: View Post
    Well if Bargs has improved so much what other big would he become comparable to that plays the game similarly. 7' big man who scores with mostly with jump shots and doesn't play much defense.? Or maybe you are saying that the improved Bargnani will only be as good as Okur?

    I never said Bargs would be the 3rd or 4th option on offense. That statement by you shows why you grossly overstate Bargnani's value to the Raptors winning. You are saying well if he is only going to be the 3rd or 4th best it means he must therefore be the 3rd or 4th option on offense. Therefore you are saying in effect, that offense is the only way to measure a players value to a team. That is why you over value Bargnani's value to the Raptors.

    In 09-10 when you look at all forwards and centers who were 6'9" or more and played 1,000 minutes or more there were 94 total players. Bargnani was ranked only 43rd in TS% and 37th in eFG%. Those numbers show that he is not at all very efficient as a scorer.

    In fact among big men Bargnani is only slightly better than average as an efficient scorer..

    It is not the total points you score. It is how many and how efficiently that counts.

    When it comes to rebounding we have already seen that Bargnani is one of the worst rebounders ever for a 7 footer. As I recall only J. Bender (sic) is worse. Even if you lower it 6'10" the number is also pretty bad.

    Of all players in the history of the NBA who were/are 6'10" or taller and played at least 5,000 career minutes Bargnani is the 11th worst all-time in rebounds per 36 minutes. That is just awful. Interestingly enough Turk is 6th worst all-time in rebounds per 36 minutes among players 6'10" or more.

    Now lets look at his defensive rating among the same group of players that we used to look his rebounding. Bargnani has the 6th worst all time defensive rating among this group.

    So clearly I am saying that Bargnani will be only the 3rd or 4th best Raptors player at best based upon his scoring efficiency, rebounding and defense.

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...order_by_asc=Y


    I`m still waiting for the two or three players you hold in higher esteem. DeRozan wasn't anything special on defense, nor was Jack. Amir is a below average scorer who gets into foul trouble and Sonny is yet to prove he can be a consistent player. Also, for someone you like to absolutely trash on defence, I believe he was our leader in block shots and arguably our best one on one defender.

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